The Prophet and "Jihad"

Society Religion & Philosophy
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In terms of actual military “jihad” there are 3 major battles that everyone learns about (ex. battle of the ditch, etc). These battles from what I had learned as a kid, seemed to be defensive against the “kuffar” of Mecca. But apart from these, to what extent did Muhammad (SAW) proactively INVADE towns to enforce Islam by force? He wrote to other towns/cities to accept Islam, and when they did not, did he go invade them?

Do these jihadi groups trying to militarily make an “Islamic state” have any Islamic basis? Is this how we are supposed to form a united Ummah? Killing people the way ISIS is doing?

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Re: The Prophet and "Jihad"

of course, what iISIS is doing is NOT Islamic...in Islam, the Prophet [saws] used to instruct the following to his followers, before sending the military expeditions:

-do NOT engage women and children
-do not fight those who do not fight you
-do not kill animals or uproot trees that you do not need to survive
-give your enemy a chance to surrender
-make treaties if needed
give them the following options:

.....invite them to accept Islam [that would effectively end the war]
.....if they don't accept Islam, ask them to pay jizya [protection money] and let them live peacefully
.....if they do neither, conquer or kill them [they didn't have prisons or enemy holding facilities]

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Re: The Prophet and "Jihad"

Um, if a community did not want to convert to Islam, and did not want to pay jizya, then why not just leave them alone? Where did this issue come from that they were instructed to kill them?

very puzzled I thought Quran tells us that if people don't want to believe, then leave them be?

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Re: The Prophet and "Jihad"

The whole idea of "military" expeditions suggests that there were offensive wars. I thought in Islam, you are only allowed to take up arms in DEFENSE.

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Re: The Prophet and "Jihad"

not always. if America can invade other countries to promote democracy then why not? Allah's message had to be spread and if someone got in the way then they had to remove that obstacle.

they had the option to pay jizya and then Islamic forces had to protect them from any attacks from any one...it was like a 'tax' collected to protect them...protection costs money...they were not killed if they paid jizya.

if they refused, they were considered obstacle in the path of spreading Islam.

converting some individual by force is NOT allowed in Islam.

signing treatise was one way to avoid fighting. sulah Hudaibiya is notorious for signing a treaty which was heavily in favour of Kuffars and yet for the sake of peace Prophet [saws] signed the treaty.

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Re: The Prophet and "Jihad"

If they have their own community and sovereignty, why would they pay anyone? If Saudi came to Pakistan and said "Pay us money, and we'll protect you", do you honestly think Pakistanis would pay a cent?

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because Islam was on the roll and was spreading...those who opposed were in effect obstacles in the spread of Islam...if they desired peace, they could simply sign a treaty promising not to be an obstacle in the spread of Islam.

in today's world, every country which is weak economically or militarily pays the big boss in one way or the other.

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Re: The Prophet and "Jihad"

Jihad was a need in those days. It was more like, if you wont kill them, then they will kill you.

It was never about the land or power, it was for Islam. Nowadays, everything is about power and/or piece of land. Having said that, there is no need for Jihad in this day.

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the Jihaadists are NOT fulfilling the basic requirement of an Islamic jihaad. they are killing other innocent Muslims brothers and sisters when Prophet [saws] clearly gave instructions that too in regards to Kuffar NOT to kill women and children, not to kill anyone who is not fighting you.

besides, jihaad is carried out ONLY and ONLY for the sake of Allah and the spread/establishment of His Deen...the moment you fight for any other goals/targets then it's not jihaad...these days, jihaad is waged mostly /primarily for power, land, or political aims.

i will reject the jihaads of today in an instant.

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Re: The Prophet and "Jihad"

no need for jihad these days , seriously ? Do not u think, Palestine and Gaza need help Militarily (Jihad ) ?

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Re: The Prophet and "Jihad"

I agree

Moral support is definitely what Palestinians need, but I wont call it a Jihad. Its not for deen, its for a piece of land, plus it was pushed on poor citizens of Palestine by Hamas.

Military help is not the answer. Diplomatic influence is the answer.

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lets agree to disagree.

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Re: The Prophet and "Jihad"

Arms were allows to be taken up against oppression, injustice, and aggression.

The Byzantine Empire relied on its border client states to secure its eastern frontier (Christian arab states allied to the Byzantines). These states executed Muslim emissaries and converts; Muslim armies sent to avenge these deaths were attacked by regular Byzantine military units dispatched by Constantinople to defend their allies.

The attacks by Byzantium on these Muslim armies made them a valid target for jihad

The Persian Empire, similarly, killed Muslim emissaries, as well as oppressively taxing Muslims living within its borders (Persian policy involved very heavily taxing those who lived along its western border). Both situations made Jihad permissible.

