The Old Testament

Do most Christians believe it to be accurate and still worthy of being followed or do they hold that it’s been tampered with and/or abrogated by the New Testament like Muslims believe about previous scriptures?

Re: The Old Testament

As a catholic we view the New testament basis for our religion.

We are the gentiles of old. Disciminated against. Disallowed into the Temple.

However, we do not consider the Old Testament inaccurate or unworthy. We are not of the belief that the old testament has been tampered with.

We are of the idea that Jesus gave us a way follow God. A new way. Not that the old way was wrong...but a new way especially for us gentiles. A way for gentiles to be acceptable to God.

Maybe sort of like Mohammad introduced Islam to Muslims.

A way for Muslims to be acceptable to God.

Re: The Old Testament

But, New Testament teaches that Old Testament was imperfect because it could not offer forgiveness of sins. :slight_smile:

Re: The Old Testament

I don’t know that the New Testament decrees that Old Testament was imperfect…and freely admit to not being a biblical scholar.

In my understanding the New Testament introduces the “Good New’s” based on the teachings of Jesus.

I have never been introduced to the idea that the Old Testament doesn’t leave room for forgiveness of sins. I mean..human beings are for from perfect.

The likelyhood of any human being without sin pretty slim???

Take for example the biblical figure of David.

*But the word of the Lord came to me , saying,
Thou hast shed blood abundantly, and hast made great wars:
thou shalt not build an house unto my name, because thou hast shed
much blood upon the earth in my sight. (1 Chronicles 22:8.)

I think??? the story goes that David’s son Solomon later build the Temple…

I don’t believe …(and I could be wrong) that the old testament teaches tha David was forever condemned to be shunned by God.

In my thinking…

Sinse God spoke to David after he sinned expressing his displeasure and punishing David for his sins could be understood to mean that David still had favor in God’s eyes?? God punished David yes..but still loved David.

Maybe God sent Jesus to expand upon his* [Gods] will for mankind and perhaps blessed us once again though the teachings of Mohammad.

I do not believe (and you may find me heretic) that the what the New Testament teaches should be viewed with the idea that invalidates the Old Testament or that the Koran should be viewed with the idea that it invalidates the Old or New Testament.

Am hoping you are able to make sense of what I mean to say as often I have a hard time finding the right words to express myself.

I don’t mean to say that you must agree with me. Only that you understand.*

Re: The Old Testament

Didn't Jesus(as) confirm the old testament and wasn't Paul who came and said that I am dead unto the law and the law is dead unto me ? This means that christians follow Paul, who was not even a prophet as they discarded the old testament.

Re: The Old Testament

Paul was teaching about the grace of God.

We cannot live unto God unless we are dead unto the Law." If we are dead unto the Law, the Law can have no power over us.

The Law can never justify and save a sinner. The Law can only accuse, terrify, and kill him. Therefore to live unto the Law is to die unto God. Vice versa, to die unto the Law is to live unto God. If you want to live unto God, bury the Law, and find life through faith.

Re: The Old Testament

Isn't Torah the old testament?

Re: The Old Testament

Correction: The New Testament teaches that Moses’ Law was imperfect not the whole Old Testament.

Re: The Old Testament

The Old Man : so in essence you are saying that Moses, who btw was a prophet of Allah,(swt) made up his own laws that were not in accordance with Allah's(swt) laws - thats a new one.

AAG : so, according to the christians, the jews and muslims who live by the books of Allah(swt) are in error ? Please cut out the "unto" part and be more clear in your responses

Re: The Old Testament

this articel explains similarities and differences

Both religions are based on the Old Testament, which Judaism and Christianity hold to be divine or divinely inspired. Clearly, then, they will share values – unless one holds that the New Testament rejects Old Testament values. But that is untenable since, in addition to Christianity believing the Old Testament is God’s word, Jesus was a believing and practicing Jew. He would not practice a religion whose values or Bible he rejected.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=42864

Re: The Old Testament

zman: Please don't put words in my mouth. Moses received his laws from God but being written, it had to be interpreted and this is where the doubt sometimes creep in as to the full meaning. Secondly, Moses' Laws were build on sacrifices that needed to be made continuously. Jesus Christ's new way means we can hear directly from God himself - so no more difficulty in understanding what is needed and no more sacrifices is needed since Jesus did it all. Jesus new covenant made the old sacrificial set of rules as per Moses redundant but it did not surplant it. If one wants to still keep the Law as given to Moses, one can do so but also will be judged by it.

Re: The Old Testament

But my dear lady according to the book you profess to follow, Jesus :as: was not sent to the gentiles but rather only to his own people, the lost sheep of Israel.

Mathew 15:22-28

“And behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts and cried unto him, saying, ‘Have mercy on me, O Lord, thou son of David: my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil.’ But he answered her not a word. And his disciples came and besought him, saying; ‘Send her away, for she crieth after us.’ But he answered and said, ‘I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.’

Then came she and worshipped him, saying, ‘Lord, help me.’ But he answered and said, ‘It is not meet to take the children’s bread and to cast it to dogs.’

And she said, ‘Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters’ table.’

Then Jesus answered and said unto her, ‘O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.’”

Re: The Old Testament

I can’t argue your point.

You are absolutely right.

You win this debate hands down.

My words probobly should have illustrated that the New Covenant applied equally to gentiles.

Remember the parables of Jesus.

I ponder a question…

If all mankind are the decendants of Adam and Eve…

Baring Perfection..

Might we all be lost sheep?

Re: The Old Testament

interesting thread :)