Re: The Establishment of Israel [split from: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad]
hypothetical scenario
u do know what hypothetical means right?
Re: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad - President of Islamic Republic
Why is it not feasible?
It would destroy the Jewish state and will never happen without the entire region be destroyed, end of story.
Re: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad - President of Islamic Republic
Why is it not feasible? The international community has encouraged and helped the return of Bosnian, Croat and Serb refugees from the Yugoslav war to areas they fled, sending a strong message to the autonomous regions of Bosnia-Hercegovina that the ethnic cleansing that created their autonomous entities will not be allowed to have a permanent effect.
Why should such a message not be applied in the Middle East?
What are you talking about?
The refugees didn't return to their areas but fled to areas where their people were the majority. There might me some minority groups like Bosnians in Croatia or Serbia but most Bosnians in the former Yugoslavia live in Bosnia
And besides, ethnic cleansing only occurs when a rival army forcefully kicks out an entire people at the barrel of the gun
In Palestine that didn't happen, the Palestinians fled on their own and many stayed behind and today 1 million Palestinians live in Israel
The only reason that this refugee issue still exists is because Arab countries refused to accept the Palestinian refugees into their countries as to keep the conflict going
Jordan was the only country that did and how many Palestinians from Jordan want to return to Israel?
Ethnic cleansing like what happened during the Lebanese Civil war or what's happening in Iraq, that is detestable and the refugees do have a right to return to their countries.
But what happened in Palestine happened 60 years ago and was not ethnic cleansing. It was people fleeing an oncoming Army. And besides when countries are created people shift and move all the time.
The only reason that this issue persists is due to Arab racism against the Jews and refusal of Arabs to accept the Jews as their equals.
I am 100% sure if Israelis were of any other religion than Jewish, there would have been peace there long ago, but since its a "Jew" they are fighting, the Arabs are unable to make peace with them
In my opinion, the Palestinian refugees can come back but can only settle in West Bank and Gaza Strip.
Settling in Israel is a non-issue. If the refugees come back, that will make Jews a minority in Israel.
Like I said before, its like Hindus who fled Pakistan when it was created wanting to comeback and there numbers are over 200 million
Despite the moral stance, how many Pakistanis are going to accept that?
Re: The Establishment of Israel [split from: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad]
This has to be one of the saddest chapters of human evolution. It has.gotten so complicated because of obstinacy on both sides but I think the arabs have been the worst of the two - they have not sought the best possible solution that will help the suffering palestinians as people and instead have always seen it as an opportunity to drive jews out.
Arab states are the worst enemies of the people of palestine.
Just like the lot of pakis won't improve until they disavow relentless religious obsession, that of palestinians won't improve until they reject the clutches of agenda driven arab states in the facade of religion.
Re: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad - President of Islamic Republic
There are over 50 countries for you to choose from. Don't be so greedy. Even the Jews who get accused all the time of greed are only asking for one tiny country.
There are over 50 American states for you to choose from. don't be so greedy. Give jews a state in the US.
Give one of the states which white people stole from the native americans and give it to the jews so jews can have their own country.
Get the hell out of the middle east. White jews from poland and russia don't belong the middle east. We Muslims lost Palestine 60 years ago and we will get it back. Remember the crusaders controlled palestine in the middle ages and we Muslims got the land back. Just admit it we Muslims are soo many. Israel is an island that would sooner or later be under water in a sea of Muslims.
Re: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad - President of Islamic Republic
It would destroy the Jewish state and will never happen without the entire region be destroyed, end of story.
The zionist colonial experiment would sooner or later collapse. The foreign jews are just so few that sooner or later the native palestinians would get their land back. It is only military superiority that is keeping israel alive, and no country has military superiority forever.
Re: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad - President of Islamic Republic
There are over 50 American states for you to choose from. don't be so greedy. Give jews a state in the US.
Give one of the states which white people stole from the native americans and give it to the jews so jews can have their own country.
Get the hell out of the middle east. White jews from poland and russia don't belong the middle east. We Muslims lost Palestine 60 years ago and we will get it back. Remember the crusaders controlled palestine in the middle ages and we Muslims got the land back. Just admit it we Muslims are soo many. Israel is an island that would sooner or later be under water in a sea of Muslims.
that was 1,000 years ago
what territories have muslims conquered recently?
Re: The Establishment of Israel [split from: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad]
But the point is that will China be that pro-israel in the next 50-100 years whenever it becomes the eminent power? Crusades are a good example where a single man united all the bickering muslim city states into a unified cause.
