Re: Senior Indian politician expelled
Brother! Have you been able to really sideline these Indian Hindu Talibaans? Have you really achieved total peace, harmony, and tolerance in your society as you claimed in your earlier posts?...or you are living in a state of denial ???
I think you are confused. In this thread you claimed that Indian society has achieved harmony and tolerance and now you are ashamed of these Modis and Varuns..and you want us to believe that Indian society is not threatened with this mentality and these idiots don't have any significant infulence in Indian politics and society...
Either you are confused, or you are living in a state of denial or you are trying to fool us...with due respect brother !!!
Yes brother, we have been so far able to sideline these Hindu Indian Talibaans. I never claimed in my earlier post that we have achieved total peace, hormony and tolrance in our society. Yet we have done remarkably well in this field. As the sidelining of these talibaans are concerned, we were able to keep them out of power in two consecutive elections. This speaks for itself if U are comfortable in accepting the reality.
Not now brother, if u read my other posts related to these matters, I have frequently written that I m ashamed of whatever wrong have been done to muslims in India. Looks like U didnt care to read my boaring post carefully where I had clearly written that we feel threatened by growing religious fundamentalism in India. *Had these reigious fundamentalists really have any effect on Indian society, than muslims in India would have long back deprived of equal rights in Indian republic. Just like religious minorities doesnt have equal rights in Pakistan. Hope this time U understand me better. *
So neither I m confused, nor I m in state of denial. And I cant even think of making U Fool.
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Sorry brother if my post gave you that impression. You have every right to express your opinion even if you feel something not exactly comfortable against Islam as being less tolerant...
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Nothing to say sorry for. But I seriously feel that muslims must realize that if someone doesnt subscribe to ur religious ideology that it doesnt mean that he hates U or he is ur enemy. We need to learn how to respect other's beliefs even if we have different set of beliefs from them.
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Look what I meant from my post was that a certain Muslim hate mentality exist in you society (and I am not critisizing you personally)>>>
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Brother hatred is a part of human nature. He needs to hate someone. And I m sorry to say this, but religion has played a very vital part in inciting hate bacteria within humans. Why not have a look on Muslims itself? U can very well judge how much hatred is there between various sects of Muslims which results in sectarian organizations like Sipah E Sahaba or Lashker E Jangvi or whatever is it.
So when two entirely opposite religions like Hindus and Muslims will live together than its natural that someone will hate ther other group. Here U have singled out hindus hating muslims, do u feel that some muslims in India dont hate hindus? So I think that if U want to belittle our secularism by giving example of some hindus hating muslims than its totally irrrelevent.
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If you deny this statement let me convey you what I think...you live in a state of denial !!!
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Only a foolish can deny any such statement. Fact of the matter is that human hate humans. And it happens in each and every society. If U want to thrust this upon India only than I will think that U are awfully biased.
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These religious extremist exist in your country and they do play an important rople in shaping the society, public opinion, media,a nd politics...and their infulence is growing in India !!q
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These religious extremists do exist in my country and in each and every country of the world. Even if the country is muslim's only country. Rest of ur statement is baseless and false. They have always been sidelined and will be sidelined always. InshaAllah.
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Don't even try to invent some new Indain brand of secularism..and don't try to confuse the matter like some posters with extremist Islamist views try to confuse the matter with definitions. Secularism is just separation of church and government. An ideal situation in a secularist sountry should be that anyone seeking public office should keep his religious beliefs aside. No political party is allowed to form a party in the name of religion and persue poilitical career. In a secular society religion and ploitics don't go together.
Is it the case in India
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No we have INDIAN UNION MUSLIM LEGUE in India. They have been part of our governments. Inquire about Sahahuddin Owesi and GM Banatwala from ur Indian friends.
And we have BJP who are believed to be right wing hindu party.
But yes our government has never been influenced by religion in past and present.
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I am sorry I do not see peace tv and the clown... a I am unable to comment anything being done by this magician/comedian who infact has nothing to do with Islam !!!
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LOL ya he is a good standing comadian for sure. And he is believed to be a very respectable figure of Islam and internationally admired by muslilms. I dont know why U dont like him anyways.
But the point I wanted to drive home was that even this CLOWN is able to mock the religion of majority hindus in India frequently. And still his channal in on air as usual and he has never been persecuted or hounded.
Do U see the difference this time???
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Yes they are!!
They are often called Kantwas by majority population and are subjected to prejuidice behaviour and bullyed often by the government officials. I can give you one thousand examples. They are seen as suspect terrorist and general main stream population and the government does not trust muslms at all. If you are denying all this I think just out of your patriotism you are trying to fool us. There are people in this forum who do know the ground realities in India and are not as naive as you think generally are !!!
