Re: TI Report: Musharraf liquidated Islamabad farmland
i dont understand this. how was the land valued at $690k and converted to $10.34 million? either it was valued improperly or Musharraf somehow added a lot of value.
and is this akin to the practice of giving army officers land like the askari apartments which they then sell off?
Did you know all the people above, or most of them are Musharraf's croonies? Are you forgetting who Tariq Azeem is?
I'm answering a question. Don't get too excited. First look at the list of people who got this land and sold it.
Compared to the Sharif bratharan's extensive corruption, this small and unproven that it is illegal transaction is a non issue.
i dont understand this. how was the land valued at $690k and converted to $10.34 million? either it was valued improperly or Musharraf somehow added a lot of value.
and is this akin to the practice of giving army officers land like the askari apartments which they then sell off?
Mush wasn't given this land. He bought it from people who were "given" this land. And how he converted this into 10.31 mil in liquid assets is a mystery that the accusers can't seem to explain.
Re: TI Report: Musharraf liquidated Islamabad farmland
^ did he give that land to people for 690K then sell it for 10.31 million?
the only reason why someone would sell land to him for 690k that he can later sell for 15-20 times more is if they got it illegally.
Re: TI Report: Musharraf liquidated Islamabad farmland
"According to the list, General Pervez Musharraf purchased a five-acre plot from the daughter-in-law of Sardar Abdul Rab Nishtar in 2003. Ms Riffat Jamil, wife of Jameel Nishtar had bought this farm to launch her own poultry and vegetable business from a certain Hasan Qureshi who was actually allotted this plot by the CDA in 1979. General Musharraf got this plot on November 4, 2003 from Ms Riffat Nishtar. The price of the plot is not mentioned."
Interestingly none of these details are included in the TI news article.
For the increasingly difficult-to-read Pakistan military, this deal, which Bhutto’s return today highlights, spells salvation, continuity and prosperity. Since Musharraf came to power in 1999, the armed services have acquired spectacular wealth, investing in everything from the asphalt people drive on, to the petrol they put in their tanks. They also control the equivalent to 12% of the total landmass of Pakistan, of which only 70,000 acres is set aside for military facilities. The other 12m acres have been turned into private farmland and individual estates for Musharraf’s key generals, making them millionaires. Musharraf, too. Although he officially lives for free in Army House, in Rawalpindi, on a salary of $1,400 a month, he has somehow acquired a real-estate portfolio worth $10m.
This is not something Mush started. It’s been like this for the army for a long time.
Re: TI Report: Musharraf liquidated Islamabad farmland
^ which makes Mush just another corrupt army general that needs to be excoriated and weeded out.
^ which makes Mush just another corrupt army general that needs to be excoriated and weeded out.
Weed out what? That's the system in place for the army, I bet Kayani has done the same. You'll have to destroy the institution if you want change on that level. It's almost like telling people not to pirate CDs.
I'm answering a question. Don't get too excited. First look at the list of people who got this land and sold it.
Compared to the Sharif bratharan's extensive corruption, this small and unproven that it is illegal transaction is a non issue.
So everythign needs to be compared to sharif brothers? Sharifs were rich, before they even came to power, but this army general seems to have amassed alot of money which an honest General cant even think of.
Weed out what? That's the system in place for the army, I bet Kayani has done the same. You'll have to destroy the institution if you want change on that level. It's almost like telling people not to pirate CDs.
right.. dont pirate CDs... dont scam the country for $10m. same thing.
whats the matter Khek... you used to rail against the excesses of the army once upon a time, including them taking over every facet of civilian life.
why does it seem like pirating CDs for you now that Mush is concerned?
^ did he give that land to people for 690K then sell it for 10.31 million?
the only reason why someone would sell land to him for 690k that he can later sell for 15-20 times more is if they got it illegally.
Correct, it was acquired illegally, at a ridiculously subsidized price (which again wasnt paid by him either). These lavish farmhouses houses make F-10, E-7 houses look like peanuts.
right.. dont pirate CDs... dont scam the country for $10m. same thing.
whats the matter Khek... you used to rail against the excesses of the army once upon a time, including them taking over every facet of civilian life.
why does it seem like pirating CDs for you now that Mush is concerned?
