The Dillema is the Fact that.........

Society Religion & Philosophy
1

With all the due regards and respect to all the participants in this group of discussion,
I would like to mention the fact that ,Every other Person now-a-days acts or try to act and behave like a Scholar, even we don’t have the very basic knowledge of Islam.

I am afraid that if we come to a point where we will be required to simply answer all the technicalties of Namaz only,leave all the other important and very basic priciples of Islam, then we will know where we stand in actual ???

Prophet(MPUH) had already disclosed this scenario much earlier in his Sahih Hadith with something more or less like;

“Allah will not take out the Knowledge(of his Deen) from people’s heart but he will simply desert this world in the shape of true and real scholar’s deaths and then only many ignorants and so-called scholars will remain on earth, who will be very limited in their knowledge of Deen, and because of that will start giving the Fatwas and advises based on their personal beliefs, likings and disliking and will create a Mess in Deen”

May be we are in that phase now, I have been observing the overall discussion, its topics and my respected fellow’s responses and without anything personal against anybody, I sincerely found following;

1- First,we try to raise a useless and irrelevant issue.
2- Arguing with no real reference(in most of the cases).
3- Trying every possible means to prove that
whatever we said is 100% right, even at some point when we ourselves realized that " Yes, I have rasied a wrong issue or responded wrongly" we are doing our best to keep our so-called Ego at the highest level, at any cost.
4- Trying to degarde others by using different sectarain matters and discussions.
5- Creating some bad feelings for others in our hearts because of any counter attacks( which is quite natural).
6- Etc. etc…
7- Finally, we end-up with zero or even minus level achievement( minus in a sense that we waste our time and develop bad feelings and impressions of our Muslim brothers & sisters )

Please forgive me if anybody feel something personal although I have tried to keep us warned of the worst consequences of irrelevant discussion.

Another Sahih Hadith says something less or something more like;

“The good quality of a believer’s Eimaan lies in the fact that everything which doesn’t concern him/her, is ignored and left unattended by him/her”

Another Hadith(Sahih) says something more or less like;

“A person who believes firmly in Allah and the day of judgement shall either say something good(useful) or keep quiet”

I believe above two Ahadith can tell us where we are at ???

God knows better.

2

the things is that there is a hadith of the Holy Prophet which says "ballighu anni wa law aaya" which means pass on (to others any knowledge) from me, even if it is one verse....

so even if u know as little as one verse or one hadith, it is FARDH to pass it on....

3

If a person is spreading fitnah by saying incorrect things, should the person who knows the truth keep quiet? Is that your interpretation?

A gentleman is trying to prove that the most beloved sahaba were disobedient and did not follow Rasool Allah. Should you or anyone else keep quiet? Do you appreciate how this affects the pillars of our belief?

A lady is claiming that the laws of inheritance and hudood be 'differently interprted' so that she can inherit as much as her brother; and that gays be allowed to do what they want as this is their choice and legitimate right?

May be you would look the other way, I can't. I shall try to bring them to the right path with what little knowledge Allah has given me. If I fail there, atleast I will be able to convey to the others that it is utter nonsense as far as Islam is concerned.

Rabbeshrah lee sadree; wa yassirlee amree; yafqahoo qaulee.

4

[quote]
Originally posted by armughal:
**the things is that there is a hadith of the Holy Prophet which says "ballighu anni wa law aaya" which means pass on (to others any knowledge) from me, even if it is one verse....

so even if u know as little as one verse or one hadith, it is FARDH to pass it on....**
[/quote]

You are very 100% right as far as telling and passing on the knowledge goes but my respected fellow,there is a very clear difference between just telling or passing on the knowledge in a good manner.... and keep debating, indulging with one after one arguments and getting some more deviated remarks from such type of persons and finally ending-up with great loss of time.
I feel the different is quite obvious between these two.... isn't it ???

Quraan reveals(Meanings/Interpretation); O prophet ! we sent you just to warn and tell people the right Path, you are not a supervisor over them, and we did not send you to manage affairs".

It clearly orders us to just perform our duty by simply telling and conveying them the right Path while not getting indulged with lengthy and repeated arguments or debates if they don't act as a sincere and true learner.

The Answer to Fact Finder is also the same, means telling the right Path is one thing(which we are obligated to do) but even after seeing a stubbern and childish behavior, wasting valuable time in debating and trying to convince them is just like trying to " Manage Affairs " which was not a duty of prophets even so how are we supposed to do this ???? Our duty is completed as long as we convey them the truth & Allah will not held us responsible if these people don't accept the truth as the ultimate guidance is his task.

Tell me will Allah held Mohammad(MPUH) responsible for not bringing his Uncle(Hazrat Abu Talib) into the fold of Islam ???? after he conveyed him the message of Islam.......No certainly not.

Regarding Christian's behavior, please don't forget they even didn't maintain the original version of Bible, so how can we compare them with Muslims ??

God knows better.

5

[quote]
Originally posted by sheikhaa:
The Answer to Fact Finder is also the same, means telling the right Path is one thing(which we are obligated to do) but even after seeing a stubbern and childish behavior, wasting valuable time in debating and trying to convince them is just like trying to " Manage Affairs " which was not a duty of prophets even so how are we supposed to do this ???? Our duty is completed as long as we convey them the truth & Allah will not held us responsible if these people don't accept the truth as the ultimate guidance is his task.
[/quote]

I appreciate your point of view. But if the people publicly voice their misinformed views and are liable to afect thinking of others, I believe they have to be shown to be incorrect in public.

