[Split discussion] Punjab vs rest

Jolie · June 7, 2015, 9:38am

Re: [Split discussion] Punjab vs rest

I am talking ethnic diversity in terms of America when you have ethnic groups that celebrate their own holidays and there is ghettonization with china towns and hispanic towns while also diversity within cities where different people live together. Even I might be half punjabi as my dad is east of the border, so you can say that we have a lot of eastern punjabis of variant percentages settled in karachi.

The muhajir community itself came from all parts of india and that sum itself is more diverse than anything combined in Punjab. Add that to bengalis, rest of pakistani ethnicities, tajik, hazaras, rohingya, kashmiris (yes we have them) etc and of course, karachi is diverse than anyplace in Pakistan.

We don’t even have any mqm supporters as khoji is off and saleem has disappeared as well unlike Desert Bird who posts propaganda threads. It is mostly a PTI forum with the second largest party represented being PPP and then Noon league just because no one else is here. You get the stray afghans and/or lefty ANP supporters as well.

As far as Sindh goes, do you see my excusing PPP for being from my “province”? I don’t excuse altaf hussain for whatever good mustafa kamal did. You are mistaking me for AP. In fact, i have posted against AP’s generalizations that happen to be about punjab all the time. Of course, I didn’t like it when karachi was dragged by a certain poster repeatedly in a thread and I am not alone. Are you telling me Decent, SID, muqawee all are third class scum of the earth? Perhaps you think that I anti-Pakistan or something for criticizing Imran khan, but I criticize his stupid actions yet have never said that his goal of free & fair elections is stupid. If I was an MQM supporter, I would be against him 100% as Arif Alvi did win on a seat in 2013 that was rigged on from MQM.

What many people from Punjab don’t “get” is that there are serious issues when communities that were at the forefront of the Pakistani movement (muhajir err indian muslims from mainland AND bengalis) are disappointed and/or angry with Pakistan. **You have already lost one community aka East Pakistan, so how will you pacify balochis, sindhis etc when you are even losing your core base over time?

Ultimately, aside from emotional attachment, **what difference would it make to me if there are more provinces or the CPEC route actually goes through KP and balochistan as promised instead of going through Lahore? Not much as I don’t have any kickbacks on one route or the other that is affecting me. Your own KP CM who is also angry about it as PTI would stand to benefit from any CPEC activity.

You are a very reasonable critic, and I’ve always enjoyed my discussions with you despite the fact we are hardly ever on the same page. I actually really respect you the fact that despite having your reservations with Immy’s ill calculated moves, you have never in principal tried to trivialise his quest for free and fair elections and undermine his struggle get electoral rigging investigated. This is something I cannot say about vast majority of PTI critics here including the ones who enjoy all the fruits of fair and transparent Western democracies. Imran may be would not have taken all those stupid decision if he’s perfectly democratic and legal demand to get some constituencies investigated was fulfilled long time ago.

My issue is with people like Moonstar who want to remind us that how Punjabis are so hated in Karachi, but conveniently ignore the fact that it was Altaf Hussain and MQM who constantly bad mouthed Punjabis in the days leading up to NA-246. Sindhis also conveniently start crying about Punjabis when PPP is not in power in Punjab. These people want to whine about ‘ethnic bias’ yet do not want to admit that blind ethnic based voting is actually a bane of their province, not Punjab. So much for hating Punjabis and accusing them ethnic bias, it is actually Punjabis that had never elected or popularly supported a leader simply on the basis of ethnicity or language. It is in Punjab that Sindhis can get a resolution passed for Saraiki province yet not a single flower pot gets broken anywhere in Punjab. Yet neither MQM or PPP apologists want to admit that kind of violence and racism that follows in Sindh every time the division of Sindh remotely gets mainstream. You can proudly rationalise why Punjabis are hated in Karachi, but it is in evil Punjab that Muhajirs never faced any backlash at the hight of MQM’s racist propaganda campaign, they happily escaped Karachi and found acceptance in Lahore in 90s. It is in evil Punjab that Sindhi feudal enjoyed grass root support and votes.

If people of Karachi do not support Imran because they are still so traumatised by Imran vs Miandad rivalry (as per Moonstar) so that’s fine. I can’t even be bothered to feel disgusted. I have realised that Imran can only stay in politics of so long, I have no wild fantasises of him liberating Sindh or Karachi. He needs to focus on things/regions/attitude/practices where he can make a change - any kind of change. Even in our back garden, there are certain rows and strips which are slightly more fertile than than others (by nature!), and my Mother usually focus on those strips of the land when she wants to grow fruits and vegetables. Simply because her time and energies are precious. If the same rule also hold true for a country, so be it. I am not here to convince Muhajirs and Sindhis to vote for a non ethnically aligned party of the present time. As long as they let go of this munfaqat of voting for their ethnic parties (despite the criminality), but hoping for Punjabis to let them out of their miseries, their opinions is not my my headache.

Karachi is certainly a diverse city. But the kind of diversity we are talking about Punjab where ethnic minorities are settled all over the province in mixed neighbourhoods of big cities to small town, not just ghettos. It’s the kind of diversity where everyone has access to socio-economic and geographical mobility. The kind of diversity where integration happens most naturally and happily. I have absolutely no respect for that disgusting sons of soil versus outsiders mentality. Neither Punjabi language or Punjabis are endangered species where we need lousy nationalists to disturb the local peace and create more tensions. Everyone in Punjab has a mixed heritage. There’s no such thing as 100% local blood.

As long as we have idiots who rationalise hatred against the a massive ethnic group over what a tiny political elite of that region does, I am not surprised why Punjabis are hated. All I know that it is in Punjab that people of all ethnicities enjoy greater rate of social and inter-ethnic harmony than anywhere else in Pakistan. Something is obviously wrong with people outside of Punjab given the rate of inter-ethnic violence and bigotry in their backyard.

Be pleased that Punjabis are hated. Celebrate. But those idiots who act like apologists for racism which actually results in loss of innocent lives shouldn’t moan and groan when MQM and PPP’s criminality is also generalised on their communities. If Punjabis’ identity lies with whatever PMLN does in power, than what would be Muhajir or Sindhi community’s identity given the glorious track record of party that claim to represent them?