UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeover'

Finally UK government is helping the moderates in the mosques. This is the only way to kick out fanatics.

Still NRPs should distance themselves from Middle Eastern madness. Both Israelis and Palestinians deserve each other. No matter which side we are on, we as Pakistanis cannot stop the madness either in Iraq or in Palestine.

Arabs don’t want negotiations, so third parties like Pakistanis are simply useless if they side with Arabs.

In fact the association with extremist Arabs will only destroy Pakistanis. We ought to learn from the experience of Jordanians, Syrians, Egyptians, and now Iraqis. Anyone making slogans in favor of Palestinians has ended up utterly defeated and humiliated.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13501930/
Terror-tinged U.K. mosque gets a makeover
Mosque of Hamza, Moussaoui, Reid tries to sever past links to terrorism
By Daniel Strieff
Reporter
MSNBC

Updated: 7:49 a.m. ET July 5, 2006
LONDON — The Finsbury Park mosque, where the one-eyed, hook-handed militant cleric Abu Hamza al-Masri once delivered his fiery sermons and helped turn a religious facility into the target for dozens of international terrorism investigations, is going through a makeover.
During his time at the helm, Hamza, now sitting in a British prison and awaiting possible U.S. extradition, allowed the mosque to become a haven of radical Islam in Europe — a “suicide factory” as one book has called it — which hosted such figures as Zacarias Moussaoui, Richard Reid and, reportedly, three of the four London bombers.
Now, far from being allegedly al-Qaida-linked, the mosque is quietly repairing its reputation from that of a hotbed of radicalism to one of a more moderate institution — albeit a mosque run by a group linked to the fundamentalist Muslim Brotherhood and with an alleged former Hamas commander as a co-trustee.
“This mosque was a national problem, not just a local problem. (In fact) it was an international problem — it wasn’t even a national problem,” said Abdirahman Warsame, the new executive manager of the mosque, now officially named the North Central London Mosque. “Still we are struggling to change the image of the mosque since the extremist group, the Abu Hamza group, was here.”
The Muslim Association of Britain, which is linked to the Muslim Brotherhood, used legal means to gain control of the mosque in 2005 after years of struggle.
“While Abu Hamza was there, it became very much a focal point for radical Islamist activity in Britain,” said Sean O’Neill, who along with a fellow reporter for The Times of London, Daniel McGrory, co-wrote, “The Suicide Factory: Abu Hamza and the Finsbury Park Mosque,” which was published this spring.
“There were plots and links to activities stretching to, I think, 26 countries,” O’Neill added.
Gathering place for moderates?
The new leadership has been working closely with the local community to turn this mosque into a moderate place of worship, with a program of community and social outreach.
“We are here to engage with the young people who have already been — some of them — maybe politicized by the previous group or who have extremist views,” said Warsame, a tall, soft-spoken Somali who was chosen by the Muslim Association of Britain to manage the mosque.
Last week, the same association launched a mosques’ watchdog intended to tackle extremism by monitoring imams and the content of their sermons.
“Instead of young Muslims seeking guidance outside of the mosque, we need to train spiritual leaders to preach the right religion in our mosques,” Ahmad Sheikh, president of the Muslim Association of Britain and one of five co-trustees of the Finsbury park mosque, said.
In Finsbury Park, Warsame brings in different preachers each week to deliver the main Friday sermon — a sharp contrast to the days of Abu Hamza’s absolute control of the mosque.
“We don’t want — how should I say it? — a ‘star imam’ like Abu Hamza. So, they don’t keep a high-profile,” he said.
Still, Warsame echoes common complaints of the British Muslim community that the government is not attentive to its needs.
“The mosque was a national crisis when Abu Hamza was here. Now when Abu Hamza has gone off, and the government sees there is no problem, they just say, ‘Goodbye’.”
Both Sheikh and Warsame pointed out that British Muslims overwhelmingly oppose Prime Minister Tony Blair’s foreign policy — notably in relation to Iraq and the Israeli-Palestinian conflict — and suggested the government should be willing to shoulder some of the blame for the radicalization of Muslim youth.
“We want the government to have a public inquiry as to the real cause of the radicalism among British Muslim youth. Where is it coming from? If it is the mosque, we can do our part. If it is the foreign policy, the government has to do its bit,” Sheikh said.