**
[quote]
Tell me will Allah held Mohammad(MPUH) responsible for not bringing his Uncle(Hazrat Abu Talib) into the fold of Islam ???? after he conveyed him the message of Islam.......No certainly not.**
[/quote]

Irrelevant as we are talking about a totally different thing.

**
[quote]
Regarding Christian's behavior, please don't forget they even didn't maintain the original version of Bible, so how can we compare them with Muslims ?? **
[/quote]

This is precisely my concern. These people are proposing something that Christians may have proposed 1600 years ago. Can we allow them to change some ayaat of the Qur'an now?

Rabbeshrah lee sadree; wa yassirlee amree; yafqahoo qaulee.

6

[quote]
Originally posted by FactFinder:

Irrelevant as we are talking about a totally different thing.

Here we go...a point where Egoistic talk will start.....that "How did you say that my sayings are irrelevant ???" so I leave it here with no remarks, no arguments and no further debate.

[/quote]

This is precisely my concern. These people are proposing something that Christians may have proposed 1600 years ago. Can we allow them to change some ayaat of the Qur'an now?

Dear there is no soul on all the levels of earth and Sky who can get a nano fractional success in changing a single Alphabet of Quraan, let alone the whole Verse....

We know who has taken the task to keep this Quraan in its original form .....????? we don't need to be worry about that inshaallah.

God knows better.

**
[/QUOTE]

7

if you post anythng here in reply to some QUESTION by an un-informed or ill-informed muslim or non-mulsim, and he tries to debate even that PROOF from Quran or Hadith, and u remain silent over it, other readers will take the idea that YOU COULD NOT ANSWER AND THAT OTHER PERSON HAS WON BECAUSE HE WAS RIGHT....
thats my understanding ofcourse....

but u r right, too much debate is not good....
perhaps the following verses from the Holy Quran can guide us all better....

Quran (16:125-128)
Invite (all) to the way of thy Lord with wisdom and beautiful preaching; and argue with them in ways that are best and most gracious: for thy Lord knoweth best who have strayed from His Path and who receive guidance.

And if ye do catch them out catch them out no worse than they catch you out: but if ye show patience that is indeed the best (course) for those who are patient.

And do thou be patient for thy patience is but from Allah; nor grieve over them: and distress not thyself because of their plots.

For Allah is with those who restrain themselves and those who do good.

8

[quote]
Originally posted by sheikhaa:
** Dear there is no soul on all the levels of earth and Sky who can get a nano fractional success in changing a single Alphabet of Quraan, let alone the whole Verse....

We know who has taken the task to keep this Quraan in its original form .....????? we don't need to be worry about that inshaallah.

God knows better.**
[/quote]

Agreed 100%. They cannot change the Qur'an. Nowhere have I said that they can. But they may change the thinking of the unknowing.

The advice we have is to tie the camel and then trust in Allah. We know that Islam will ultimately triumph. But that does not mean that we need not struggle by doing da'wah and islaah.

In another chain A1shah is trying to prove that Omar (radhi Allaho anh) was disobedient of Rasool Allah. In another place the shia tried to malign Amir Muawiyah and a sunni contributor agreed with him as that is what he had read. Are you going to sit back with such stuff being posted on this site?

Rabbeshrah lee sadree; wa yassirlee amree; yafqahoo qaulee.

9

FaceUp has written this about you in the thread "Allah has a face....."

[quote]
What about your mentor who is pressing you, all of a sudden, not to get into debates with "ignorants" like me. Well, sheikhaa - Do you have any thing of substance to say based on your own cognitive process notwithstanding what your scholars may have drilled into your psyche?
[/quote]

Care to answer? I have told him that you are not my mentor as I did not even know your gender.

Rest is yours.

Rabbeshrah lee sadree; wa yassirlee amree; yafqahoo qaulee.

10

[quote]
Originally posted by FactFinder:
**FaceUp has written this about you in the thread "Allah has a face....."

[QUOTE]
What about your mentor who is pressing you, all of a sudden, not to get into debates with "ignorants" like me. Well, sheikhaa - Do you have any thing of substance to say based on your own cognitive process notwithstanding what your scholars may have drilled into your psyche?
[/quote]

Care to answer? I have told him that you are not my mentor as I did not even know your gender.

Rest is yours.
**
[/QUOTE]

Just want to say following in the words of Quraan ;

" Thy Lord is watchful for every single word that you speak "

A Sahih Hadith reveals something more or less like:

" There are Angels deputed to take note of every single good or bad word coming out of human's tongue so be careful in your speech"

At another place , Quraan says :

"Anybody who does an atoms weigh of good deed shall see it and anybody who does an atoms weigh of evil deed, shall see it"

Perhaps above Verses and Hadith ask us to be very careful in our speech and use of tongue
For it destroys our good deeds like a Fire does with the wood.

God knows better.

11

I cannot accept that believers in the Old and
New Testament(Book) could have diverged to the extent that Islam describes. The stories
are vastly different. More so Christian and
Moslem versions. The Gospels were written so
close to the time of Christ and Mohammad was
600 years latter. He remains great for his
work to bring Allah to Arabia and places
beyond. Religions do go off the right path
and I think God may have created problems
between them to enable members of each to be
strong in their convictions. What do you say?

12

The Quran was written and safeguarded in the life of Prophet (SAWW). It was put into book form, during the lives of his companions (RA).

The first gospel (Mark) didn't come till 65 AD. All 27 books of the New Testament as we know it today were written by 125 AD.

What you are referring to, are probably the books of ahadith or the sayings of the Prophet (SAWW) which were compiled in book form several years after the time of Prophet (SAWW), however their exact words were transferred from generation to generation till they were transcribed in book form.

[This message has been edited by Pristine (edited January 08, 2002).]