the Pakistani Constitution

pakjangjoo · October 15, 2005, 4:35pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

There's nothing wrong with the Constitution. All it needs is a few amendments, to get rid of the provisions defining 'Muslim' (and also Ahmadis), and the Hudood/Shahadat/Zina ordinances. Pakistan is slowly moving towards democracy and economic prosperity. I don't know what garbage Danda meant with "sticktoitiveness", but Pakistan will get there in the end.

Pinstripe_Danda · October 15, 2005, 4:43pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

^ your education is relfective of the remarks you are making. So if you are a representation of the duicated class of pakistan....there is really no hope.

Pakistan is not Kuwait or UAE or even saudi where there is a wealth of natural resources, a sector that propels growth. Pakistan's best resources are the 160 mm odd peole that live there. Tell me what is the prognosis for the people in a world where the economy has been dependent on the US on a cashflow basis, for the last 20 years with check book financing as the mode for fiscal operations.

as far as your point number two...poverty, crime is there is any country. India has a fair share of poverty and crime. Each % point increase in GDP y/y takes 10 M people out of poverty in INdia. It has been growing at a rate of 5-7% for the last 15 years. the prognosis for the next 50 years is fantastic...it is because there are institutions in place that drive the growth, from globally recongnized indutries, to education, devolution of economic and fiscal power enacted in the 90's that is beginning to pay dividends now.

Constitutionally speaking there is only one problem with India, if you must know. It allows for a separate civil code for muslims. the same code that is the basis of the pakistani constitution. Once that code is removed, inshallah in the next 5 years, there will be uniformity in governance.

deedawar · October 15, 2005, 5:30pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

Pinstripe Danda:

^ your education is relfective of the remarks you are making. So if you are a representation of the duicated class of pakistan…there is really no hope.

Pakistan is not Kuwait or UAE or even saudi where there is a wealth of natural resources, a sector that propels growth. Pakistan’s best resources are the 160 mm odd peole that live there. Tell me what is the prognosis for the people in a world where the economy has been dependent on the US on a cashflow basis, for the last 20 years with check book financing as the mode for fiscal operations.

as far as your point number two…poverty, crime is there is any country. India has a fair share of poverty and crime. Each % point increase in GDP y/y takes 10 M people out of poverty in INdia. It has been growing at a rate of 5-7% for the last 15 years. the prognosis for the next 50 years is fantastic…it is because there are institutions in place that drive the growth, from globally recongnized indutries, to education, devolution of economic and fiscal power enacted in the 90’s that is beginning to pay dividends now.

Constitutionally speaking** there is only one problem with India**, if you must know. It allows for a separate civil code for muslims. the same code that is the basis of the pakistani constitution. Once that code is removed, inshallah in the next 5 years, there will be uniformity in governance.

Humm, being an anti-muslim again?

So you are against so called ‘secular’ state where people can be free to practice what religeon they like?

How much hate do you have for muslims and Pakistan? Doesn’t it tell what education you got in a Mander during Pooja Part?

Pinstripe_Danda · October 15, 2005, 5:34pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

No..that is not being anti-muslim..take the boulder off your shoulder chanda..all citizens of a land need to adhere to a standard civil governance code. whether it supposedly caters to silly religious whims of minorities like in India or whether it sidelines them ala ahmadis in Pakistan. The governance should not be based on "a "religon.

what makes you think I am against secular form of gov't? I do not prescribe to the thinking that mine is better..that is a fundo trait...i don't prescribe to the thinking that all non-hindus are going to be reincarnated as cockroaches..that is not part of the religious mandate...I consider all religions equal..all forms of worship equal. I don't want a buddhist state either...

Pak_Brave_Heart · October 15, 2005, 5:59pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

I think China should draft a new American consitution.

That would be much better.