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LOL actually ur perception of muslims is of righteous and religious individuals who can do no wrong. But reality is just opposit my dear brother. Yes hindus call them Katwas (circumcised) but they too call us ****ALS( One who keep long choti) and Khichdikhors( Khichdi eaters), and KANDU (A vegetable) and as U can see some muslims call us Bhindians. LOL. U will be surprised to know that I call my friends katwas and they call me ****l, and kandu. So does that makes hindus or muslims opressed? I m surprised to hear ur judgement brother.
Muslims are not opressed brother, Muslims in India are mafia dons and they rule some cities of India by their violent behaviour. Ask about Syed Shabuddin, Mukhtar Ansari, Chota Shakeel, MMA Fatmi (who was minister in previous government) and hoards of another dons in Indian society who happens to be muslims. U cant show me one thousand examples of Indian officials bullying muslims but I can show U equal numbers of examples where hindus have been opressed and are being opressed by muslim strongmen. So better leave this opressed theory. I cant deny certain biases on both sides but U are hell bent to blame only hindus for every wrong doing and painting muslims as saints which is not the fact brother. stop the blame game and come to India to study the ground realities. I promise that U wont be misbehaved, U can have words of an Indian and hindu for it.
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Your different statements are themselves self contradictory. First you claimed India has achieved peace, harmony and tolerance. Then you are ashamed of Modis and Varuns...then you are trying to fool us that these guys do not play a significant role in your politics.
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I said that we have almost achieved peach , hormony and tolrance. Indian society reflects this fact if U see with unbiased glasses. But if U dream of a utopian society in India, than yes we are not one. I dont know why presence of Modis and Varuns looks amazing to U in India. Why dont accept a simple fact that ppls like them are essential part of any society, its sad but true. And yes, they dont play a **SIGNIFICANT **role in Indian society otherwise they would have formed goverenment at the centre and wouldnt have been defeated. why cant swallow a simple truth???
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You may not like these Varuns and Modis but saying they have no infulence is really to big a lie...also Hamid Gul and Bailullah Mehsud do not hold a public office (against Modi who is the CM of Gujrat)...but yet they have an infulence...Hamid Gul at one time was the chief of ISI...
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I dont say they have no influence, but they have a very little influence on a section of society. Modi is elected CM of Gujrat which forms less than 5% of Indian population. this is a truth. But he is well under check of Central government and cant make his evil desire possible is also a truth. Have U seen about a single anti muslsim riot after that shameful riot of 2002? Are muslims in Gujrat anything less free to practise their religion than rest of India? U can ask ur Indian friends about this.
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We in Pakistan now have come out of our state of denial...it's high time my sane Indian friends also do the same !!!
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So U admit that hindus in Jinnah's Pakistan have not been given equal rights like their muslim counterparts while muslims in Gandhi's India enjoy equal religious and political rights??? Ur Indian friends are not in state of denial brother, we do accept our short comings but plz dont expect us to accept what we have not done or not doing.
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My dear brother...
Sometimes my Indian muslim friends change their names or don't tell their real names in public...
Are you trying to fool us or you are not in touch with the ground realities in India...
I think you are confused !!!
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LOL at ur bias brother, have U ever asked ur Indian muslim friend when they have to change their names in public? its only when they are passisng through some communally sensitive area which has hindu majority. Than ask them whether they know of hindus too who have to change their names while passing through cummunally sensitive Muslim majority areas.U will get ur answer. and only than U will realize that U are making a mountain of a mole. These things are unfortunate but these things do happen in such mixed societies. Why U are hell bent to demonize hindus only?
And perhaps U forgot that these same opressed muslims of India had once forced Indian government to roll back Supreme Court of India's decision when they felt that order has collided with their personal laws. U can ask ur Indian friend about that or simply google SHAH BANO CASE.
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In your mind you have made India as an idealistic country, but in reality it is far from what you have concieved. You are just living in your dreamland and you are to afraid to face reality. Please my brother unless people like you do not come out of their state of denial, you will not be able to improve things in your country... Jaswant Singh just tried to open your closed eyes which you are too afraid to open !!!
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Brother the fact is that U want to hear what U like to hear. Jaswant Singh was a religious bigot form the begening of his political carreer. Reason is that whole India knows his party was an extremist party but he didnt. Today when he smells that his political carreer is ending with his party biting dust in elections, he need to earn some fast bucks. Overnight he becoms secularist and start praising Jinnah, and bashing Sardar Patel.
Anyways, India is not an idealistic country in my mind. But still it has achieved so much in terms of tolrance and religious harmony. That is the reason that inspite of so many religions, we are successful in coexisting together. Some exceptions are there, but they are mere exceptions.
Hope U understand brother.
Peace to U.