Should Pakistan Apply For A Place In Guinness Book Of World Records?

Last year in November (2007), Pakistan had $16.6 billion reserves, $40 billion external debt, Rs 2400 billion internal debt … Rupee was stable at Rs 60, Real GDP increasing at the rate of 7 percent a year, Per capita income reaching $1080, Pakistan international credit rating was extremely good, Stock market was over 15000 and businesses were booming, consumption and standard of living was rising fast, country was developing and progressing … etc. etc. etc.

Then black shadow of thugs and crooks overshadowed Pakistan. Ganja and Widower took hold of the country and today, not even a year has passed, as in Oct 2008, reserves got reduced to less than $7 billion, external debt increased to around $50 billion (soon it would be more … as Pakistan is running from fence to post begging for more dollars, so that Ganja and Widower could increase their dollar wealth), rupee devalued to Rs 84 per dollar, internal debt increased to Rs 3400 billion, GDP is expected to increase around 3 percent, per capita income gone down to $800 (due to devaluation), Stock market after losing around 40 percent was put on suspension in late August 2008, Pakistan international rating plummeted to level of bankrupt country, consumption and standard of living plummeted, poverty increased by 10 percent from less than 23 percent to over 33 percent (could be more), country started going on path of misery, beggary, destruction, and declination.

Situation is such that we can ask ‘Guinness Book of World Records’ to put Pakistan in their ‘Records book’ as a country where thugs could change the economical situation of that country so quickly, that it is unimaginable. Now, I am looking for ways how we can ask the publisher of ‘Guinness Book of World Records’ to include this record in their book of records. Can anyone advice?

Re: Should Pakistan Apply For A Place In Guinness Book Of World Records?

I do not think so this is the case. Actually people doing hedging in the west did all this. They raised the prices of crude oil, cooking oil and food items unrealisticially which led to the destruction of poor countries resources and Pakistan

Re: Should Pakistan Apply For A Place In Guinness Book Of World Records?

In addition we should also put this in the Guiness Book:

A country called Pakistan has the highest record of military mafia taking over again and again.
Our Generals also broke the record of selling their nation out to thieves who rule us now.

In 8 years of his (Mush) rule, he did not try to nurture new honest leadership, instead gave Pakistan to chaudhrys of Gujrat and now to waderas of Sind. Had he been sincere to this country (which he ofcourse was not) we would surely not have been in the mess we are in today.

Down with Mush!!

Re: Should Pakistan Apply For A Place In Guinness Book Of World Records?

Brother saleem i really appreciate ur concern.
first of all it is very basic of economics that something cannot go wrong all of the sudden, and if does it is very temporary eg) crash after 9/11 incident.

it was a bubble economy that was supposed to burst anyways. normal citizens of pakistan heard that economy is booming and there is alot of money in stock market and they put there savings in to it and all the stocks went up (specially banks, oil/ gas, and fertilizers) and when big saith's did profit taking the economy came down.

and now coming to "ganja and widower" i hate both of em, and i hate choudharies and i hate Musharaf, so basically i dislike all of em. so leme tell u the major reason of economy going down : Law and order. suicide bombings and all the bad law and order situation is inherited from the Musharaf government. Just cuz of this issue all the overseas companies took their business out of pakistan cuz they dont feel safe and now we are back to square one, which is agriculture.

and i repeat, even if u do a smallest course of economics from any good university in the world they would tell u that one year is nothing to make a country go bankrupt specially when the economy is booming and ur stock market wins the "fastest growing stock market of the world award" in 2004. i hate ur mota and ganja but m forced to say that economy is down cuz of the same person who made it go up.

Re: Should Pakistan Apply For A Place In Guinness Book Of World Records?

We should also enter into the book of records as to how a single military dictator defied the 'one coup per dictator' rule last time. That's gotta be a first.

Re: Should Pakistan Apply For A Place In Guinness Book Of World Records?

It would be unfair to put all blame to this administration (same goes for the previous government). The credit crunch which started in late 2007 is now at "it's best", and all world economies are suffering from it. Dilema with Pakistan is that we don't have flexible revenue generation resources. Since global markets for OUR products have slowed down, we failed to increase our income, which is now reflected on our foreign reseves.

Re: Should Pakistan Apply For A Place In Guinness Book Of World Records?

Bhaiyon te Bhenon

We get a kick out blaming each other and playing politics rather than figuring out how to correct this mess irrespective of whose fault it is. Pakistanis live in the present and the past but not in the future.

Ah, what wonderful days of Unprecedented Economic Growth under the leadership of former President, the Great Pervez Musharaf, the Greatest Pakistani leader since Quaid-e-Azam.

Inshallah Pakistan will reach the same heights again. But the question remains, will it take another military person to do this?

