Science as Religion

[USResident]

Re: Science as Religion

@vineshvk

Well said light bearer. I would like to ask USA resident, to prove the theory of God. Religion pre defines god and explain everything on the basis of that. I would say, religion is easy because once u create a supernatural assumption then nothing that is natural can disapprove the assumption.

See you have a different perspective of religion. Religion has become a man made term. Religion should have been simply Gods message to us. Every thing humans do even theorize is finite and cannot be compared to God. Thats the whole point of Gods message. To find yourself and your place in this universe he has created and filled with abundant signs. If after seeing all these you can't think that some higher power created all this and controls it then you are totally blind. He created this universe, created humans, put us in here to test us and sent his message to us to understand so that we can pass this test. He did not leave us high and dry. Everything in his message is crystal clear. You do this then you haved passed this test of life, if you don't then you have failed. Science can only explain phenomena's that begin and end with a material point.

You are out here trying to prove God exists as if you can hold him in the palm of your hand. Gods message said you cannot fathom him. You can only understand about him what he has allowed you to understand. You can try beyond that point but it will be in vain and you will be lost as you are now. All these signs in the universe i.e. sun, moon and galaxies, earth, living species are evidence that someone created them and thats as far as you can see things. You cannot look beyond that because the beyond that is the world of the unseen, and that is what you have to believe in as long as you are living. You become part of that unseen world once you die. God did not give humans the senses to fathom the unseen, in order for you to believe in it he created all these signs. If after seeing all this you still find it hard to believe then its to your detriment.

Bottomline, in your heart you know he exists and you can run away as much as you want because your mind plays tricks and delve into all sorts of foolish theories however when your time comes you will not be in denial however it might be too late. I ask all of those trying theorize Allah to once in your life sincerely and with a clear conscience read Quran and see what God has to say. If you read it with the intention to find mistakes or prove something else you will not get the message from it. For it is not human speech it is Allahs word.

[hareem01]

Re: Science as Religion

very good post.

[Light_Bearer]

Re: Science as Religion

@USResident

To find yourself and your place in this universe he has created and filled with abundant signs. If after seeing all these you can't think that some higher power created all this and controls it then you are totally blind.

Yes it can fill a person with awe, and you start thinking about the maker. But that can be attributed to any religion. Anybody should be able to claim the equal rights.

@USResident

Science can only explain phenomena's that begin and end with a material point.

IMHO wrong definitions, should be read as Science can only prove phenomenons that begin and end with a material point. As far as immaterials are concerned, well those are immaterial anyway.

@USResident

Gods message said you cannot fathom him.

This is getting interesting, if a person says He do not believe in God, and still all the supporting evidence you give is by the book authored by God. That person might say are you thinking straight, I am questioning the existance of the author and you are trying to convince me with the book of the author I don't believe to be in existance.

Theoretically speaking ofcourse.

@USResident

All these signs in the universe i.e. sun, moon and galaxies, earth, living species are evidence that someone created them and thats as far as you can see things.

Yes totally agree to it. But why that someone has to be supernatural.

@USResident

You cannot look beyond that because the beyond that is the world of the unseen, and that is what you have to believe in as long as you are living. You become part of that unseen world once you die.

Lets wait till the end of the time, and see what happens. Its a bit long period though.

@USResident

Bottomline, in your heart you know he exists and you can run away as much as you want because your mind plays tricks and delve into all sorts of foolish theories however when your time comes you will not be in denial however it might be too late. I ask all of those trying theorize Allah to once in your life sincerely and with a clear conscience read Quran and see what God has to say. If you read it with the intention to find mistakes or prove something else you will not get the message from it. For it is not human speech it is Allahs word.

If somebody is there, then it doesnot have to be blind faith. It has to pass all the tests of reason as well.

Sorry if I offended you.

[underthedome]

Re: Science as Religion

@Kodiak

Science can never replace Allah and the Quran.

It seems your right, only time and other gods replace god(s). Be it the myths of the ancient Greeks or the spirituality of the Native Americans, gods come and go with time and with people.

[USResident]

Re: Science as Religion

@Light Bearer

Yes it can fill a person with awe, and you start thinking about the maker. But that can be attributed to any religion. Anybody should be able to claim the equal rights.

And all prophetic religions have claimed the existence of God. However all forms except Islam have been distorted. Simple common sense and examination of the religious books can prove that.

@Light Bearer

IMHO wrong definitions, should be read as Science can only prove phenomenons that begin and end with a material point. As far as immaterials are concerned, well those are immaterial anyway.

Feelings are immaterial, do they matter. Common sense is immaterial, any scientific proof that common sense exists. Yet every one talks about it.

@Light Bearer

This is getting interesting, if a person says He do not believe in God, and still all the supporting evidence you give is by the book authored by God. That person might say are you thinking straight, I am questioning the existance of the author and you are trying to convince me with the book of the author I don't believe to be in existance.

Did you ever try to figure out how these books were authored. It was revelation and facts about them that cannot be disputed given the timeline of revelation of the books. God did not pick up a pen and write down the Quran and rain it from the sky for people to pick it up. He inspired human messengers and helped in ways so that the message would get through.

@Light Bearer

Yes totally agree to it. But why that someone has to be supernatural.

Supernatural is the best word in your vocabulary to describe Allah. This should make my point even more clear humans do not have the expressive power to describe God because its simply not part of our creation to be able to do so and that is what Allah has reminded us again and again.