Takeover of the mosque
The mosque, which opened more than a decade ago in the presence of Prince Charles, stands near the famous old Highbury soccer stadium in a loud, traffic-clogged corner of north London filled with pubs, shops and Middle Eastern cafes.
Although accounts differ on the details, what is clear is that by the late 1990s Hamza and his coterie of followers succeeded in intimidating the former leadership until the cleric became the de facto head of the mosque, answerable to no one.
Hamza is a former bouncer at a London strip club whose physical scars — reportedly suffered while clearing landmines in Afghanistan — made him appear at once sinister and cartoonish.
His militant, rabidly anti-Semitic, sermons attracted a number of young, impressionable Muslims — including shoe-bomber Richard Reid and Zacarias Moussaoui, the so-called 20th hijacker — who would later turn toward terrorism.
When London police raided the mosque in January 2003, they found forged documents, weapons and military equipment.
In February of this year, a British court sentenced Hamza to seven years in prison after he was found guilty of inciting murder and racial hate. The U.S. Department of Justice currently is seeking his extradition on terrorism-related charges.
‘More famous than Mecca’
On a recent summer afternoon, the scene inside the mosque’s wood-paneled, pink and gray carpeted main prayer room, offered a sharp contrast to Hamza’s reign.
Leaders of other faiths in the London borough of Islington, as well as social workers, local government representatives and a police liaison, gathered to discuss such issues as bus routes, charity fundraisers and future conferences.
“We’re happy to do more things together, to have more engagement. I hope we’re moving on” from the Abu Hamza days, said Rev. David Silvester, the dean of the Church of England in the north London borough of Islington.
“This never could have happened before,” said Khalid Oumar, of the Muslim Welfare House, a local community charity.
“We sometimes say that this mosque is more famous than Mecca,” he added, laughing.
Controversy lingers
Still, the mosque seems unable to rid itself entirely of controversy.
Mohammed Kassem Sawalha, one of the five trustees appointed to oversee the mosque and a former president of the Muslim Association of Britain, has been named in U.S. court papers as a former commander of Hamas, the militant Palestinian group.
Contacted by phone by MSNBC.com, Sawalha refused to comment on reports of his past ties to Hamas.
But Sheikh said he was focused on Sawalha’s involvement with the community. “I know him as a member of the MAB and his work as a trustee of the mosque. What he did before, I don’t know about,” Sheikh said.
Hamas, which arose out of the local branch of the Muslim Brotherhood in late 1987, staged its first suicide bombing in 1993. It was officially classified as a terrorist organization in the United States in 1997 and its military wing, the Ezzedin al-Qassam Brigades, was blacklisted by the European Union in 2002. The group now runs the Palestinian Authority in the Gaza Strip and West Bank.
“I am aware of the background, but if I took the view that I’m not working with this or that person I’d end up spending my whole life in my office,” Barry Norman, a London police officer working with the mosque’s trustees, told The Times last year.
Under the new regime, attendance has more than tripled for the Friday sermon, said Warsame, and the bottom two floors are being renovated to host weddings, parties and youth events for locals of all faiths.
But, looming over the mosque and its new occupants, is the question of what happened to the hundreds of young men — many with an unswerving devotion to Hamza — who sat on the street where the cleric delivered his acerbic sermons after being locked out of the mosque in 2003?
“That’s the thing. Where have they gone? I think of it like Afghanistan after the war started there. It’s like stamping on a termite’s nest — they just scatter,” O’Neill, co-author of “The Suicide Factory,” said.
But wherever they are, Warsame said they are no longer a menace to this mosque.
“Abu Hamza’s followers — most of them — used to come from outside of London,” he said. “Now since Abu Hamza has been jailed, I don’t know where they went. We don’t see any of them at the mosque. They don’t come here.”

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeover'

Your title implies that majority of mosques in UK have fanatic imams. Can you please enlighten us with some facts and figures as to how many mosques are there and what %age of these mosques have fanatical imams and what is your definition of a fanatical imams? How many Abu Hamza's are in UK jails. Generalising is a dangerous trend. Not everyone is a mullah or leftie.

