Re: Taliban cut off heads of 17 people for having music at party :-(
lol... No there is no peace. I guess we should bring the Taliban back again. Because if its one thing everyone loves, it human subjugation in the guise of ISLAM! Better a life as a slave to the beards, then relative freedom under the Americans.
By the way, Sharia law is open to interpretation, whether YOU like it or not. You are free to interpret it in the most barbaric and primitive manner you like, but most normal, reasonable, and progressive individuals find publicly murdering anyone to be disgusting and repulsive, whether you like it or not. I for one refuse to believe that public execution of a human being like some rabid dog is in any way Islamic, and if you think it is, then I pity you. I mean is there no part of you brain that isnt repulsed by seeing human beings having their heads chopped off and corpses lying in the middle of the street? What kind of demented mind do you have?
relative freedom? right you meant indiscriminate air attacks on wedding ceremonies and funeral gatherings?
and by the way, interpretation is required where there is some ambiguity, no "special" interpretation required to change the meaning of something which is clearly written and understood
this is going off-topic so i wont reply again on these lines, i'm out
Re: Taliban cut off heads of 17 people for having music at party :-(
One has to ask a Hazara, Uzbek or Tajik on how nice the Taliban were. Different groups have different views. In Pakistan the Taliban were considered saviours and the media painted them as such simply because the ISI wanted them in power to forward theri own agenda.
I don't think Afghan Taliban are/were any better than TTP etc.
Re: Taliban cut off heads of 17 people for having music at party :-(
relative freedom? right you meant indiscriminate air attacks on wedding ceremonies and funeral gatherings?
and by the way, interpretation is required where there is some ambiguity, no "special" interpretation required to change the meaning of something which is clearly written and understood
this is going off-topic so i wont reply again on these lines, i'm out
LOL... your joking right? Your bias is pathetic. If the Taliban bomb a market, well they didnt mean it! But if the US bombs a wedding party by accident, well ofcrouse they intended to do it! Can you prove that the attack was intentional? If you cant then dont talk. At the end of the day, the US is here for a short time and will leave, and compared to what Afghanistan was under those bearded dogs, Americans are Angels. At least schools are open again, women can involve themselves in society again (assuming they arent murdered by the Taliban, which still occurs), television, radio, arts, Music, all the things Afghans were deprived off under the Taliban are now eing revived. And your telling me the Americans are WORSE! What planet are you living on!?!?! When was the last time you heard of a public execution under American watch, or people being flogged for listening to Music or not wearing a beard? When was the last time you heard of anyone being deprived of an education by the Americans? If anything, the Americans have built schools and infrastructure.
interpretation is required when something is so blatantly inhumane, barbaric, and illogical that only through interpretation could we possibly make sense of it. The stupid will refuse to acknowledge anything as illogical as long as they believe its ordained by god, but those with neuron left that still functions, understand that things like public execution are inhumane, couldnt possibly be what the God that loves his creation more then a mother for her child could allow in a civilized society. Welcome to the 21 century..
Re: Taliban cut off heads of 17 people for having music at party :-(
Cant believe there are still some apologists.
People can be such fools. They would be apologists for the Nazis had the Nazis been Muslim. Really disgusting how twisted their minds are by their shallow simple minded understanding of their faith.
Re: Taliban cut off heads of 17 people for having music at party :-(
A few things:
1) For the people toting the "America does it so the Taliban can do it too" line: Are you kidding me? Two wrongs don't make a right.
2) The Taliban are not fighting for anything. They are a corporation now. Construction projects and the like now take into account the required bribe to the Taliban. They are a pseudo corrupt government and do not in any way care about liberating Muslims.
Bottom line: the Taliban are indefensible, as are America's foreign policies. Rationalizing one and hating the other sounds oddly like our favourite pal US of A's stance toward's Israel and Palestine.
Re: Taliban cut off heads of 17 people for having music at party :-(
LOL... your joking right? Your bias is pathetic. If the Taliban bomb a market, well they didnt mean it! But if the US bombs a wedding party by accident, well ofcrouse they intended to do it! Can you prove that the attack was intentional? If you cant then dont talk. At the end of the day, the US is here for a short time and will leave, and compared to what Afghanistan was under those bearded dogs, Americans are Angels. At least schools are open again, women can involve themselves in society again (assuming they arent murdered by the Taliban, which still occurs), television, radio, arts, Music, all the things Afghans were deprived off under the Taliban are now eing revived. And your telling me the Americans are WORSE! What planet are you living on!?!?! When was the last time you heard of a public execution under American watch, or people being flogged for listening to Music or not wearing a beard? When was the last time you heard of anyone being deprived of an education by the Americans? If anything, the Americans have built schools and infrastructure.
interpretation is required when something is so blatantly inhumane, barbaric, and illogical that only through interpretation could we possibly make sense of it. The stupid will refuse to acknowledge anything as illogical as long as they believe its ordained by god, but those with neuron left that still functions, understand that things like public execution are inhumane, couldnt possibly be what the God that loves his creation more then a mother for her child could allow in a civilized society. Welcome to the 21 century..