@Light Bearer

Lets wait till the end of the time, and see what happens. Its a bit long period though.

When the time comes remember my words today. Might save your life then.

@Light Bearer

If somebody is there, then it doesnot have to be blind faith. It has to pass all the tests of reason as well.

Simply said a creation cannot test its creator with reason that supercedes that of its creator. Your statement means you can only test what you can physically grasp. This is what pushes you away from Allah. He may be a physical being but not in the sense we know or we could imagine.

@Light Bearer

Sorry if I offended you.

Did not. We are simply discussing.

[SyedAbduallah]

Re: Science as Religion

Lightbearer I demand you retract your contention that if everything must have a cause it will lead to infinite regression as hareem has already responded and crushed that argument with cold hard logic, unless ofcourse you have another heretical arguement to present.

[picoico]

Re: Science as Religion

.

[picoico]

Re: Science as Religion

@Light Bearer

So why blame and burn the poor humans for the shortcoming.

Who said it was a result of their shortcommings? Let em burn of their own free will...

[picoico]

Re: Science as Religion

@Light Bearer

If everything must have a cause, then God must have a cause..

Everything except God has a cause. Gee, that wasn’t difficult to get around…:halo:

Modifying the proposition for universal creation to exclude the creator (which leads to a pardox btw, not a refutation) is hardly problematic.

[muali]

Re: Science as Religion

@USResident

When the time comes remember my words today. Might save your life then

I read ur post and this line caught my attention.. i was just wondering ...How could u be so sure about watever u r saying i know its ur belife but still how could u be so sure ...nobody is sure wats gonna happen ..... and wat kinda life saving ur talking about.....no one knows wats gonna happen so no one has the authority to tell other person that he'll go to hell on judgement day just because he doesn't agee with his ideas . That just doesnt even seems right.

[Light_Bearer]

Re: Science as Religion

@hareem01

Allah Is the One Who created Time and Space......... So The Time of Universe is also His creation.Only we(His Creation) need time measuring.Allah is all above His creation. You Love you parents,wife,kidzzzz.Prove it.

Hello wake up call.
I can see them.
I can touch them.
I take care of them.
For a prove a picture/video can be arranged. Of parents/wife/kids not the rooms of the said person and say as you can see the room is clean and been taken care of assume there is some caretaker.

Can you do the same for the God.

[Light_Bearer]

Re: Science as Religion

@SyedAbduallah

Lightbearer I demand you retract your contention that if everything must have a cause it will lead to infinite regression as hareem has already responded and crushed that argument with cold hard logic, unless ofcourse you have another heretical arguement to present.

Kindly point out the post number hareem has crushed me, and we will go from there. lets do it step by step.

[Light_Bearer]

Re: Science as Religion

If religion is so perfect why everything is still in mess after so many centuries. Is it the will of God. As you guys keep on saying nothing happens without his will.

OK I admit science is lame, is incomplete, doesnot make lot of sense, but so bloody what its man made.

Why the hell you people are not revealing the mysteries of the world man. why you people dont give the new scientific concepts, why is it alway that science proves something and you guys start saying oh the holy book already said so. if it said so you better find it before the science and say it loud and clear because the graph does not look so nice at the moment. you have absolutely no excuse of failure because you claim to have the devine knowledge.

On the same note please remind me which invention useful for the humanity was designed or manufactured through the holy books. Zero, but I am open to suggestions.

[parissenoor]

Re: Science as Religion

@Light Bearer

If religion is so perfect why everything is still in mess after so many centuries. Is it the will of God. As you guys keep on saying nothing happens without his will.

OK I admit science is lame, is incomplete, doesnot make lot of sense, but so bloody what its man made.

Why the hell you people are not revealing the mysteries of the world man. why you people dont give the new scientific concepts, why is it alway that science proves something and you guys start saying oh the holy book already said so. if it said so you better find it before the science and say it loud and clear because the graph does not look so nice at the moment. you have absolutely no excuse of failure because you claim to have the devine knowledge.

On the same note please remind me which invention useful for the humanity was designed or manufactured through the holy books. Zero, but I am open to suggestions.

religion is perfect because it gives a moral frame, and social, ethics views that can keep a society together…in theory

the problem is that men who practice religion are not perfect and tend to do the mess you see around:bummer:

sciencitific knowledge is responsible for most usefull invention, from medicines to cars, fridge, diapers…

but religion brings harmony and peace in one’s mind, if we follow it truly, with heart, not a like crazy criminals

opposing religion and science is the most hurtfull thing to do to religion, because religion can not prove anything scientific, and religion can not explain anything scientific. Trying to explain the worlds with Quran instead of science is the reason why the “muslim world” is still in a big mess and can’t developp
scicence is the most important for a strong economy and fitghting poverty.

Only those who understood that their faith is different from science knowledge have chance to progress.

[Light_Bearer]

Re: Science as Religion

^sensible post.

[USResident]

Re: Science as Religion

@parissenoor

... Trying to explain the worlds with Quran instead of science is the reason why the "muslim world" is still in a big mess and can't developp

Only those who understood that their faith is different from science knowledge have chance to progress.

Agreed. The scientific facts in the Quran are there for evidence of its authenticity i.e. scientific knowledge was not that developed to have pointed out such facts, which means some higher power revealed those facts for humanity. That higher power is refered as Allah.