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Prophet pbuh remained patient during his life thru out which he found harshest of opposition of all kinds from nemesis.....his conduct was kind and merciful and tht is what he introduced how Allah swt deals with His creation......Prophet pbuh fought battles when command from God came...battles from Badr, Uhud, Khandaq, to Khyber had strong, just reasons to it and not greed for tax, power, or booty....not more than 900 casualties on both sides in battles fought by Prophet pbuh.....and if u thinm that casualties were low in warfare of those days in arabia then read casualties frm battles adjacent to tht time period and it goes well into hundereds of thousands.......now what was done on the name of religion after Prophet pbuh and still continues is something else.....it is something tht targeted the very teachings and principles taught by Prophet pbuh himself and saw his own immediate family being slained.....his offspring continued to be slaied from Africa in west to India in east....and today even their remaining graves, tombs, and shrines are being bombed...all on the name of "jihad"....jihad as taught by satan indeed....

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Re: The Prophet and "Jihad"

The concept of "convert, pay a fine, or be killed" - if you say this was Muhammad's SAW's policy, then how is it different than what ISIS is doing to Christian towns?

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as i explained in my first post...they are violating the following:

-they are killing women and children
-they are killing those who do not fight them
-it's not for Allah ALONE...they have political agenda
-they are not offering treaties, peace options and/or protection
-you can not have state within state.

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Re: The Prophet and "Jihad"

1-
It was not be killed, it was pay till you subdue.
Every muslim have to pay zakat, did you want Prophet to give intensive to people by letting them out of their financial obligations, if they remain un believer ?
Like come here become muslim and pay money.
OR
Do not become muslim and keep your money ?

2-
No ruler own their people, so when a ruler stopped Muslims to give their messages to people I think war was authorized, ON ruler not on people.

I think with youtube/best-sellers and universities, how you access people has changed.
Now we can give messages to kprasad southie and queer with out invading india.. :D

3-
When prophet's uncle died, he went all the way to taif find some alliance who could protect him. There were attempted on his life, Makkans were so mad, first at islam then at muslims moving out to madina, that were going to attack.
As muslims were increasing in numbers, maakkans were also building alliance, The migrants(muslims) were traders not warriors. It was important for both sides to build alliance with baduan tribes.
So all the small conflict which happens beside uhhad, battle of the trench, was preparing muslims what was coming. Those conflict help muslims gain baduan tribes respect as well.
Remember God is and was the best planner.

When it all developed in prophets life, you could look back and see a straight line.
The only line which could have made islam survived under the times they lived in.

People could use his life and twist it make un justice, but thats why we have day of judgement. And among few things Allah dislike most is when some one spread corruption(fasad) one earth. I am no scholar but seems like ISIS like such group who is spreading un justice and corruption.

(see if those verse fit on what ISIS is doint)

[All of] whom oppressed within the lands

                                                     And  increased  therein  the  corruption.

So your Lord poured upon them a scourge of punishment.
(al fajr)

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time to stop reading concepts out of Qaeda and ISIS manuals.......manuals of destruction and barbarity......not a single sane Islamic scholar of today is willing to back what ISIS is doing.....even their chief financers and backers support them from behind the veil and burqas because their acts are so out-right evil......

Jizya in its actual form was tax that groups, tribes, towns had to pay if they were to come under territory under Islamic administration of time......so civil obligations of maintenance and defense of those ppl & areas became duty for Islamic govt.......if u research then you can find that Muslim subjects too individually paid tax to the govt which was greater than the amount of Jizya/tax non Muslims paid as a group....

"Christian historians like Gustav Le Bon and George Zaydun have discussed this issue in detail. Will Durant in Vol. II of his series “The History of Civilization” has also discussed the Islamic jiziyah and tells us that the Islamic jiziyah was so trivial an amount that it was even less than the taxes the Muslims themselves paid and thus there was never any question of exaction."

Source of the above quote.......Jihad The Holy War of Islam and Its Legitimacy in the Quran by Shaheed Muttahiri

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Re: The Prophet and "Jihad"

[8:61]....But if the enemy incline towards peace, do thou (also) incline towards peace.

That is the conduct Quran prescribes for enemies. And this is what Prophet & his noble family (pbut) stood for all their lives. There are most amazing traditions of peace and forgiveness from them even for the worst of their enemies.

I agree that these groups are satanic and their conduct towards other humans including worshipers of Allah (swt) is something that is not even acceptable towards the enemies. It is grave error and injustice to even put these groups and their name next to the name of Prophet Mohammad (saww).

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Re: The Prophet and "Jihad"

Possibly for alliance, Jihad and or dawa but not for protection. ALLAH Subhanahu wa Ta'ala is the protector of His Beloved SallAllahu Alaihi wa Ahlihi wa Sallam