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*Originally posted by Matsui: *
Make a fence.. India is making a fence across the pakistani Border..Israel has every right to make a fence. You don't want yahoos geting in and killing innocents. Keep them clowns out.
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Matsui, does illegal occupation mean anything to you? India is bulidinga fence on its land,not on occupied land.... big difference.
Re: Re: This May Change your mind on Sharon's Fence...
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Originally posted by Akif: *A fence might be a good thing, so long as it actually follows the green line, not roughly.*
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Akiiiiiiiiiiiiif! :) :) Just wanted to say, felt so nice to see your name in this thread; realize you are busy so no need to reply to this. Just wanted to mention how nice it is to see your reply here. Your informative & thoughtful posts have been much missed.
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Originally posted by Judge^Mentull: White House aides said that no figure had been finalised and different formulas were being examined for reducing the $10 billion (£6.25 billion) aid package Israel is expecting from the United States this year....
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It will be interesting if they reduce that aid. i wonder if they will actually implement their threats and whether that will force Sharon to change the route of the fence so that it makes less incursions into Palestinian territories.
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*Originally posted by Nadia_H: *
They are indeed entitled to their security, not at the expense of the lives of Palestinian farmers and fruit-growers. How does one possibly begin to purchase someone's security by trampling upon someone else's life? Completely irrational. No one's security can be derived at the expense of someone else's life.
Had the Palestinians come up with a similar solution, i wonder how different the response would have been - everyone would have been screaming at how racist the Palestinians are to want to create a wall that separates the Israelis from them. But hey, if the Israelis do it - it's not apartheid, it's just the poor Israeli fanatical settlers trying to protect themselves.
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Nadia,
Peoples lives are disrupted every day. Landowners are affected by eminent domain here in the states all the time and often are outraged over it, though they are also compensated. Hopefully the Palestinian Famers might be also if this wall comes to fruitation and is built through their farmlands.
We need also bear in mind that Israeli settlers are also going to be affected by the wall as well.
Perhaps the Palestinians will employ checkpoint police also....... as in do unto others?
As far as the security issue...unfortunately security issues are affecting and disrupting the lives of all of us throughout the world.... Think of taking a flight somewhere..or how the Patriot Act here in the U.S. may affect ones privacy which imho imposes on ones human rights. Think of he expense to taxpayers for all the added departments to oversee security which is costly and adds to the budget deficit and ultimately affects social programs and educational benefits for those who need it most.
In your opinion its the fanatical settlers which are pushing for the wall, but I wonder how much political pull they actually have?
And I wonder if the wall might also give the Palestinian people security as well?
Though inconvenient...traffic always is..
Personally my feelings over the proposed wall are not dependent on which people proposed the idea, and I would bet that their are millions of others who would agree.
Anyway..seems to me things have been tried for 50 years and nothing has been working..perhaps a wall could be a start? I don't know.
On the other hand...perhaps one should remind the Israeli's of the horror many of their ancestors felt when the Warsaw Ghetto was walled.
IMO, a fence is a good idea AFTER there is agreement on borders. In the absence of such agreement, it is only a good idea if it is built on land that virtually everyone (except Hamas and their ilk) agrees will be part of Israel as a part of a future comprehensive resolution of land disputes.
If agreement on borders could be achieved, I could give a hoot about whether it is Israelis or Palestinians who build the fence. The reality is that for some number of decades, there will be a hardcore group of Palestinians who believe a fence should be built on the beach and Israel only exists on the side with the water. Likewise, a harcore group of Israeli settlers will never be happy with a Palestinian state. Assuming a strong majority on both sides can agree on borders, a fence makes a great deal of sense. It will help control the minority on both sides who won't accept an agreement. Then, you educate a couple generations of young ones to accept the fait accompli of the two state solution and stop preaching hatred. After another 40 years, the fence will become unnecessary and you tear it down.
if i was in israel's shoes, i'd do the same thing. what exactly about the palestinians' past leads you to believe they will negotiate? we all know that they are simply "waiting" Israel out, until they have numerical superiority. Politically and realistically, Israel is smart to cut its losses and run. I sympathize with the Palestinian cause but there are two sides (and sometimes even more) to each story.