Basics of economics ... you mean, 10 percent for Zardari, 10 percent plus a bit for Nawaz ... and liars like Ahsan Iqbal and Ishaq Darr to cover things for some bones? :) Well, when thieves are on loose in a country, basics of economics do not work.

And yea, nothing went wrong all of a sudden, economical condition is fine but deteriorating fast as trust on those running the country is not there, so people are cashing their assets and running out of country, so country is getting poor day by day. Due to appearance of thugs like 'NS' and 'Z' in the corridors of power, an estimate is that Pakistan lost around $60 billion (foreign currency from open market) in flight of capital. That caused not only rupee to devalue around 45 percent (Rs 60 to Rs 85) in last 6 months, but Pakistan state bank had to pay cost of imports (something Pakistan was paying from open market), causing state bank reserves to deplete.

Now do not tell me that you do not know how much is $60 billion dollars and what havoc such flight of capital could do to the economy of Pakistan, with exports of around $20 billion a year ($60 billion is 3 years export for Pakistan ... or approximate value in dollars of Pakistan entire wheat production during last 10 to 12 years ... or for that matter, Pakistan total external debt until last year was $40 billion). Today, Pakistan is begging for few million dollars from every passerby Pakistan could find. [In 1999, Pakistan export was $7.4 billion]

[Another fact is that Zardari this time is doing everything to save Pakistan from collapsing, but his reputation and reputation of PMLN thugs are scaring people and their money away from Pakistan. On top of that, PMLN thugs have not learned and since these mega crooks lowly people do not care for Pakistan or poor of Pakistan, they are doing their best to destroy Pakistani economy].

[quote]
it was a bubble economy that was supposed to burst anyways. normal citizens of pakistan heard that economy is booming and there is alot of money in stock market and they put there savings in to it and all the stocks went up (specially banks, oil/ gas, and fertilizers) and when big saith's did profit taking the economy came down.
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Did liars and donkeys like Ishaq Daar, Ahsan Iqbal, Nawaz Ganja, etc ... told you that development and progress of last 8 years in Pakistani economy was bubble? :) I think that you should stop taking classes in economics from people who are world known crooks and thugs. Fact is that only idiots, liars, or completely ignorant could say that last 8 years of development and progress that Pakistan made in economy was bubble.

In bubble economy, prices go up but profits of businesses, that depends on real output of goods and services, and income from those businesses do not go up. In such economy, businesses work on 1 or 2 percent return, not on return of 10 percent or more. If Pakistani economy was bubble, it would have shown in p/e of Pakistani stocks ... or if p/e is high than in devaluation of rupees. Reason is that, even if rupee return may go high, it is impossible for companies to give huge return in dollars (foreign currencies) if economy is bubble economy. Since Pakistani rupee did not lose its value and exchange rate was stable, than if Pakistani economy was bubble then stock market dividend would not have increased (especially in dollars). For instance:

Let give you example of NIT (for convenience ... something that can be checked from newspapers too ... or from anyone who hold NIT) as it is mutual fund and represents how average shares did ... that means, how average shares were performing and if the economy was bubble or based on real return. For instance, whatever dividend NIT was paying, they were getting it from companies they had, and it was not Musharraf who was giving them from his own pocket to pay people. NIT dividend payments and unit price represent average returns of Pakistani shares (as theit unit price is related to their Net Asset value).

In 1999, their dividend was around 40 paisa and value of NIT was around Rs 7.00, but dividend in 2008 was Rs 6.50 and NIT unit price increased to Rs 64.00.

Now only an idiot (a person with no ability to think) would think that NIT (Pakistan largest mutual fund) that was worth Rs 64.00 at one time in 2008 was bubble price when dividend it paid was Rs 6.50. Anyhow, because of these crooks and thugs in power, even when dividend was Rs 6.50 paid in July 2008, NIT unit price gone down to Rs 33 and expected to open at Rs 25 when stock market would start doing normal business.

This is their record of dividend per unit and NIT unit price: ...
2002: Rs 1.20 dividend ($0.02) ... NIT unit in June Rs 10.89
2003: Rs 1.75 dividend ($0.035) ... NIT unit in June Rs 20.58
2004: Rs 2.55 dividend ($0.042) ... NIT unit in June Rs 30.53
2005: Rs 3.30 dividend ($0.055) ... NIT unit in June Rs 38.12
2006: Rs 5.80 dividend ($0.093) ... NIT unit in June Rs 43.07
2007: Rs 6.20 dividend ($0.103) ... NIT unit in June Rs 62.38
2008: Rs 6.50 dividend ($0.109) ... NIT unit in June Rs 56.18

Now, does it look to you that price of NIT was bubble price? Since NIT has shares in almost 90 percent of KSE companies, one can say that their return (dividend and price) fairly represents stock market and that if prices of shares were bubble or real.

