Well for some it maybe. I was wondering what was the thought process behind this new zero tolerance policy? Because frankly its shocking considering the last few times Pakistan had a crisis scenerio this website sided with the American/Western view point.
Re: This and exciting development
You know what CM...it isnt that anyone is siding with west or east I think. Its a matter of respect here and of using the "freedom of speech" with responsibility meaning repsect other points of view, do not threaten, abuse or ridicule someone for having a view thats different from yours.
Personally, I'd like to sit with a Taliban-type and talk things out in a reasonable fashion - and if you take away all the bluster, all the "death to infidels" and that type of talk...if you show them what life really, actually IS in the west then perhaps they'd see that although westerners are different, they arent the shameless devils that they're made out to be.
But anyway, the "zero tolerance" policy here on GS seems to be more of a zero-tolerance of abusing freedom of speech rather than limiting it. I cannot speak for them...but surely I think if someone wanted to post in a reasonable manner of speaking their support of the Talibans and their reasons for their support, it presents a great opportunity for discussion and perhaps even understanding.
There goes me with my rose-colored glasses once again...
(and please note, this is me posting as a regular poster, not as a mod or representative of GS)
I also couldnt stand the "Zero tolerance" note.
I may be wrong, but most of are those who are living somewhere in west or atleast out of Pakistan.
And here is the scenario: When US started war after 9/11 in Afghanistan, and later in Iraq, there were huge number of US troops sent by all means. Ofcourse there was a great support from the people sending cards, flowers etc to their fellows. But there was a large number as well who were opposing that war, holding demonstrations, writing their opinion in blogs, articles, forums ..etc. They opposed war whatever the way they wanted. In fact the count of anti-war demonstrations in US were more than those in the rest of the world.
I never saw the "Zero tolerance" flag anywhere on such blogs/forums or statement like "even the remote attempt will not be tolerated". People hated the action and mentioned it in whatever words they wanted.
I've no doubt in the great efforts done by GS moderators and let me make it clear (before anyone charges of being traitor) that I am 100% with the military action but at the same time I want the opponents to be given the right to oppose in whatever the way they want.
We need to be more patient and learn good things (not bad) from the people we or our parents decided to live with.
Peace!
I want the opponents to be given the right to oppose in whatever the way they want. We need to be more patient and learn good things (not bad) from the people we or our parents decided to live with.
Peace!
Thats not entirely right Sid....they cannot oppose in any way they want yeah? I mean, US has "freedom of speech" but if your threaten death to another then you can go to jail. If you oppose them in a way that insults their religion, culture, sex, race or creed ... you can go to jail because its against the law to do so. Thats the law of the land.
I agree wholeheartedly that we need patience and understanding....but this goes for both sides yeah? When there is a certain amount of respect when opponents come to the table, only then can things be talked out and reasonable outcomes expected.
Thats not entirely right Sid....they cannot oppose in any way they want yeah? I mean, US has "freedom of speech" but if your threaten death to another then you can go to jail. If you oppose them in a way that insults their religion, culture, sex, race or creed ... you can go to jail because its against the law to do so. Thats the law of the land.
I agree wholeheartedly that we need patience and understanding....but this goes for both sides yeah? When there is a certain amount of respect when opponents come to the table, only then can things be talked out and reasonable outcomes expected.
Um.... I know that people here get extremely emotional while discussing the political situation, but doesnt it happen in other matters as well?? For example, if you goto 'Pakistan forum" and just check the first 10 threads, you'll see how hot they become hostile they become, very often disrespecting each other jumping out of track but the moderators are there doing a wonderful job in managing the whole situation.
So here is the question, when the moderators are already doing their job keeping an eye on the every single thread (almost 24x7 365 days), why have such a note which clearly reflects that if someone wants to oppose the military action, they may be warned or banned or wutever, just because we have "army" involved here which is regarded as a "holy cow" among most of us.
To us they may be doing a great job fighting against talibans, but to someone else that action might not be needed at all, or the army tactics may be wrong or they may have any other perspective.
Just let everyone say what they want and let the forum moderators use their control whenever needed. There shouldnt be any need of any threatening note.
Re: This and exciting development
hmmm...but then again, its a lovely gesture to support your troops and show solidarity. In much the same way as in US when all the flags and yellow ribbons came out after 9/11. Its not that everyone actually agrees with everything their gov't is doing but more of a show of support and solidarity - like yup, we're in a tough spot here but we will get thru it together. A lovely gesture for sure.