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeover'

^

I wonder if 'anti' is on someone's pay-roll. He is the resident propaganda puppet.

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeover'

This is not complicated process. The West encouraged the fanatics for many years. The clock is now swinging back.

Muslim intellectuals were clueless when the West was funding (or turning blind eye to) the fanatics.

Muslims intellectuals are equally clueless now that fanatics are being wiped out slowly.

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeover'

your a tit as usual. I blame the Pakis for fundingm training Taliban which was the hornets nest of terrorism. Only now has it started to turn it's back to these fanatics even then half heartidly.

You obviously Have a think for hating Muslims in the UK. How many times have you been to a UK mosque?

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeov


Well you are right on risc. Pakistanis are responsible for many aspects of situation that we have at our hands.

There are many mosques in UK where Pakistani Imams spew hate from the pulpit. However the UK, US, and Canandian mosques with Arab / Egyptian Imams are the worst. Mullahs like Bukri, Musri, and Hindi are the prime examples of ignorance, arrogance, hate, and prejudice that results in fanatic actions by the followers of such imams.

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeov

How many of these mosques have you personally visited yourself? My guess is zero. When or If you ever get a green card, i suggest you visit a few of these yourself and get the first hand knowledge instead of relying on a few articles that you read on the intenet.

I can assue you there are no such mosques in US, at least, spewing such hatred. Like ehsan suggested, dont generalize based on something that you only read.

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeover'

In the UK been one mosque - Finsbury Park and that was only becuase it was only becuase the militants took it by storm. The trustees bizarily had no power to evict them. Somehow you equate that with every mosque.

I ask the question again, How many UK mosques have you been to?

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeover'

come'on guys, give him some time, google isn't so specialised yet :D

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeov

5abi and Risc, I accept your argument that one mosque could be a statistical aberration.

Nothing personal against you two. I am sure both of you were brought up in liberal, and enlightened households. And your local mosque is run by pro-democracy, pro-women, and progress oriented imams. So take heart that RCMP, or FBI, or MI5 is not going going to come by for a midnight knock.

However during my visits to mosques in major US, UK, and Canadian cities like DC, NY, Chicago, LA, London, and Toronto etc. i have heard the lose talk by Imams, and $tupid comments by different members. It is a big if as any one of thsoe "radicals" will do anything bad. However extrapolation based on current affairs do not look good.

Bottom line is that I’m glad some communities are kicking the Jahil Imams out of their mosques.

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeover'

^^ Yeah we kicked a jahil neem mullah out of our community a few years ago, was upto his usual fitna being imported exclusively from South Africa by the Stanford University and its zionist funders to revamp the sharia and fiqh...the manner in which the whole community stood upto his hogwash was awe inspiring...it is a miracle he made out alive....

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeov

Mosques are for spritual awakening.
Mosques are not meant to have dungal (wrestling) matches between Arab lackeys and Zionist supporters.

Do Allah Allah man! Do Allah Allah. Leave this international poly-ticks alone. It is way beyond your reach or analytical power.

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeover'

I dont know if you have ever been to a Pakistani mosque but ever friday is full of anti US propoganda spouting out of those loud speakers. Maybe you should look home first.

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeov

we have freedom of speech in pakistan

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeover'

and?

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeover'


Read your OWN messages to antiobl, how many mosques in Pakistan have you been to? Looks like someone is preaching something he doesn't practice himself.

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeover'

whatever talibani. what are you trying to suggest? spit it out and FYI I;ve been to many paki moques so

So you support attacks on Pakistan troops?

NOTE: Refrain from badmouthing.

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeover'


Listen, and listen good. I have been to many mosques in Pakistan too but didn't hear the crap you are talking about, bottomline is that just as you told antiobl there are mosques which may be talking about anti-US sh!t but not all of them.

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeover'

so yu support attacks by taliban and co on Pakistan troops?

Re: UK mosques slowly moving away from fanatic Imams: Terror-tinged UK mosque 'madeover'


If it is in Afghanistan then yes!