I would leave rest of your post without going through it, as I know that with mind of propagandist or one who may have set mind of 'may na manu', one cannot explain anything :) Anyhow, if you want to talk about any specifics, please be free to ask for explanation.

Re: Should Pakistan Apply For A Place In Guinness Book Of World Records?

sa1eem! u can post whatever fudged up number you want. The point of the fact is the house of cards is crumbling, and the blame should be distributed evenly. The previous govt. of Pervez Musharraf is as much responsible for the current chaos as the current. And btw, the current govt hasn't even been in power for less than a year, so they can't take the entire blame. The previous govt. had 8 years to build a sand castle.

Oh and btw...how come the ppl of PDF dont take u as seriously? i thought it was just the ppl here :CareBear:

So you see, when you make it a fight of the ego and dont have the courage to be honest, people will discredit you pretty quick. So please, be a fair person like you were in the other Thuggery thread, and point the fingers at the right people.

Can you please tell us how "Ganja" is in power and how he took control of the country? Thanks.

Ganja is coalition partner of Zardari. But most important thing is that, father in law of Nawaz Ganja’s daughter, Ishaq Dagga, from party of PML(Thuggus), started the turmoil in Pakistani economy by telling all in April 2008 that even though he is finance minister, he is expert liar, lies blatantly, thinks people around him are stupid, still he is mentally so retard that he could not even understand figures. After his briefing on TV, people must have felt scared realising types of Thugs who were expected to run the economy. Before that, people were still investing and KSE reached its height on 18th April, but thinking about Ishaq Dagga on driving seat, people started losing their sleep, and then flight of capital in big way started.

Plus, mantra of ‘Ganja Thug’ and his paid mulazims in media and judiciary that … Musharraf hatao, Choor ko Chief Justice banao, Ganjay kay sir pay tail lagao, Ganjay kay bhai ‘chotay thug’ ko Punjab kee hukumat dilwao, her tarah say mulk ka bera garaq karwayo … etc etc … also cost Pakistan a lot.

Anyhow, a nice cartoon, full of facts and figures, for those who do qawwali and sings that present crisis is due to previous government, a government who picked Pakistan bankrupt economy under ‘Ganja thug’ and gave it some substance during last 8 years, that this government of ‘daku’ is blowing away (even though cartoon shows that KSE was 2000 and reserves was 600 million, actually KSE was below 1200, and liquid reserves was around $200 when Musharraf took over. But does it matter? … As even what is mentioned in cartoon tells a lot).

Re: Should Pakistan Apply For A Place In Guinness Book Of World Records?

Bro. Its the first time in my entire life that i read such a long post, normally i just ignore em but i read this one cuz it was a reply my post.
impressed by your knowledge.

no offence but just as an extra info, m not taking any economics classes from "Ganja and Zardari", i guess u missed the part where i said twice that i hate Nawaz Shareef and i hate Zardari, and yeah i hate Musharaf aswell. yeah but i have took some economics classes b4 in my life and alhumdulilah thats y i think that m a sub broker now and my specializations are New york stock exchange and Chicago merchantile exchange and chicago board of trade.

i have had some exposure to Karachi stock exchange aswell (specially in banking, oil & gas, and fertilizer sector) but when i learnt that wats the criteria of stocks going up and down in KSE, i just left it.

When we say bubble economy we are generally talking about Real Estate, banking sector, major stock prices, and how they hiked. we are not talking about foriegn reserves or GDP.
i hope i made this one clear.

and brother no offence again but u r biased :) and my post was nuetral, i explained that i hate all of em, i dont have any soft corner in my heart for sharif and zardari, all i said is they blame should be distributed as the current government is holding almost the same monetary policies that were held by ur favourite Musharaf. all the international investors are leaving the country cuz they know they are not safe in pakistan and law and order situation is far from perfect :) isnt it fare enough?

as i m not much into pakistani economy i would love to know the difference between Musharaf and zardari monetary policies.

Ps. NIT was something that i had to Google, nice addition to my knowledge, thanks for that.

I still don't get it, how was NAWAZ in "power" and how he took "control" of the country. I can understand Zardari was in control of the country before becoming President. Are you saying Nawaz is in similar controller of PML-N as Zardari is of PPP and all PML-N MNAs have to act according to Nawaz directions? Ishaq Dar spoke what Nawaz wanted him to speak regarding the speech he made?

No hes not, but Altaf Kaaliya is.

Re: Should Pakistan Apply For A Place In Guinness Book Of World Records?

Its amazing. I said 2 years ago our stock market was over valued, unstable and would crash. Odd that Saleem never agreed with me then. But then again Saleem should take some O level economic courses before he posts stuff.