Pak_Brave_Heart · October 15, 2005, 6:05pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

We don’t need some banya from Tamil Nadu to be telling us how to run our country.

cheebu · October 15, 2005, 6:23pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

seee all the fighting.. thats y i was against discussing..

well USA drafting our constitution??.. heard wats happening in iraq??..
well wats happening there is.. that the new govt created a constitution which was free and bias.. which siad the oil and natural resources will be peopls resources.. with no govt intervention.. there will be free of choise and people will ahve equality of share of resources and etc..

bt hmm it didnt go along with americans intrests... so they being in charge.. changed the constitution to.. the natural resources will be used in "smart" manner to fund the countries needs.. meaning.. the oil will be govt owned.. and the amerincan oil hungry companies will have the charge and contracts..

and since most litterate ppl are dead in iraq... so most ppl havnt even read wat they are voting on..

and furhter goin.. SO NO.. i wouldnt back a foreign person desiging our constitution.. and i wouldnt trust our govt also.. there needs to be a sepearte commitee.. full of educated people who know the religion and world togther..

heard of american PATRIOT ACT??.. well to tell u now.. Mr Bush has just taken ur rights to privacy.. and many other rights.. so.. u decide

and now about religion.. we got dis PD dude.. who keeps islam-bashing..

well first of all danda jee.. have u actually studied the basics of the religion?? don go all around bashin wen u dont even know wat ur tryin to bash.. matoo??.. i still dono wt dat means.. bt seems like mullah-bashing..

now continuing.. constitution is a legal document which governs how things will work..
now.. pakistan from my point of view.. does need a new constitution.. which will first take away this breakage of country into peicies = sind, punjab, balauchi and NWFP.. and make it one nation.. one govt.. on CM and one PM.. bascially one govt.. so there will be sum unity..

then goin down.. ther needs to be adjustments on if things dont go as said in constitution.. now.. well first of all pak is a not a Islamic nation.. meaning u cannot have shariah 100% till u have the islamic way of governance.. bt that only comes if ones practices the relgion in a open heart and broad minded.. most outspoken "molvies" misuse, or misinterpret the Quran and Sunnah.. and use it to their needs.. so there u go.. how u gona hve a khilafah if the very people who are teachin the religion are so narrow minded

then we have this otehr group.. who have NO knowledge of the religion.. and are into this.. "democracy" and "feminism" and etc.. who are just again.. soo narrow minded.. that htey dont even know half the time themselves wat they are on about. they keep doin "islam-bashing" again.. and furhter misusing or misinterpreting the Quran and Sunnah..

leme give u example of how mullahs misinterpret.. my pops took this Allah thing to put in car.. now our molana says.. astaghfarullah.. we shudnt be puttin this in car.. coz in prophets time.. he didnt do it.. and my dads like.. dumbass.. in prophet time they didnt hav cars either.. .. see wat i mean??

now the other EXTREME-OPEN MINDED ppl.. Islam is very oppressive..it forces women to cover from head to toe.. dumbasses.. islam says to show MODESTY whn wearin clothes.. meanig.. don wear those flimsy mini-skirts with those tank tops.. and all ur assets fallin out.. that u askin every male around u to rape u.. islam is saying.. wear clothes which covers u.. and makes u look moderate.. women who cover head to toe.. hv u asked them ever y dey wear it??.. u shud.. coz i fink ull get ur answer..

rest is to ur imagination

Allah hafiz

deedawar · October 15, 2005, 6:43pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

Its pretty funny when a indian thinks that he has better solution for Pakistan problems. Mian Apni sambhaalo. So called ‘secularism’ is no solution to Pakistan. Pakistan is made on Islamic ideology to get rid of people like you being invloved in our decisions.

cheebu · October 15, 2005, 7:22pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

^^^^.. umm umair sounds more like a muslim-paki name..

sumone did say it tru.. wen we dont like sumfin.. we just call em an indian or a anti-paki or anti-islamic..

wat is secular???.. and the islamic ideology.. umm THE AMOUNT OF CORRUPTION IN PAK.. doenst give a good picture to "ISLAMIC IDEOLOGY".. i prefeer the current situation to be called secular.. as most of the things goin on in pak is not wat islam teaches..

and get rid of people like u??.. umm.. i fink islam didnt tell anyone to be got ridden off.. it would rahter invite them to islamic society.. so they can understand who we are.. and if they feel.. they can becum muslims too.. thats how islam grew.. and thats how islam is still growin.. not with ignorants who are very narrow minded..

system · October 15, 2005, 7:41pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

Lahore 981:

Your thinking is quite strange.
Do you know what is Pakistani constitution and what is the problem with it?
Do you think there can be a just constitution other than the one based on Quran and Sunnah?

