Twin Blasts rock Karachi

Re: Twin Blasts rock Karachi

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Actually I am completely against anyone calling anyone kaafir if that person believes on basic tenets of Islam.** **No one really knows who is right and who is wrong.
**
One can label anyone Khwarjis and Takfeeris, terrorist, etc. and then tries to justify their killings. A very bad practice.

My first point was based on what I see is whenever these kind of crimes occur the knee-jerk response is to start looking for who did it and possible blame on one group or other.

Unfortunately neither the crimes are stopping, nor the blame game is.

There is a circle on which people keep going again and again.

Ultimately it is the responsibility of security agencies to find and punish culprits and that is the key to solutions of all such problems. One can blame other all one wants until the cows come home, the problem is in lack of security and administration not doing its assigned work.


A side note on Khwarjis:
**
Khwarjis were wrong and absolutely wrong in calling others kaafir and their extreme or hateful ideology is not what Islam preaches.**

But not everyone who calls other Kaafir is Khwarji. It takes more than that to be called a Khwarji.

Idiots belong to every group and this is how they do their business. They just need to be caught and tried for spreading hate.

No one really knows who uses such a sofisticated and high amount of explosives against civilians and I do not think anyone after listening to these idiots and Jaahil so called religious people will just go and start killing people randomly. It takes a whole lot than that.


As to the definition: Khwarjis means those who went out. (Not those who were thrown out).

They were political forces and fought against majority Muslims including against Hazrat Ali RA and others for their strict and wrongful interpretations but still there are people from that group called **Ibadis **living in certain parts of ME and they are NOT called non-Muslims.


Point three was based on your takfiri act. Very similar to those takfiris who try to justify others to be killed…“without any due process”.

**One cannot justify killing anyone after calling those “Kaafir”. No one!
**
That is the take home message.

Re: Twin Blasts rock Karachi

No, one cannot label anyone Khwarjees, because for a group to be Khwarjees, they must be doing takfeer, and then using that takfeer as excuse to harm, terrorise, abuse and kill Muslims.

Since these people causes fitna (Killing and mayhem) due to their beliefs, they should be fought and killed (as far as Islam is concerned).

Crime is not stopping because some people are blind and could not see that a group of Khwarjees are practicing their religion of terrorising and killing Muslims after declaring them ‘Kafir’.

These blind people want to negotiate with Khwarjees not to kill, and that is like, someone wanting to negotiating with Muslims that not to fast and pray salaat. To even think of such negotiation is idiocy, as … A Muslim would never give up … or would never negotiate on ‘fasting’ and ‘praying Salaat (Namaz)’. Same way a Khwarjee would never give up takfeer and then using that as excuse would never give up killing Muslims.

So, solution is only one, and that is, to fight them and send them to Jahannum, so that Muslims these Khwarjees terrorising can live peacefully.

It is very unlikely that security agencies, administration, and law enforcement agencies could tackle such problem where a group considers their religious duty to kill after doing takfeer.

You are right, that is, doing ‘takfeer’ alone does not make a person ‘Khwarjee’ but makes a person ‘Takfeeri’ and Takeeries are sinner … as good as ‘Kafir’ but still, not Khwarjees, and thus there is no jihad against them (because they are not harming anyone physically). Their judgement is in the hands of Allah on judgment day.

Anyhow, Khwarjees are those who do takfeer and uses that takfeer as excuse to harm, terrorise and kill Muslims. These people are not only ‘out of Islam’ but Muslims should fight and kill them too, as if they would not do that, then these Khwajees would keep killing them (Muslims).

Here you are showing dishonesty. Everyone knows who are using sophisticated high explosives materials to attack and kill Muslims, as they are Khwarjees who proudly accept their killings too, as what they do (Kill innocent Muslims), they do that as part of their religious duty (Just like Muslims would fast in Ramadhan or do their daily Salaat).

Right … as far as I know, Khwarjee means: those who left Islam (thrown out or went out does not matter).