There are so many other ways to express displeasure with gov't policies and practices, so many other ways to contribute to the cause)s) that matter to you. But showing solidarity and coming together as a nation, as a people....thats really priceless.
And really...(again, this is me as a personal person, not as a mod here) ... if someone actually agreed with theTalibans and expressed it in a non-threatening and logical manner, I think for sure there would be educational and enlightening debate as a result.
PA is a scary place, I keep outta there because its a "rough crowd" lol...and the mods have my utmost respect for the tough job they have to keep everyone in line. If angers could cool down and reason and logic prevail then maybe we could get somewhere. But in the meantime,
its a beautiful thing to show solidarity and support for a gov't that is struggling to make Pak "all it can be".
Hmm.. What you are saying is wishful and "should be " done but again you cannot compel the participants to do it. Let every one narrate his own opinion and then the check goes on to maintain the discipline. You cannot force anyone to give the gesture and show solidarity if they dont want to.
There was a poll in the PA immediately after the "Zero tolerance" note asking if you are in favour of this military action or no. I dont remember anyone saying No for quite some time till some moderator came up and said people wont be banned if they say no.
As I said I'm in favor of this war but really felt bad after reading that threatening note. I think things are smooth even without that, so why put something after which people would start avoiding their input!
Re: This and exciting development
actually, they can compel the visitors and posters to comply. Because while "free speech" is an important rule here, so is respect, tolerance and solidarity. If anyone wants to express an opinion, let them do so in a fashion that doesnt include insults, death threats, ridicule...let them express it in a manner that encourages logical debate and possible solutions.
Ive yet to see anyone be banned for disagreeing with the pakistani gov't. And I also see many complaints against the actions/inactions/policies of the current admininstration. Its OK to disagree yeah? Just keep it civil, keep to the facts, keep emotion and pre-historic history out of it all and see how much gets accomplished!
ok, I'll take off my rose colored glasses now and step down off the soap box lol.
Re: This and exciting development
It defeats the purpose of discussion forum if you censor or threaten with ban certain viewpoints.
That's my 2 nikkay phaanday ;(
Re: This and exciting development
I think what we need here is a continuous infusion of beatles music, esp in the PA forum - "Come on People now", "strawberry fields forever", "here comes the sun", "Come Together"....just to name a few.
Zero tolerance policy in the news!
Re: This and exciting development
awwwww. SHEESH, be NICE people. Even if you dont agree with the policies of your gov't, you can still be supportive...
and pleez. Buy some beatles albums. Listen and learn.
Re: This and exciting development
did not we have enough discussion going on about the policy ..
anyhoo, we are going to re-word the policy, not because we dont know what we stand for, but because some members failed to understand what we were trying to say.
awwwww. SHEESH, be NICE people. Even if you dont agree with the policies of your gov't, you can still be supportive...
and pleez. Buy some beatles albums. Listen and learn.
Beatles... hmmm, remember Georgy Harrison and his Bangladesh concert? He opposed the Pak Army quite vocally. Also remember a man called John Lennon? Remember how President Nixon tried to have him deported for his proactive anti-war stances?
Maybe you should listen and learn, because you clearly have no clue what the Beatles were all about.
Why should we support the govt policies if we dont agree with them?
Maybe you should listen and learn, because you clearly have no clue what the Beatles were all about.
Did Beatles also teach to be rude to a person, especially to a polite lady.
Did Beatles also teach to be rude to a person, especially to a polite lady.
Arey mian, what was so rude about that? Mama and I are good friends :)
p.s. i never said i follow what the beatles 'taught'... im just pointing out something she might have overlooked, because beatles and supporting the govt even if u dont agree with them dont jibe.
Re: This and exciting development
If you guys are fiends then its fine, sorry I did not know abut that :)
Re: This and exciting development
np, if it sounded rude i apologize, but that was not the intention.
Re: This and exciting development
lol and :) and strawberry fields forever to you spocky!!!
yes, we be friends and all that and its ok that we dont agree in all things....
but spock man. Sure they took lotsa heat esp over bangladesh...but the thought process that they promoted was always "peace unto fellow man" and I like that, I like it muchly.
Re: This and exciting development
Remember that song by John Lennon: Imagine?
Listen to the words carefully:
Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace
Something to think about. But, if we had none of that, what a boring world it would be. And nothing to be judged on.
outta here before I get hit by flying tomatoes. Great idea for an All Views thread. Thanks Spockie and MO3