Should Punjab carry Pakistan's burden?

[khoji]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden

@Ali_Syed

There are very few countries in the world having such uneven development as well. More than creating 40-50 provinces,** I believe devolution of power through an effective local government system is the way to go**.

I think this is a good idea. Problem with creating more provinces is that people equate nationality with province. There will be a lot of violence if Sindh is divided in anyway, for example.
Instead, strong local government is the answer to empowering the neglected areas. If everyone is running their own place then they won’t be able to put blame on others for their troubles. There will be more national harmony.

[Jolie]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden

I support creating of new provinces but creating them for furthering ethnic and linguistic divide adds to already existing problems. Punjab should be divided into at least three to four different provinces however just creating just a saraikee sooba for political gain and moving on is not part of the solution.

One another crucial issue which I feel is so underrated, in fact, hardly every talked about is the whole unfair electoral advantage Punjab has over other provinces. This ‘whoever wins Punjab rules Pakistan’ system has to go. There has to be some kind of electoral reform to reduce the number of seats Punjab gets. I don’t know I haven’t done enough research to come up with any specific preference but the idea is there. Talking of electoral reform, I always believed that Pakistan should be a presidential style democracy.

[kakaballi]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden

^ all provinces are already equally represented in senate and you cannot pass a law without approval of senate.

it is only natural for democracies that if you have approval from populous areas, you get more chances of getting into power. on the whole, looking at history, you can see that people from Punjab (not establishment) have been more accepting of leaders from other provinces. the reverse (for understandable reasons) is not true.

i think presidential system might be good, but eventually unless federal government devolves powers to district level, not much can be achieved. it is disgusting how Shahbaz sharif talked about metro bus in Karachi. it should be for Karachi govt to decide what kind of transport system they want.

federal govt should only have defence, foreign policy, monetary and fiscal policy, law and order, inter provincial issues and economic and social sector policy making powers.

[ajazali]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden?

Pti jiyalas kis had tak ja sktay hain mujhe ab andaza ho raha hai. Believe me pti jiyalas!!! the approach you have toward society clearly shows you are going to be lost in next election.

[Ali_Syed]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden?

@ajazali

Pti jiyalas kis had tak ja sktay hain mujhe ab andaza ho raha hai. Believe me pti jiyalas!!! the approach you have toward society clearly shows you are going to be lost in next election.

Can you please elaborate? This article has not been written by a PTIAN.

[ajazali]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden?

@Ali_Syed

Can you please elaborate? This article has not been written by a PTIAN.

If the writer is an idiot then article is not worth sharing. Considering the article is a bunch of stupid ideas, what you want to make out of it? Mockery??? fun??? Or an attempt to vent your feeling of loosing election in punjab???

[Ali_Syed]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden?

@ajazali

If the writer is an idiot then article is not worth sharing. Considering the article is a bunch of stupid ideas, what you want to make out of it? Mockery??? fun??? Or an attempt to vent your feeling of loosing election in punjab???

There are genuine grievances of smaller provinces towards Punjab and the time is long gone when we could just sweep them under the carpet and believe that every thing is hunky dory. Without discussing the problems how do you expect to address them? Last but not least I think no one needs certificates of patriotism from others.

[Iconoclast]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden

@khoji

Is he calling for the break up of Pakistan? If so then he will find many allies in smaller provinces wanting the same.
The writer says that Punjab is developing much faster than the rest of Pakistan. Those guys have been saying it for a long time.

If the writer thinks that this development in his province is due to the efforts of its own government then how would he explain far less development on Siraiki areas of Punjab? They also share the same government as the northern Punjab, yet are far less developed.

Traitors in London and his followers will always dream of break up of country but sorry aint gonna happen, concentrate n money laundering case. How do you explain far more development in Karachi then rest of Sindh.

[ajazali]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden?

^ Its not about patriotism its about jiyalaism. Whatever your argument is, approach is not constructive nor it is going to impress people of punjab to win you next election. Chor ko chori kartay dekh lo to B ap osay mana nahi sktay k tum chor ho. Respect is not given its earned. Not that i agree with author but criticism is not constructive.
Before the elections, i didnt come across a single pti jiyala complaining against punjab this way.

[Ali_Syed]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden?

@ajazali

^ Its not about patriotism its about jiyalaism. Whatever your argument is, approach is not constructive nor it is going to impress people of punjab to win you next election. Chor ko chori kartay dekh lo to B ap osay mana nahi sktay k tum chor ho. Respect is not given its earned. Not that i agree with author but criticism is not constructive.
Before the elections, i didnt come across a single pti jiyala complaining against punjab this way.

It’s obvious you have not been reading my threads before the elections, I will call wrong as wrong, will not let my ethnicity blind me.

[ajazali]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden?

before election, it was govt of punjab as showbaz, now it is punjab itself. as soon pti jiyalas realized their victory in kpk and loss in punjab, they started the debates on punjab’s victimization of other provinces.

[Iconoclast]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden?

Poplutaion of Punjab 55% Bugdet 871 billion (44%)
Polutaion of Sindh 23% Budget 617 billion (31.2%)
Population KPK 13.5% Budget344 billion
Population of Balochistan 5% Budget 198 billion (10%)
Theseare budget figures of 2013-14 . Punjab gest **LEAST money per capita, Balochistan****MOST **per capita. Sindh gets more than KPK and Punjab percapita and less than Balochistan.

[kakaballi]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden?

@ajazali

before election, it was govt of punjab as showbaz, now it is punjab itself. as soon pti jiyalas realized their victory in kpk and loss in punjab, they started the debates on punjab’s victimization of other provinces.

