TIPS - Invasion of privacy? (MERGED)

A new site from the American Civil Liberties Union condemns the US government’s new scheme, the Terrorist Information and Prevention System, as a way of “relying on untrained civilians to spy”, reports Wired. The ACLU worries that Tips, which is expected to launch in the autumn, will single out certain groups and compile a database of ‘suspicious’ individuals without giving people a chance to prove their innocence.

http://www.aclu.org/graphics/guy.jpg

LINKS:

Personally, i think this is a case of invasion of privacy by your fellow citizens. We already have NSA and other federal agencies tapping into people’s private lives and creating databases etc - which is fine to some extent, but now if this TIPS is put into effect, we will have these ordinary
citizen spying on ppl and who knows they may have a grudge or two against you or or may not like your skin color or ethnic background and may ruin your life, career etc in the land of liberty.

No datebase is to be kept, or so Ashcroft says.

http://www.fcw.com/fcw/articles/2002/0729/news-tips-07-29-02.asp

Along the same lines,
“The Terror of Pre-Crime”
http://www.progressive.org/sept02/hen0902.html

“John Ashcroft recently released his guidelines for investigating people he suspects as terrorists, and these guidelines exceed even J. Edgar Hoover’s contempt for due process.
…”

Well worth the read - I would appreciate comments from US residents. How do they react to this? Does not concern them? The govt. has no other option? …

Awam:

My reaction is that the article you linked to represents the typical drivel of the ultra-left wing of US politics.

The author claims the "wholly or in part" language "could apply to political action (and the reaction) during demonstrations by environmentalists, anti-globalizationists, animal rights pickets, or union members on strike, as well as pro-lifers trying to talk, and only to talk, to women entering abortion clinics ("obstruction" at clinics can be a federal crime)."

The only way that language could apply to such activities is if the people involved in the demonstrations plan on advancing their cause "wholly or in part through activities that involve force or violence and a federal crime." I repeat, "ACTIVITIES THAT INVOLVE FORCE OR VIOLENCE AND A FEDERAL CRIME." Frankly, the tree huggers who plant life endangering traps in logging country, anti-abortionists who bomb abortion clinics, and anti-globalizationists who riot and cause massive property damage in Seattle and elsewhere deserve increased law enforcement activities directed their way.

Next, the author finds it dangerous that the "reasonable indication" standard will be used to start investigations rather than the higher "probable cause" standard. I point out that "probable cause" is a standard used in American criminal law to ARREST someone for a crime NOT to start an investigation. Every criminal investigation of someone starts from something less than "probable cause". When you reach "probable cause", you arrest that person and charge him with the crime.

Next, the author whines about a member of a group being held responsible for what other members of the group may say or do. "Hello. Earth to Author. Anybody home up there?" This is currently the law with respect to "conspiracy" in the US. A member of the conspiracy is liable for the misdeeds and actions of others in the conspiracy.

Finally, he holds Frank Church up for obvious reverance. Virtually every left of center, center or right of center politician in this country acknowledges that it was Frank Church and his committee that emasculated the US intelligence services to such a degree that we have suffered massive intelligence failures including some that may be responsible for 9/11.

US planning to recruit one in 24 Americans as citizen spies

US planning to recruit one in 24 Americans as citizen spies
By Ritt Goldstein
July 15 2002

The Bush Administration aims to recruit millions of United States citizens as domestic informants in a program likely to alarm civil liberties groups.

The Terrorism Information and Prevention System, or TIPS, means the US will have a higher percentage of citizen informants than the former East Germany through the infamous Stasi secret police. The program would use a minimum of 4 per cent of Americans to report “suspicious activity”.

Civil liberties groups have already warned that, with the passage earlier this year of the Patriot Act, there is potential for abusive, large-scale investigations of US citizens.

As with the Patriot Act, TIPS is being pursued as part of the so-called war against terrorism. It is a Department of Justice project.

Highlighting the scope of the surveillance network, TIPS volunteers are being recruited primarily from among those whose work provides access to homes, businesses or transport systems. Letter carriers, utility employees, truck drivers and train conductors are among those named as targeted recruits.

A pilot program, described on the government Web site www.citizencorps.gov, is scheduled to start next month in 10 cities, with 1 million informants participating in the first stage. Assuming the program is initiated in the 10 largest US cities, that will be 1 million informants for a total population of almost 24 million, or one in 24 people.

Historically, informant systems have been the tools of non-democratic states. According to a 1992 report by Harvard University’s Project on Justice, the accuracy of informant reports is problematic, with some informants having embellished the truth, and others suspected of having fabricated their reports.

Present Justice Department procedures mean that informant reports will enter databases for future reference and/or action. The information will then be broadly available within the department, related agencies and local police forces. The targeted individual will remain unaware of the existence of the report and of its contents.

The Patriot Act already provides for a person’s home to be searched without that person being informed that a search was ever performed, or of any surveillance devices that were implanted.

At state and local levels the TIPS program will be co-ordinated by the Federal Emergency Management Agency, which

was given sweeping new powers, including internment, as part of the Reagan Administration’s national security initiatives. Many key figures of the Reagan era are part of the Bush Administration.

The creation of a US “shadow government”, operating in secret, was another Reagan national security initiative.

Ritt Goldstein is an investigative journalist and a former leader in the movement for US law enforcement accountability. He has lived in Sweden since 1997, seeking political asylum there, saying he was the victim of life-threatening assaults in retaliation for his accountability efforts. His application has been supported by the European Parliament, five of Sweden’s seven big political parties, clergy, and Amnesty and other rights groups.

Comment:

Oh dear i thought the communist regimes only did such things. It seems the Americans are going down the same road of thought control of their population. We the muslims challenge the ideas upon which the west is established e.g secularism, democracy, freedom and free market economic policies. Its better to convince people of the Islamic ideas and the contradictions within the non-Islamic ideas as opposed to ruling them by force.

hahahahaha, just brilliant. There’s never a dull moment with the US. :hehe:

http://www.gupistan.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=69710

Invasion of privacy indeed. This is like childhood fantasies of being a spy coming true. I can foresee widespead abuse.

MV, you need not worry, TIPS would primarily be used against Muslims. Your role would be to report "suspicious" looking people such as anyone with Middle Eastern origin.

hey so i have a way to serve my country and community. We get rid of the extremist and closet extremists .. better for the country and better for the community.

sign me up.

In hushed voice...

Yes, yes I can identify him!

He is large tall, coming down the street at me, and he looks like the,

STA PUFF marshmallow man!

What a bunch of whack jobs will be calling in, good luck...

oh man, i can just imagine the types of calls they would get. oh well, time to go the michael jackson route and become white :D

^ cool, so canadians can apply too :)