Immorality, hypocrisy at its best.
The GoP should also release video clips of the un-Sharif family's departure from Pakistan and their famed wide ear to ear smiles while boarding planes to Jeddah.
The agreement said they weren't even supposed to be in any business in the host country...and they have been in business all along too...no limits to their filth...
And our over-smart but amnesic public, the voting hand and the delusional SC is ready to warmly embrace these freaks so they can create havoc and have yet more of their way with our Pakistan.
Immorality, hypocrisy at its best.
The GoP should also release video clips of the un-Sharif family's departure from Pakistan and their famed wide ear to ear smiles while boarding planes to Jeddah.
The agreement said they weren't even supposed to be in any business in the host country...and they have been in business all along too...no limits to their filth...
And our over-smart but amnesic public, the voting hand and the delusional SC is ready to warmly embrace these freaks so they can create havoc and have yet more of their way with our Pakistan.
Immorality and hypocrisy! huh
Who is talking!
Is it moral and upright to let a criminal go scot free to extend one's rule? Why did Musharraf let him go in the first place? If he was guilty why was an agreement made with Sharifs.
Its also very moral to let go NAB cases on Benazir and make her PM!
Haris Bhai its your post that is hypocrisy, not the SC decision.
But Chief Justice Iftikhar Mohammad Chaudhry said in his judgement on Thursday: "(The Sharifs) have an inalienable right to return and remain in the country as citizens of Pakistan."
Let the Ganjaa Raj begin again....he'd be dying to return to his opulent estate in Raiwind and enjoy the phajjay ke paayes....sad, really sad. The Court has gone bonkers.
How did SC say that ganja will become the PM of the country by that statement? It was Musharraf's mistake to let ganja off the hook, you should be condemning Musharraf and not NS.
NS PM. BB - makes no difference. Nothing improves until people smarten up and stop being religious fools
exactly, common man will continue to suffer, VIPs will continue to snatch away rights of common man, justice will stay miles away from innocent, a phone call from some minister will release the criminal caught and life of a "Pakistani" will go on.
Immorality, hypocrisy at its best.
The GoP should also release video clips of the un-Sharif family's departure from Pakistan and their famed wide ear to ear smiles while boarding planes to Jeddah.
The agreement said they weren't even supposed to be in any business in the host country...and they have been in business all along too...no limits to their filth...
And our over-smart but amnesic public, the voting hand and the delusional SC is ready to warmly embrace these freaks so they can create havoc and have yet more of their way with our Pakistan.
so you are declaring that court has not done justice
exactly, common man will continue to suffer, VIPs will continue to snatch away rights of common man, justice will stay miles away from innocent, a phone call from some minister will release the criminal caught and life of a "Pakistani" will go on.
in the last 7 or 8 years does life of comman man improves
does petrol rate increases or decreases
does rupee value increases or decreases
does mehangai increases or decreases
then why you are afraid that they should not come
its better that they should come atleast they are not bad as musharaf who had distroyed the life of comman man
in the last 7 or 8 years does life of comman man improves
does petrol rate increases or decreases
does rupee value increases or decreases
does mehangai increases or decreases
then why you are afraid that they should not come
its better that they should come atleast they are not bad as musharaf who had distroyed the life of comman man
Read my other posts, I welcome him back, and I would be even happier if he rots in jails (depending on his cases outcome). I want justice system to be established and independent of government interferences, period.
First the portion does not show a resolve or decision or planning to overthrow the govt or Sharif nor any plans for a coup or to do any such thing for any political *nor personal motives. The resolve was just that if the delusional and reckless PM ridiculed the Army and its Chief again, the Army would *react. Even that resolved *reaction *is not prescribed or described anywhere and it may have been different and comparatively low-key had the events of that fateful Oct evening been a bit saner on the PM's part. The reckless Mian Ameer-ul-Momineen invited the counter-coup in response to his coup directed at flight PK 805 containing 198 passengers in mid air.
Haris, NS as an elected PM had the right to remove any general from any post for any reason or NO reason at all. He had the legal authority to do that. Anyway, according to Mushrraf, and what he wrote in his book, he had made up his mind when he was appointed COAS that he will not leave without fight. So when the time came, he did exactly that. Thats not a secret any more and Mushrraf admitted that himself in his book. Also, what is counter-coup? Can you define that?
BTW, funny thing is that Mushrraf's ITLOF is quoted and is used in courts in Pakistan by defense lawyers, both in missing persons cases & even NS case (who is not missing yet).
Do you know what happened the night when the election results were being announced in 2002. They had to stop the announcement of the results till morning as the results started arriving in Governor house Punjab showed Nawaz League was claearly winning in Punjab inspite of the fact Govt. had arranged massive rigged votes in every constituensy.