You are denying that israeli terrorist groups didn’t attack palestinean villages / propaganda stunts to drive palestineans out is entirely illogical. I don’t know why you have a hard time conceding points? On the one hand, you say that arab govts don’t like palestineans [extra people] living in their country [very much true], yet you say they forced palestineans to move their countries? 
Re: The Establishment of Israel [split from: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad]
China is already pro-Israel
Some Israeli terrorists like the Stern Gang and IZL did terrorise the Palestinians but also the Palestinians terrorizing the Jews…thats why all Jews fled to Tel Aviv
Maybe you don’t understand English…
When did I say they forced them to move to their countries?
The Palestinians fled as the arab armies retreated. Jordan was the only one who accepted them but the rest used the Palestinians as pawns to further their wars with Israel and to see which country will become the champion of the Arabs
Re: The Establishment of Israel [split from: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad]
Jews have been looking to re-establish their nation ever since they were kicked out. There was a very strong movement and Jewish immigration way before WWII. Jews feel they need Israel because God promised the land to Abraham's descendents thousands of years before the advent of Islam. According to God, Israel actually owns everything from the Euphrates to the Nile, so we ought to be pleased they are content with the little strip of land they now occupy.
I think we should have the Supreme court settle this... Palestinians versus Israel and Yahweh... Yahwey better show up or its contempt of court...
Re: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad - President of Islamic Republic
Yes, forced by circumstance… Merc, you really know how to spin things… Now their are two seperate accounts… The Israeli which you, and your AIPAC friends support, and the Palestinian version, which ofcourse no one cares about.
"Palestinian Arabs and Israeli Jews tell two very different stories about the events of 1948. The Israeli version is that the Palestinians attacked the Jews and then fled voluntarily because they believed Arab armies would soon liberate Palestine. The Palestinian version is that they were innocently minding their own business, when suddenly the Zionists attacked them and evicted them by force, as part of a preconceived plan of ethnic cleansing.
Palestinians point out that Zionists carried out a number of massacres and terrorist operations, notably in Deir Yassin, where Irgun and Lehi forces killed about 110 villagers, and that the Haganah had formulated Plan D, which, the Palestinian partisans claim, was a plan for expulsion of the Arabs from Palestine. However, while Plan D called for expulsion of Arabs from hostile villages and towns in strategic locations, it did not deal with non-belligerents or with villages or towns that were not in strategic locations. They also point out that that Deir Yassin massacre was carried out by dissident Irgun and Lehi groups, and condemned by the Jewish agency. However, none of the participants were ever punished, and the Haganah and IDF later carried out evictions and massacres on their own."
The Palestine Refugee Problem
And if they werent forced, and you and I know both know its their land, why arent they being allowed to return?
“In addition to those who fled Israeli territory, about 100,000 Arabs in Israel were displaced from their own villages. Many left willingly and were assured that the eviction was a temporary security measure. In particular, the residents of Ikrit and Birim have been trying to return to their villages along the Lebanese border since 1948, but have not been allowed to do so despite repeated rulings of the Israeli supreme court.”
Re: The Establishment of Israel [split from: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad]
Jews have been looking to re-establish their nation ever since they were kicked out. There was a very strong movement and Jewish immigration way before WWII. Jews feel they need Israel because God promised the land to Abraham's descendents thousands of years before the advent of Islam. According to God, Israel actually owns everything from the Euphrates to the Nile, so we ought to be pleased they are content with the little strip of land they now occupy.
Bzzzzt. Israel is a secular state, and so has no right invoking a sacred promise.
Try again.
Re: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad - President of Islamic Republic
In Palestine that didn't happen, the Palestinians fled on their own and many stayed behind and today 1 million Palestinians live in Israel
Confiscating their property, and refusing their return IS an ethnic cleansing. This, too, by writ of law...not an act of a rogue militia.
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The only reason that this refugee issue still exists is because Arab countries refused to accept the Palestinian refugees into their countries as to keep the conflict going
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No, it's because the Palestnians are technically in UN administered camps. By taking them in and naturalizing them, it's ceeding the conflict to the Israelis which is most unjust. Israel is just as much to blame for this. The Arabs are no saints, but it's hardly their "fault".
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Settling in Israel is a non-issue. If the refugees come back, that will make Jews a minority in Israel.
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Demographics suggest this is going to be a reality sooner or later...time to deal with the issue now, and make peace with the future majority.
Re: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad - President of Islamic Republic
It would destroy the Jewish state and will never happen without the entire region be destroyed, end of story.
So you admit that Israel is only a viable state due to ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians who lived there?
Ethnc cleansing is defined as "various policies or practices aimed at the displacement of an ethnic group from a particular territory in order to create a supposedly ethnically "pure" society".