That was before I fully realized the real threat from jihadis and taliban. If that situation did not exist, I would still be for dismantling the current army and establishment. But after seeing Iraq aftermath, I picked on the lesser of the 2 evils for right now. As I keep saying, if things were black and white like in the land of ifti, this would be easier.
And I still don't know how this is illegal within the current army dealings or how did we get to this 10 mil figure.
Re: TI Report: Musharraf liquidated Islamabad farmland
what does fighting jihadies and taliban have to do with multi million dollar corruption Khek? are you telling me that unless we give away multi million dollar sums to the valiant Mushie we will be unable to fight jihadies?
what does fighting jihadies and taliban have to do with multi million dollar corruption Khek? are you telling me that unless we give away multi million dollar sums to the valiant Mushie we will be unable to fight jihadies?
Simple, if you bothered to read my post. Apparently Mush bought and sold land and made a profit like so many others in the army do.
To get rid of this system, you have to dismantle the army and establishment from top to bottom. It is part of their mentality. But doing so creates a vacuum, which is not needed right now in Pakistan. Do you need further clarification?
And while the army holds 12% of all land, how much land do you think the Sharif's, Bhuttos, and other chaudries, waderas, sardars etc. hold between them? Feudal land probably accounts for majority of rural land in Pakistan. A lot more than 12%.
Re: TI Report: Musharraf liquidated Islamabad farmland
you dont have to "dismantle" the army. just make an example out of a few of the corrupt upper layer (90% of the corruption in terms of real-value is done by 2% of the army) and the rest will fall in place. musharraf is effectively neutered, and his role in whatever fighting is going on ranges from minimal to.. well... non existent. Since he isnt likely to effect any proceedings on the ground, let us start with him.
this jihadi thing could be with us for a while. until then do you propose encouraging unfettered corruption?
you dont have to "dismantle" the army. just make an example out of a few of the corrupt upper layer (90% of the corruption is done by 2% of the army) and the rest will fall in place.
this jihadi thing could be with us for a while. until then do you propose encouraging unfettered corruption?
Sorry, that's not going to work, but nothing wrong with trying. It's like controlling piracy or tax evasion in Pakistan. You can put people in jail, but you won't get rid of that mentality until the society and it's perception changes. For that you need a complete and sudden overhaul or a long wait for education to set in.
Re: TI Report: Musharraf liquidated Islamabad farmland
im all for the long wait while wanting for known criminals to meet their fate. at the very least i wont stoop to defending or minimizing crimes of people i like, and highlighting the crimes of those i dont. with your logic, one could say NOBODY should be prosecuted for corruption in Pakistan, since it is so endemic it will only take education over the long run to fix the system. no rapists should be put away because rape is indicative of a societal problem, and putting away one or two rapists doesnt change anything.
while i understand it is unrealistic that anything will happen about Musharraf disgracing himself by pilfering money from his country, there is nothing stopping me for atleast calling him out as being a money grubbing soulless ***.
edit: nothing... except the moderators :D
im all for the long wait while wanting for known criminals to meet their fate. at the very least i wont stoop to defending or minimizing crimes of people i like, and highlighting the crimes of those i dont. with your logic, one could say NOBODY should be prosecuted for corruption in Pakistan, since it is so endemic it will only take education over the long run to fix the system. no rapists should be put away because rape is indicative of a societal problem, and putting away one or two rapists doesnt change anything.
while i understand it is unrealistic that anything will happen about Musharraf disgracing himself by pilfering money from his country, there is nothing stopping me for atleast calling him out as being a money grubbing soulless ***.
When it comes to corruption, we can't even get zardari or nawaz, so how will we get army generals?
Re: TI Report: Musharraf liquidated Islamabad farmland
all Im saying is treat Musharraf at par with Zardari, Nawaz or any of the bigtime/smalltime crooks in Pak.