Your comment makes me think “if you are a Muslim?” cause your comment is an indirect way of saying “We don’t need Quraan And Sunnah”… If you know what I mean.

I agree with you. The purpose behind your post was something else and it was ruined by such filty comments. You know, this is a manifestation of western democracy, which teaches unlimited freedom. These people have shown “unlimited freedom of speach” by writting words like f u c k and like that. These are the people who know nothing about what you are saying and this is the mannerism taught to them in a western upbringing, not the Pakistani one.

Anyhow, go ahead, if you need to continue the discussion I can contribute towards your topic.

Koran and Sunnah I use to run my daily life and my dealings with others.. My govt can and should be secular, because religion is not something the govt should involve itself in, becuase it is a personal matter.

ZulfiOKC · October 15, 2005, 8:30pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

Since everything in the U.S. is Made in China, why not directly contact the Chineese; and completely wipe out the middle man... Just my nine cents.

pakjangjoo · October 15, 2005, 8:43pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

I agree. Secularism is the only way to build a modern thriving society, that is technologically advanced and economically powerful. Pakistan should be self-sufficient, rich and powerful. Everyone should have a say in the government, state officials should be subject to the law, sectarianism and terrorism should disappear, and there should be lots and lots of industries and universities. Arts and crafts should flourish, together with literature, music and film. Living standards should match those of the West, whilst our armed forces must be technically advanced and able to fight against the best. Women should have freedom and should not be subjected to degrading treatment by outofdate laws.

deedawar · October 15, 2005, 9:00pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

Cheebu mian somewhat good post for wrong reason you have.

Read my post again and find out who i talked about.
And BTW not to Umair, I referred to PD?
Did you even understand my post?

cheebu · October 15, 2005, 11:16pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

yea.. i did read ur post.. maybe i misunderstood it.. or use my view and understood ur statment in my view..

oh wait.. i thought u were refering to the person who originally posted this topic.. my bad.. lol

i take my words bak..

Allah hafiz.

deedawar · October 15, 2005, 11:40pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

Allah Hafiz:)

anjjan · October 16, 2005, 3:07pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

Can anyone name at least three former PMs of Pakistan who are living in Pakistan?

In a democracy the former leaders do not run to rescue their heads.

Ps, We are off course better!

ehsan · October 16, 2005, 3:26pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

Ex Prime Ministers living in Pakistan, Mir Zafarullah Khan Jamali, Ch. Shujaat Hussain, Ghulam Mustafa Jatoi, Balkh sher Mazari.

Apart form these many ex PM's lived and died in Paksitan like Junejo, Khawaja Nazimuddin, Muhammad Ali Bogra, Chaudhry Muhammad Ali, Huseyn Shaheed Suhrawardy, Ibrahim Ismail Chundrigar, Sir Feroz Khan Noon

Want some more?

Lahore_981 · October 16, 2005, 4:20pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

Didn’t understand your point.
Looks like you are confused yourself what to say. What do you mean by "Can and “Should”

First of all, Islam is not merely a Religon. It is a complete way of life influencing the individual and collective life of Muslims encompassing political, social and economical spheres, where it is called a DEEN. There is no concept of “Religion being a personal matter if an individual” in Islam. To say so, is to commit SHIRK"… I can challange you on this. Prove me wrong here. SECULARISM is SHIRK. End of story.

Quran has never used the term “Religion” for Islam. It has used the term DEEN-E-ISLAM…

anjjan · October 16, 2005, 4:23pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

Thanks for information. I accept my mistake…your system is better than ours and than any other democracy.

Lahore_981 · October 16, 2005, 4:29pm

Re: the Pakistani Constitution

I can understand your good intention about Pakistan but unfortunately, I totally disagree to the bold text in your post. This is a big debate and I can write on that but these do not relate to the topic in any way.

Nobody has yet tried to understand the post.