can someone please explain to me why people still support convicted criminals?
re: To better understand the Pakistani psyche
Bond of brothers Or Bond of Criminals . Today they will save his a$$ and tomorrow he will save them .
re: To better understand the Pakistani psyche
firstly, most of the people you say have been convicted were either never convicted or even if they were convicted, the trial proceedings were shady to the least. go look up how that scum Qayyum convicted BB and Zardari. that toad's character (or lack of it) is worthy of being recorded in history in bold letters for his sheer lack of shame and self respect.
but that's not why people support them. the reason why I support them is because they head large political parties. I understand you hate Zardari (I'm not a fan of the person either) but what do you think would seriously happen if he was removed or God forbid killed? what would happen to the PPP? and if the PPP falls apart, what would be the impact on Pakistan? the impact on Sindh? anarchy... the PPP is the only party that has the reach of credibility among these parties to better the relations between Balochistan and the federation.
similarly, what would happen in Punjab if NS or SS were removed? did you see the protests that took place when Shahbaz's govt was dismissed? and the ppl who showed up to the protests weren't bussed in for money like they used to be in Musharraf's time.
point is that there are ppl who believe in them. a lot of people who think that these parties and their leaders represent them and their voice... depriving these people of their voice would cause a lot of damage to the country, imo.
on a personal note, the performance of these parties is obviously not optimal. but I think that they do a much better job than they get credit for. and these parties are essential for the survival of the country.
re: To better understand the Pakistani psyche
The swiss courts convicted Zardari and Benazir Bhutto. The Sharifs are just as corrupt. So are the Choundhries. Each one of these families has looted the country blind yet people still support them. That is pathetic on the part of the people of Pakistan.
There is no concept of assassination or removal of governmennt in my eyes. What I want to understand is why people defend them? Why they make excuses for them? Why they pay homage to them as if they are the last thing holding Pakistan together. Pakistan is held together by its people and its communities. Not by one dictator or another even in democractic colors.
re: To better understand the Pakistani psyche
Because corruption is a way of life for millions and millions in our country and its befitting that our rulers be corrupt as well.
People vote for the corrupt bcoz they solve people's problem by corruption. They get jobs for their voters by bypassing teh merit. They get the criminals released from police stations, they get their sons and daughters admitted to coleges by using their influence.
re: To better understand the Pakistani psyche
samb
Punjab will be fine even if NS or SS are removed.
The swiss courts convicted Zardari and Benazir Bhutto. The Sharifs are just as corrupt. So are the Choundhries. Each one of these families has looted the country blind yet people still support them. That is pathetic on the part of the people of Pakistan.
fair enough.
my counterpoint then is that everyone is corrupt in Pakistan. the army is corrupt, the judiciary is corrupt, the bureaucracy is corrupt, the media is corrupt as well. so, what is the obsession with politicians?
Sharifs are not clean. Chaudries are not either. and Zardari is not either. but on the NRO issue, there were supposed to be less than a 100 politicians on the list from a total of 8500. so, why the obsession with politicians and their corruption? our generals are billionaires. the media tycoons are billionaires. our judges are super rich as well. so, what is the single minded focus on the corruption of politicians?
is it because politicians are easy to hate? is it because they do a really poor job at their PR? is it because the army does a really good job of demonizing politicians?
[quote]
There is no concept of assassination or removal of governmennt in my eyes. What I want to understand is why people defend them? Why they make excuses for them? Why they pay homage to them as if they are the last thing holding Pakistan together. Pakistan is held together by its people and its communities. Not by one dictator or another even in democractic colors.
[/QUOTE]
while that is true, that is also a cliche. what can you and I do to convince Bramdagh Bugti to give up his arms? if you and I go there taking a message of peace, chances are we will be killed... the only way to bring the Baloch rebels back into the fold is through political process... and that will only come through political parties - aka PPP and PML-N.
take something as simple as the restoration of the judiciary movement. that was a simple issue. doesn't get any more black and white than that. that had to be done. but what did the ppl/civil society etc accomplish on their own? not much. it took the clout of a political party to accomplish what was common sense and should have been done a long time ago.
so, I appreciate the extremely important role of political parties and the need for healthy and vibrant political parties that people own. healthy parties mean a strong Pakistan.