Though I said I'm out, but had to come back only to answer this... about the bold part in the first para, can you prove the attack was a mistake? Even after every attack they say "only militants" were killed? and on the other hand, can you prove the school bombing and mixing of poison in water was done by Taliban? even after they denounce and said they did not do it and it’s not their agenda to do such things? what’s left is only speculation and blind trust on the media.
About the second para I'm only amazed on what you said. Believing on Quran and believing that it’s ordained by ALLAH SWT is stupid? MAA’ZALLAH I'm speechless here. I can recall our previous interaction on religious matters so I know where you are coming from. There is a very fundamental clash of belief here, so better I leave it here...
happy boot-polishing the american angels, lolz. Hope I don’t need to comeback to this mud sliding.
Re: Taliban cut off heads of 17 people for having music at party :-(
Peace Med911
There are so many conflicting stories about the Taliban. I don't know what to believe in anymore. Regarding "Bin Laden" they offered him protection at the price of their own destruction, (you would agree that Barbarian/Savage mindsets always sacrifice individuals when they see destruction on the horizon), they let Yvonne Ridley go, when they were the victors of the Russia conflict - it was said that Afghanistan was the place where you could leave an open briefcase of cash and it would still be there. We hear that they destroyed the opium fields to rid the region of drug crimes ... Then we hear things like music problems and beheadings when music is part of the Afghan culture. I'm not sure what to make of all of this ... I am best shielded from all of this media nonesense. My opinion is that they are no better or worse than any of us ... They are just different.
Some of the punishments they have done could be:
Maligned cases - for example "woman stoned to death for talking to a man" - this could easily be a case for a woman stoned to death for actually engaging in adultery, how would we know for sure? Not that it becomes acceptable, but it does start to make sense ... For me the versions of the stories that appear regarding the Taliban make them seem to be unpredictable and angry irrational people ... the truth is they are ultra strict - but they are very predictable ...
I'm not prepared to agree with everything the media say about the Taliban - I will take it and mentally reduce the heat of what they say to us by putting on a mental filter and I believe that will be closer to the truth.
Re: Taliban cut off heads of 17 people for having music at party
When did I say civilians were never killed? Its a sad consequence of War… What can you do. Lets hope your Taliban dogs understand they have lost and end their so called Jihad.
My assessment of the US is based on the understanding that the US is far more responsible in their conduct of War, and its against the character of the US to attack civilians. Its also illogical. If the US truly wanted to kill civilians, they would have multiple opportunities. They could do at any point in the War. That they dont, gives weight to the understanding that a mistake is a mistake. You on the other hand just need an excuse, and you would assume the wort intention regardless of evidence.
I didnt mention anything about school poisonings, you just decided to throw that in there since in your mind it helps your case.
The school bombings are a recent example of Taliban crime. And like I said, they are off shoots of your AFGHAN Taliban. And they take responsibility for such attacks. Taliban blow up girls
And by the way, why do you trust these criminals anyway?
Believing in things that are inhumane as being Islamic is very stupid. It betrays a lack of reasoning and a blind adherence to rigid ideology which in and of itself is contradictory to the very nature of societies. Societies are dynamic, yet Allah SWT would have us manage such dynamics by adhering to rigid rules established 2000 years ago? Nothing could stupider then trying to force a square peg through a round hole, and yet that is what you do by using 2000 year old standards to confine a modern society, and is the primary reason for the failure of the Taliban and why we should condemn them for their barbaric interpretation of islam.
its not a clash of beliefs, its a clash of modern vs ancient…
Re: Taliban cut off heads of 17 people for having music at party
Peace Med911
No … collateral damage or pillaging of civilians or any form of hostile engagement with a populous of a territory who are not engaged in fighting is a spree of crimes of the greatest order. If the bombs and airstrikes are not used and opponents taken out only then this is the only type of war that is acceptable. War in fact is never acceptable, but if it is going to happen there have to be rules. So it is hypocritical to argue in favour of collateral damage (where children are killed) yet in the same breath condemn a group for using children to strike at the enemy army … Both are wrong, but I would the drone strikes killing women and children as well as possibily taking out an opponent is MORE wrong than a child who chooses to attack a military base of his enemy. But they are both wrong - admit it!
Re: Taliban cut off heads of 17 people for having music at party
Its not so complex if you ask me. Every individual, ever society too, no matter how repugnant in general has some redeeming qualities, when viewed in parts and not as a whole. Hitler was an aspiring artist, and his work was actually not so bad, and Nazi Germany was rather efficient and well run. But then there is the bit about their programs against the Jews and holocaust, and racial bigotry!
