Sunni Perspective on Shia Traditions

[Das_Reich]

Re: Sunni Perspective on Shia Traditions

@PyariCgudia

Ibrahim is a Prophet and Imam - it’s all the same thing. They bring messages and sometimes they end up being political leaders. Regardless they’re alwaya “imams” because part of the responsibility of a Prophet is to be a spiritual guide, which is what an Imam is.

You guys have minced words. I can call a cow a horse buts still a cow at the end of the day. By giving super human and divine powers to mere human beings who, yes were excellent scholars, and then trying to get away with it by using a different term, all that’s being done is hoodwinking worshippers.

The problem is when we debate early islamic issues ( i.e from time of Abu Bakr RA to Abdul Malik b Marwan i.e the end of the second fitna) we use the sectarian definations of today i.e Shia and sunni

If you read the history this is not how people identified themselves back then, the first classification was TRIBAL , second was tribal third was tribal after that you can loosely group people in the following groups

Early muhajireen of Quraish and their descendents like Abdullah b Umar, abdur rehman b abubakr , saad b abi waqqas mostly NEUTRAL

Ansar a few neutral, some pro-uthman and most Pro-Ali

Khawarij a offshoot of party of Ali but with a distinct ideology of their own have great reverence for first 2 caliphs and not much after

Party of Ali includes a myriad of elements Iraqi nationalists , Yemenis , Ansar, some Quraishis as well , in those time they show no EXPLICIT hostility to umar RA or ABuBakr RA but are very hostile to Uthman.They are shia in the literal sense but not in the sense of Imami twelver shias of today an important distinction.As the memebers of this party are very important hadith narraters for sunnis

Iraqi nobles who mostly of yemen descent back Ali KW as the likely candidate to counter Syrian hegemony they will later also back Abdullah b Zubair against Mukhtar b abi ubayda

Syrian nobles who are of late convert but quraishi linage ( not muhajireen) or other tribes settled in syria they back Muawiyah and are Pro-uthman very hostile to Ali KW

Party of Abdullah b zubair ( from second fitna onwards ) which has a nucleus of people who were from hijaz are neutral or supportive of Ali and pro-uthman BUT anti-mauwiayh and later gains traction in many other areas including Iraq where it attracts many nobles who had previously supported Ali

These are the BIG political /tribal groupings of that time if we use the names of the groups in our discussions rather than “shia” “sunni” labels it will be a lot more accurate remember the sectarian beliefs have EVOLVED over time esp when it comes to issues of succession/caliphate/imamate