firstly, most of the people you say have been convicted were either never convicted or even if they were convicted, the trial proceedings were shady to the least. go look up how that scum Qayyum convicted BB and Zardari. that toad's character (or lack of it) is worthy of being recorded in history in bold letters for his sheer lack of shame and self respect.
but that's not why people support them. the reason why I support them is because they head large political parties. I understand you hate Zardari (I'm not a fan of the person either) but what do you think would seriously happen if he was removed or God forbid killed? what would happen to the PPP? and if the PPP falls apart, what would be the impact on Pakistan? the impact on Sindh? anarchy... the PPP is the only party that has the reach of credibility among these parties to better the relations between Balochistan and the federation.
similarly, what would happen in Punjab if NS or SS were removed? did you see the protests that took place when Shahbaz's govt was dismissed? and the ppl who showed up to the protests weren't bussed in for money like they used to be in Musharraf's time.
point is that there are ppl who believe in them. a lot of people who think that these parties and their leaders represent them and their voice... depriving these people of their voice would cause a lot of damage to the country, imo.
on a personal note, the performance of these parties is obviously not optimal. but I think that they do a much better job than they get credit for. and these parties are essential for the survival of the country.
where was the power of NS or SS when they left the country for eight years
signing a contract with the dictator?
problem with us pakistanis are that we are always acting like ostrich.
we see only what we want to.
Pakistan politics is all establishment. whenver and however they want they
can throw away anyone. History has proven it again n again
Need I say more?
samb Punjab will be fine even if NS or SS are removed.
is that why civil officers were refusing to obey the orders of the interim govt? is that why there were signs of civil disobedience the last time SS was removed from office?
sure, things didn't get violent like they do in Sindh. and I'm not saying Punjab was going to burst in flames. but I think people who are popular should rule as per election results. and it is a fact that PML-N is the most popular party in Punjab.
where was the power of NS or SS when they left the country for eight years
signing a contract with the dictator?
problem with us pakistanis are that we are always acting like ostrich.
we see only what we want to.
Pakistan politics is all establishment. whenver and however they want they
can throw away anyone. History has proven it again n again
Need I say more?
yes, you do need to say more.
tell me that if they left the country for a decade, then how did the PPP and PML-N still end up coming out as the most popular parties in the country? what happened to the dictator's pet party?
what happened in Bangladesh after they threw out the political parties there? who did the voters vote back in power in the elections?
you are right though. we are ostriches. Awami League was denied its rightful position and mandate. the result was Bangladesh. so, lets deny PPP or PML-N or ANP their deserved seats/power and lets see more Bangladeshs form.
re: To better understand the Pakistani psyche
Samb am I discussing the NRO? Nope. So please stop your fixation on the matter and move on to other things.
Now the political elite are the ones chosen by the people and they rob the country blind. Yet people on this forum still support them. I have yet to see an answer why. I see excuses like Oh everybody does it. Here is my response:
Various militaries have taken power in third world countries for the sake of stability. They have done so in Latin American, Africa and Asia. So it is perfectly fine for the Pakistan military to do so.
Such stupidity is nothing more than the antics of a jahil. The sad thing I see is that people rather support an immoral and unislamic act because of some subservinent slave type mentality to a specific political party be it PPP or PML.
If people want army to take over the government and state affairs, does that go against democracy?
I believe that there has to be a painful revolution and complete breakdown of civil society and its currupt systems/proceedures/departments/practices. the distribution of wealth has to be more even.
everything has to be rebuilt by Pakistanis themselves, rather than what angrez left behind. they have to make laws, government departments, programs and proceedures and policies. then and only then will there be respect for law, procedures, regulations and policies.
no one has got any faith left in the current system.
can someone please explain to me why people still support convicted criminals?
because they dont think its a crime as they would do same if were in a position as most amongst us are morally corrupt when it comes to money and dont care how it had come unless its coming.
can someone please explain to me why people still support convicted criminals?
I think corruption runs very deep in our society, starting from a sweeper and going all the way to our glorious rulers unfortunately everyone considers it a norm rather than exception.
This is sad!
re: To better understand the Pakistani psyche
[note]Personal comments removed.
Cool it yaar[/note]