Are Israel's policies designed to maintain the displacement of Palestinians who lived inside the 1948 mandate of Palestine in order to create an ethnically pure Jewish society?
Re: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad - President of Islamic Republic
Just because I don’t believe in non-sensical arab versions of history does not make me an AIPAC supporter nor a Israeli supporter
I just support the facts
What utter nonsense
Please explain to me how a 30,000 man army fighting 100,000 Arabs can manage to evict 500,000 Palestinians?
The Palestinians fled on their own. This is not something new to war. It has happened in every single war. When people see an enemy on coming army, they flee
And what you fail to point out that Jews from neighbouring villages came and stopped the massacare.
And Arabs 4 days later struck a Jewish hospital where they massacred 100 Jewish doctors and Nurses
And what you again fail to point out is that Haganah is a terrorist organization and only fought with the IDF because they needed men…so please don’t equate the goals of the Haganah with the rest of Israel
thats like saying that the whole of Saudi Arabia wants to kill the infidels and create a caliphate because 15 hijackers were saudis and osama is from saudi arabia
And that is very shameful. Israel should have brought the people who committed this massacre to justice.
Kind a like how Michael Aoun leader of the Christian Arab Phalenge Militia massacred 2,000 Palestinians but now is living in a mansion in beirut or how Syria killed 20,000 people in Al Hama and not a single person was brought to trial.
And Please quote from a more respectable website than this biased nonsense
Because if they return Jews will no longer be a majority and thus negate the whole concept of Israel.
Exactly. Criticize Israel on these things. But don’t drum up nonsense and quote from stupid websites which have ZERO reputation for being correct
Re: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad - President of Islamic Republic
Confiscating their property, and refusing their return IS an ethnic cleansing. This, too, by writ of law...not an act of a rogue militia.
Not really. Millions of hindus and muslims fled india and pakistan and that is not considered ethnic cleansing. When countries form, populations shift
No, it's because the Palestnians are technically in UN administered camps. By taking them in and naturalizing them, it's ceeding the conflict to the Israelis which is most unjust. Israel is just as much to blame for this. The Arabs are no saints, but it's hardly their "fault".
Arabs started this whole mess in order to show who can be the leader of the Arab world by attacking Israel and the poor Palestinians are paying the price.
Demographics suggest this is going to be a reality sooner or later...time to deal with the issue now, and make peace with the future majority.
Or create final borders along west bank and gaza where Palestinian refugees can settle and live in peace
Re: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad - President of Islamic Republic
So you admit that Israel is only a viable state due to ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians who lived there?
Ethnc cleansing is defined as "various policies or practices aimed at the displacement of an ethnic group from a particular territory in order to create a supposedly ethnically "pure" society".
Are Israel's policies designed to maintain the displacement of Palestinians who lived inside the 1948 mandate of Palestine in order to create an ethnically pure Jewish society?
Funny isn't that what Pakistan was suppose to be?
the land of the pure?
Re: The Establishment of Israel [split from: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad]
^ The ruling elite in both countries are *********.... the common man ..without the politics and brainwashing ...just wants to get on with their life!
Re: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad - President of Islamic Republic
Funny isn't that what Pakistan was suppose to be?
the land of the pure?
The difference is that Pakistan would still be overwhelmingly Muslim majority even if the Hindu & Sikh populations had not moved - indeed, there is no evidence to suggest that the population transfers of 1947 were what our founding father wanted; rather , it was the unintended consequence of hatred unwittingly released.
Indeed, all the Hindus who left Pakistan in 1947 and their descendents could return to Pakistan, and the Muslim character of the state would still not be affected because only those areas that were overwhelmingly Muslim to start with became Pakistan.
Israel is a different case. The areas that were overwhelmingly Jewish were small isolated pockets and a thin strip along the coast. To create a viable Jewish state required large areas of land to be purified of the native arab population - and preventing them from returning once the conflict they fled from was over was the ideal form of ethnic cleansing.
At what point should the Gaza Strip and West bank, and surrounding Arab countres stop providing refuge to the refugees? Why should refugees from a conflict continue to be provided shelter when that conflict is over and peace and stibaility is restored to the places they fled from?
Re: Mahmoud Ahmedi Nejad - President of Islamic Republic
Not really. Millions of hindus and muslims fled india and pakistan and that is not considered ethnic cleansing. When countries form, populations shift
Jinnah was begging the Hindus to stay...totally different scenario. The Hindus who moved on did exactly that, as did the Muslims who left India. Totally different scenario.
The Palestinians didn't leave their home (or, rather, territories) for migration...thye left because they didn't want to be stuck in a warzone.