You are partly right. Most Omanis are Ibadis (a Islamic sect). As far as I know, Ibadis are neither Takfeeries nor Khwarjees. The only similarity with Khwarjees and Ibadis is that, Ibadis accept some of the Islamic interpretations of Khwarjees as correct, what other Muslim sects do not consider correct. That is all.

Again either you are showing dishonesty or misquoting what I ever wrote.

I did not call anyone Kafir who is Muslim. I only called people ‘Khwarjees’ who do takfeer and use that takfeer as excuse to kill Muslims … and I believe that Muslims should do same with present day Khwarjees what Ali (RA) did with Khwarjees of his time, that is, wage Jihad against them and send them to Jahannum.

You know what? It is belief of Ibadis that Ali (RA) should not have killed Khwarjees (as Ibadis consider them Muslims). It seems your belief is same as Ibadis, that is, Ali (RA) should not have killed Khwarjees … nor you want present day Muslims to wage jihad against Khwarjees … as probably you consider Khwarjees are Muslims what Ibadis do (I do not know).

Re: Twin Blasts rock Karachi

With utmost humbleness, I disagree with many of your points.

You are connecting those idiots who call others kaafir to mass killings which needs to be proved.

A fake mullah calls other Kaafir does not mean that fake Mullah is asking innocent people to be killed. Those are simply people who are religiously misguided andthink they are the best of all.

Unless criminals are caught and tried openly, it is not wise to keep speculating.

I am not going to keep talking about Khwarjis. But those were political more than religious issues for which war was waged. Those people did not only have problems with Hazrat Ali RA, they also had issues with Hazrat Usman RA . Ibadis are from that lineage.

Khwarjis did not leave Islam according to them. They just fought against Khalifas who were followed by majority Muslims of that time, based on "their interpretation of Islam". Subtle but big difference. Even today they consider themselves Muslims.

I will just point out third time what you wrote in red. Very similar to what takfiris do and justify killings.

Please think again.

Lastly, it is absolutely the responsibility of Govt. to find out and catch criminals regardless of who they are and people should focus on that, rather than blaming one group or other among themselves, associating them to Khwarjis etc. without knowing the real culprits.... and promoting more hatred.

Re: Twin Blasts rock Karachi

^^^I think you do not know why those Ali (RA) fought are called Khwarjees?

It was nothing to do with politics, but it was to do with interpretation of Islam and then harming or killing Muslims on that basis. Khwarjees never had political ambition neither ever showed political ambition.

Actually, what happened is that, Ali (RA) was on his way towards Syria with his army when he heard that a group of around 12000 men [people who revolted from Ali (RA) army … again on interpretation of Islam and not politics] have started killing people in around Kufa (using their interpretation of Islam), and thus Ali (RA) returned to stop their fitna. Ali (RA) initiated talk with them. He told them that their interpretation of Islam was wrong, with examples.

After realising their mistake, most left the group. Anyhow, around 1800 stayed in the group and kept adamant sticking with their religious interpretations. It is these 1800 Khwarjees with whom Ali (RA) fought and most got killed (what I remember, only 5 escaped).

So, Khwarjees are nothing to do with politics but everything is about religious interpretation and using that interpretation to harm other Muslims. Only difference between Khwarjees and Muslim sects is that, Muslims sects may consider other sects as deviant, misguided or whatever, but would not do takfeer (though some individuals amongst the sect might even do takfeer) and certainly would not use their interpretation of Islam to harm or kill other Muslims (this only Khwarjees do).

Re: Twin Blasts rock Karachi

Saleem Bhai, I do not think I could be any clear than what I said earlier that Khwarjis were wrong.

There is no support for them from me knowing what I know from reading about them.

Just to be correct historically, I said it was more of a political rather than religious conflict. Does not mean there was not a religious conflict. For example they did not believe in head of the state philosophy and said only Allah is the ruler. Also they did not believe in Quresh being superior. Also, they were the one who did not fight at War of Siffin but were angry at Hazrat Ali RA accepting the truce.