@ajazali

If the writer is an idiot then article is not worth sharing. Considering the article is a bunch of stupid ideas, what you want to make out of it? Mockery??? fun??? Or an attempt to vent your feeling of loosing election in punjab???

@ajazali

Pti jiyalas kis had tak ja sktay hain mujhe ab andaza ho raha hai. Believe me pti jiyalas!!! the approach you have toward society clearly shows you are going to be lost in next election.

I’ll reply to you in your words…

@ajazali

^ . Whatever your argument is, approach is not constructive…

You have yet to quote anything tangible that describes anyone saying anything ‘against Punjab’. Please demonstrate how things have changed after elections after reading this thread:

http://www.paklinks.com/gs/pakistan-affairs/497065-proposed-new-provinces-for-pakistan-need-of-the-hour.html

[Ali_Syed]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden?

@ajazali

before election, it was govt of punjab as showbaz, now it is punjab itself. as soon pti jiyalas realized their victory in kpk and loss in punjab, they started the debates on punjab’s victimization of other provinces.

Can you pinpoint what you consider is against Punjab in the article and then we will discuss. This and many more threads we discussed before the elections. http://www.paklinks.com/gs/pakistan-affairs/589770-composition-of-pakistan-army.html

[Sa1eem]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden

@kakaballi

This is sort of a myth that most of Tax is ‘raised’ from Karachi. Collected, yes, raised, no. Most of our income tax comes from corporations and salaried individuals and most headquarters of corporations are based in Karachi. Income tax paid by, for example, Engro would be ‘collected’ in Karachi, regardless where the plants are located. And, for example, income tax collected by MCB from all its employees would eventually be collected in Karachi where the head office is based, regardless where the employees are based.

Same is the case with import duties, sales tax on import/export, custom duties. Regardless where the industry is based, these taxes are collected at Karachi port.

Karachi contributes 20% of GDP of Pakistan… that is true. Karachi contributes 70% to revenues, that is BS. Sorry for being so blunt.

Brother, when you do not know something or want to stay blind of the facts then do not comment. Anyhow, since you raised the issue justifying what is untrue, I think it is appropriate to clearly that.

Forget corporate tax and import duties and propaganda based on that (what people outside Karachi like to do) … let look at figures more closely.

Agriculture: 21 % of GDP
Industry: 25 % of GDP
Services: 54 % of GDP

For tax purpose, other than agriculture, one another category that comes in industry (not agriculture) and is large part of Pakistani economy outside Karachi, is paying no tax or paying negligible tax. That is … Horticulture, animal farming, mining and quarrying.

Pakistan economic activities are further divided into two categories, rural and urban economic activities.

Most service sector of rural economy, small town and cities in Pakistan pay no tax.

So, you can easily exclude around 60% to 65% of Pakistan economy that contributes nothing to federal tax collection, and most are outside Karachi.

Population of Karachi is 10 % of Pakistan, and most are economically active. Karachi economy is around 25% of Pakistan economy and that is mostly taxed (at least 80% of Karachi taxable economy is taxed). …

So, if 35% of Pakistan economy is taxed, at least 20% of that taxed economy (or at least 60%) is from Karachi … in other words, most tax collected by federal government, from 60% to 70% comes from Karachi … and FBR collection figures itself is proof of that.

[Afat]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden?

Ok … instead of rhetoric and propaganda… just give us figures … with verifiable source …

1- Total Tax collected
2- Tax collected in Karachi .

..PS … Taxes are around 8.2 % to 8.8 % of GDP at the moment .

around 33-35 % are Direct taxes …the rest 65-67% Indirect taxes..

now please give us the figures …of

Direct Taxes collected at karachi
indirect taxes collected at karachi ..

this will settle thing for once and all …

[kakaballi]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden?

^ There are no such figures available. For Sa1eem bhai’s post, it was 10% facts, 90% fiction, and I won’t spend time discussing fairy tales.

I can give several factual examples with figures where tax collected by industry and companies throughout Pakistan is paid to FBR in Karachi. Please open another thread if anyone wants to discuss that (except for those who make up facts, figures and percentages).

[khoji]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden

@Iconoclast

Traitors in London and his followers will always dream of break up of country but sorry aint gonna happen, concentrate n money laundering case. How do you explain far more development in Karachi then rest of Sindh.

It is your sheer hatred that made you think that I was talking about Altaf or MQM. You the only “patriots” never seem to notice people like Jeay Sindh or Baloch Liberation Army. And these are just the two examples.
It is not surprising to see hatred filled post coming from YOU. For obvious reasons, you only show up when you see a need to spew hatred against Urdu speaking people in the guise of abusing MQM.

Anyone who thinks that Punjab should not take Pakistan’s burden then he will allies with many folks in smaller provinces.

[khoji]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden?

@kakaballi

^ There are no such figures available. For Sa1eem bhai’s post, it was 10% facts, 90% fiction, and I won’t spend time discussing fairy tales.

I can give several factual examples with figures where tax collected by industry and companies throughout Pakistan is paid to FBR in Karachi. **Please open another thread **if anyone wants to discuss that (except for those who make up facts, figures and percentages).

I think this is a good idea. I would also like to see what exactly the truth is. Because we get different figures from different people.

[ajazali]

Re: Should Punjab carry Pakistan’s burden?

@kakaballi

I’ll reply to you in your words…

You have yet to quote anything tangible that describes anyone saying anything ‘against Punjab’. Please demonstrate how things have changed after elections after reading this thread:

http://www.paklinks.com/gs/pakistan-affairs/497065-proposed-new-provinces-for-pakistan-need-of-the-hour.html

in post #6 Ali implied that punjab is causing terrorism in karachi, show me his any other post implying same in some thread on terrorism in karachi.