Similarly, there are good things about the Taliban as well. But they were grotesque as a whole. There are things that are debatable about them, but there are other things that are facts. The things I mentioned. The relegation of women to nothing more then objects, hidden away from view, having no voice in society, that is a fact. Their religious police going around beating people for minor infarctions, that is a fact.Deobandi Taliban Beating Women In Kabul During Their Regime - YouTube
Their denial of education to women is also a fact, their destruction of heritage, music, arts, these are al facts. And while you might assume that they allowed religious freedom on some rudimentary level, in reality, they allowed no religious freedom, as they forced ALL to follow their interpretations in ALL ways. You cant disguise them. That is enough to condemn them.
And you may think public execution is fine, and that punishing adultery with death is perfectly fine. However, I dont believe that God, who created this world, knowing the nature of society, which is constantly changing and dynamic, could ever demand of us to to forever adhere so rigidly to a set of rules for all times regardless of how society changes. Laws change to meet the demands of societies, society does not change to suite the laws. The more you try to confine society in such a way, the less the society can grow and progress.. Islam in my opinion should be understood as defining certain general parameters, much like a constitution would in most countries, not a set of uniform and rigid laws, thus leaving room for flexibility. How we function within those parameters should be left to society and individuals.
And i remind you, most states run by dictatorial regimes manage to reduce crime to almost zero. But its usually at the cost of other freedoms. Personally, I think there are better ways to create a just and peaceful society that doesnt involve torture, and summary public execution. And there are examples of societies that have low crime without becoming the Taliban. And poppy cultivation being reduced is often cited as the one great redeeming act of the Taliban. Talk about clutching at straws. They had their own motives in destroying poppy production. But then they destroyed the Buddhas, which sort of brought them back to zero again.
So we need not be confused. There are things that are debatable. However, what we know to be fact is enough to condemn them.
And there is a difference between unintentional deaths of civilians, during attacks on militant targets, and calculated use of children, to attack civilian targets. And yes war sucks, but the Taliban are the architects of their own destruction, although they would call it protecting their honor. Ask the women of Afghanistan, and ask the Artists, ask the common man, ask the Tajiks, Hazaras, and Uzbeks if they would enjoy having the Taliban back in charge.
Ask people like Hanifa Safi, OR Safia Ama Jan, both former heads of womens affairs, opps, they are both now deceased, killed by Taliban.
Re: Taliban cut off heads of 17 people for having music at party :-(
By the way, does anyone know whether there is a direct correlation between crime reduction and corporal punishment in relation to Muslim states? Has there ever been a proper study down, with actual statistical evidence?
I mean it seems odd, that if killing an adulterer or adulteress is supposed to stop adultery, than why do we keep hearing about people being killed for adultery?
And how do you even prove adultery? Unless someone is there to see the actual act, which I doubt. Im assuming the alleged adulteress was seen speaking to her accomplice, but does that constitute adultery?
Re: Taliban cut off heads of 17 people for having music at party :-(
Kindly list unislamic actions by afghan taliban , let see how good talibans bashers islamic knowledge is :)
Please make sure you have ample proof hat this was done by afghan taliban or afghan taliban have not denounced or made apology for thier action.
Off the top of my head: destroying the Buddha statues, beheading people for music, forcing women to wear the niqab, compelling people to follow Islam, taking bribes from construction contractors in Afghanistan, bombing innocents in Pakistan, profiting from the opium drug trade...
Re: Taliban cut off heads of 17 people for having music at party :-(
I mean it seems odd, that if killing an adulterer or adulteress is supposed to stop adultery, than why do we keep hearing about people being killed for adultery?
Who are we hearing this from? Oh, Western media ... Yes, there is a change ... People are more relaxed about adultery ... People are more exposed to sexualised ideals, globally people are becoming consumeristic even with their relationships. If adultery happens in such stratosphere then it becomes an injustice to implement the hudd punishments ...
Re: Taliban cut off heads of 17 people for having music at party :-(
By the way, does anyone know whether there is a direct correlation between crime reduction and corporal punishment in relation to Muslim states? Has there ever been a proper study down, with actual statistical evidence?
I mean it seems odd, that if killing an adulterer or adulteress is supposed to stop adultery, than why do we keep hearing about people being killed for adultery?
And how do you even prove adultery? Unless someone is there to see the actual act, which I doubt. Im assuming the alleged adulteress was seen speaking to her accomplice, but does that constitute adultery?
Islamic law doesn't prevent adultery from occurring, instead it prevents certain behaviors from becoming publicly acceptable.
As long as Satan exists, mankind including Muslims will be tempted to sin, from the most minor of sins to the most serious of sins, and many will always give in to temptation.
Shariah law, and the high standards of evidence that it entails, prevent undesirable behaviors from becoming publicly accepted.
Yes, even in the most liberal of modern societies, people are not going to go about (in general) having adulterous sex in public, where 4-5 adult witnesses will see it. However, it is increasingly common for people to openly admit to marital infidelity, such as to friends. This is the road to societies where adultery is openly winked it, such as France or Italy, where it is macho to have a mistress.
The purpose of such punishments is to prevent Muslim societies from such behavior patterns.