Anyhow, I really did not want to discuss any further about them. That is history.

On current day who do you think is** like Hazrat Ali RA or Hazrat Usman RA **which your "Khwarjis" are fighting against?


One can make boogiemen like Khwarjis related to any group of disliking and blame every ill on them today. That is not a good practice.

The missing link in the event being discussed in this thread here is, between calling someone kaafir ....and killing innocents. These could very well be two different/separate groups of people.

Regardless, whoever they are **should be caught **ALIVE first to be exposed and there should not be any speculations as to who these culprits are or blame someone after that person is killed who cannot even refute the blame.

Re: Twin Blasts rock Karachi

http://dawncompk.files.wordpress.com/2013/03/rangers-raid-karachi-weapons-app-116.jpg?w=116

		 				[Abbas Town bombing culprits arrested in Karachi, says police](http://dawn.com/2013/03/14/abbas-town-bombing-culprits-arrested-in-karachi-says-police/)
			Police claimed to have arrested six Pakistani Taliban militants and  recovered a large quantity of explosives from their possession.

Re: Twin Blasts rock Karachi

I was thinking that this capture is another BS from police. But a reliable source told me that this guy really was involved in arranging and making the bomb which was used.

Main thing is that they get the punishment they deserve instead of let go by courts.

Re: Twin Blasts rock Karachi

Ustad -e - mohatram syed Sibt-e- Jafar was brutally killed this afternoon - All colleges across Karachi will remain closed tomorrow in act of mourning

Re: Twin Blasts rock Karachi

^ who was he?

Re: Twin Blasts rock Karachi

It is really very sad .
He was principle Govt Degree College Liaqatabad and a known literary Personality .
Killers are same ASWJ and associates .
EDITED TO QUOTE THE LINK
College principal gunned down in Karachi

Re: Twin Blasts rock Karachi

He once said :

Hai gulumi -e- alay Nabi ka samar
Muj ko Ustad kehtay haiN hai ahl-e-nazar
Is mein hayraaT hai Kia Sab mo Maloom hai
haR bara admi uN se mansoob hai

He was an educationist , poet , humanitarian - we Pakistanis don't know what we have lost today !

He was a grade 20 government officer - who had a motor bike for traveling - this statement can alone elaborate his honesty and dedication towards the nation

Re: Twin Blasts rock Karachi

News update on Abbas Town massacre. Police claims to have arrested the suspect.

Abbas Town bombing culprits arrested in Karachi, says police | Pakistan | DAWN.COM

KARACHI: Karachi police claim to have arrested six Pakistani Taliban militants involved in the Abbas Town blasts which killed more than 50 people earlier in the month, DawnNews reported.
Police said the suspects were arrested on a tip-off from spy agencies and a large quantity of explosives was recovered from them.

Speaking to media representatives on Thursday, senior police official Shahid Hayat said police first took into custody two members of the banned Tehrik-i-Taliban Pakistan (TTP), Khairdeen and Ishaq, after an encounter in Karachi’s Sea View area.
Both suspects made intriguing revelations upon which, Hayat said, police raided Khuda ki Basti in Surjani Town and nabbed four of their accomplices.
He claimed the arrested belong to the TTP and were involved in the Abbas Town blasts which destroyed several apartments and shops and also injured around 200 people on March 3. TTP’s spokesman Ehsanullah Ehsan however had denied involvementof his organisation in the incident.

Re: Twin Blasts rock Karachi

Rangers and police have been doing consistent raids and operations in various areas in the city. This has improved the no. of daily killings and prevented major tragedies like Abbas Town. Extortion cases are down as well.
Nevertheless, due to their efforts, rangers and police are now themselves the target of terrorists.

This relative improvement in security situation happened right after the government was disoolved. This shows that it was the government that was responsible for inaction against terrorism in the city.

I think the major hubs of Talibanic terrorism in the city are: Manghopir, Quarry colony, Pakhtunabad, Sohrab goth (Al-Asif Square), and Orangi Town.