Nawaz Sharif is the favourite leader of Punjab, the same way Altaf Hussain is for Karachi, and BB is for Sindh. They are all not saints but that's the way it is. Chaudrys are just one constituency leaders...
If you have seen the dawn polls some days back Nawaz Sharif is the most popular leader in Pakistan. All his seats come from Punjab unlike BB whose vote bank is divided between Sindh and Punjab. Just translate these votes in to number of seats in Punjab and you will see the equation.
This is the reason why Musharraf wants to stop NS at any cost....
Bhai … who told you that? Don’t tell me that it was told to you by kaka Nawaz
If it was right of PM to remove any general from any post for any reason or NO reason at all than it is right of a general to shoot PM dead on the head for any reason or NO reason at all.
Well, PM has no right to even remove a peon without any reasonable reason and if they do that, the peon has right to break the jaw of PM. No government servants (or you can say civil servants) are servant of PM but are servant of people and have their rights of job protection.
If PM could have sacked anyone with NO reason as you like to believe than with change of every Prime Minister many people everywhere in government job would lose their jobs.
NO prime minister have right to appoint anyone or sack anyone for whatever reason but only respective departments are authorized to do that and also when there are sufficient reasons to do that. Head of departments (where in most cases armed forces are excluded for obvious reasons that person in charge there could make trouble too) can be changed by Prime Minister using proper procedure, but even that can be done if there are sufficient reasons that can be defended in court, and person is given that reason so that the person concerned could defend themselves in court or any unbiased/apolitical hearing body available within the department (like for judges it is SJC).
Actually Prime Minister everywhere in the world depends on government servants to rule and implement their policies and depends on armed forces to guarantee their power (or authority) over others (next power after armed forces that guarantee Prime Minister rule over others are police).
Just imagine that Army chiefs are the most powerful people in the country as they have army under their command. They can bite back if anything happens to them, especially if any wrong is done to them from any quarters. As for Chief Justice, they have no power under their control and depend on others in power to implement their verdicts. Even then, Prime Minister cannot sack Chief Justice (or any judge) without reason.
[Well, to sack CJ a prime minister has to find reasons, send those reasons as reference to President, President send that reference to SJC, SJC does the investigation, send the investigation on those reference to President, President than can decide on the result of that investigation that CJ deserved to be sacked, and then only if CJ is found guilty than he would get sacked.
When an ordinary employee of government get legally sacked (anywhere in the world) NOT illegally sacked, same procedure is adopted in different way as what happens with CJ. Reasons are found. Employee gets suspended and investigation gets started. According to the result of investigation a decision is made and employee gets sacked.
As for army, no executive interfere there. Army does their own investigation and sacking, rather they do court martial as army posts are crucial posts. If executive try to interfere they can get thrown out anywhere in the world (except when executives are too strong … like Mao or Bhutto in his early days). But then, executives anywhere in the world are normally intelligent and do not venture where they do not have to, except an idiot like Nawaz and result is that he is out (normally he should have got killed, but he is fortunate to be alive).
Even lower employees have their rights. Just imagine that prime minister can come and go, they might be in power for few days to 5 years. If Prime minister could sack someone than every Prime Minister would come with their baggage of political workers and would change whole bureaucracy, sacking all government employees for reason or NO reason.
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What President wrote is perfectly fine. When there is an idiot as Prime minister any intelligent army chief would make a provision that if this idiot acts foolishly, he should be encountered. There should be provisions for such eventuality in all armed forces anywhere in the world. I believe that all armed forces must be having such provisions that they could act if loyalty of executives become doubtful. But as you can read that these provisions were made to be implemented if that idiot (Nawaz) would do something foolish, what wrong with that? This should be commendable.
[What I know is that USA and UK forces have such provisions and even though they might not take over the country, but they could easily kill unwanted elements in executives or corridor of power. No court or justice system could do anything to them nor Justice System ever dare to do anything to them. What I know, Kennedy and Diana was victim of such provisions and Edward VIII (of UK) loosing his Kingship was also victim of such provisions. All get done in the name of National Security or whatever].
What Musharraf wrote is good sign of intelligence and shows that our generals are not idiots (like most Pakistani lawyers, judges, politicians and many others are) but have thinking minds. It make me confident that Pakistan could not get destroyed by some idiot that ever come to power through democracy. These types of provisions must be there in all armies and should be there in the forces of every country.
Defence lawyers … :rotato: … well, Pakistani lawyers and judges are mostly corrupt jokers :D. They survive in Pakistan because in Pakistan jokers have values for many .
After reading arguments of Pakistani lawyers and comments of Pakistani corrupt judges, one can expect anything from them. What can one expect from judges that get their sons admitted in colleges when they do not deserve admission on merit. Or get job using their influences? Judges that are crooks and corrupts … those that are more into looting and plundering themselves and claim that they would hold justice … Man they are just jokers … so don’t give examples of jokers.
In Pakistan … judge is the one with Lathie and if I was in Power, I would use that lathie to shoot these corrupt judges rather let them have their corruptions prevails.
If I was one of the lawyer in court, I would have asked the judge that if Prime Minister and President could not sack you even when you are guilty of corruption and nepotism, how can you expect that Prime minister sack Army chief? When you did all to get yourself reinstated and did not even wanted enquiry on you (because you were guilty of all what was there in reference) … Your 2 pence black coat corrupt lawyers who do all to fiddle with law came out on road for you … how can you or corrupt judges here on the bench even think or expect that army should have kept quite and not acted when a retarded Prime Minister decide to sack him without any enquiry or reasons?
Bhai its in little green book. Its called The Constitution of Islamic Republic of Pakistan. Try reading it some time.
Under parliamentary act of 1997 power to appoint the service chiefs was given to the prime minister. Mushrraf was appointed by NS, and he had the right to remove him under the constitution.
It happens all the time. When govt change hand (at least in western countries) the political appointees have to go, too. Very common and very normal thing in democracies all over the world.
Sorry, but I think you understand how govt works. The departments and agencies that take political direction from the PM, including the cabinet-level departments (which includes army and police), constitute the executive branch of the government.
The executive branch under the constitution must enforce laws passed by the parliament, and it must implement judicial orders. As with the legislature, the judiciary cannot enforce its decisions without the help of the executive (e.g. police force, prison service or the army).
Also, army is an institution of the govt and SC and Parliament are branches of the govt. Tomorrow the parliament can do away with the army as institution, but it cannot get rid of the SC or vice versa.
The Chief Justice is head of a branch of a govt and the army chief is a head of branch of governmental institution. There is a big different between the two. To give you a comparative example, army chief’s position on terms of hierarchy of the govt jobs is less than junior sport minister and CJ powers equals to that of a president.
No, it only happens in banana republics, like ours, where corrupt generals think they’re above the law or accountability of any kind.
I think Afghanistan is having bumper hashish corp again this year.
Well, I hope you don’t end up on the wrong side of law in Pakistan where you just might need one of those corrupt people.
Is it moral and upright to let a criminal go scot free to extend one's rule? Why did Musharraf let him go in the first place? If he was guilty why was an agreement made with Sharifs.
Its also very moral to let go NAB cases on Benazir and make her PM!
Haris Bhai its your post that is hypocrisy, not the SC decision.
Well I clearly remember back in Dec 2000 at about 8:00 am as I entered my Math class which was to begin in a while few friends of mine told me the news from late the previous night which I wasnt yet aware of...I and lots of others were shaken and questioned Musharraf's move and reasons, even cursed the act. I still maintain it has been his premier blunder.
But you tell me, had he hanged the not so Sharif, because mian ameerul momineen could easily have been convicted to death or atleast life RI within a matter of months back then...how would you have reacted...?
No hypocrisy in the answer please...
Even if you say you wouldve welcomed it as justice done, do take into account the amnesia, irrationality and powerlessness of the Pakistani masses who are driven by emotion, boredom, will for change of any sort and so on and not reasoning...what would the reaction be...?
Plus at that time Mush was at his most powerful, the conviction no matter how light or hard would have labelled it personal revenge by a dictator...
So give credit where due...he was merciful and Pakistan was regaining its image after the govt change, we had been very ugly everywhere since 1999 again thanks to Mian saab's madness, Saudi intervention, US involvement, lifting embargoes, getting the cut-off aid stopped after 28 May 1998, getting more financial assistance and so on was Mush's greater agenda...
But in the end, a man usually has to pay for his *good *in this world as a test, the *evil *is cost free here and paid in the next...Mush is only paying for his good deeds, such has been life to all sincere men...they fall prey to propaganda, conspiracies and misperceptions, their nations only realize when its much late...history is full of examples.
But at the moment of deciciveness there is great irrationality as apparently the mannquin in the showcase is perfect though lifeless, but the man outside is tired of his old overweight wife who may be a bit chubby or say shorttempered but is beautiful and loving...no use realizing that at any moment other than the moment of decisiveness, not 10 yrs later not 10 days later...
True, but i’d rather say till “people smarten up and stop being fools”
plain foolery is even greater than religious
Atleast not fully yet…he’s a citizen fine, he’s a criminal too and he got into an agreement with the govt and an allied foreign govt…settle that and then we have full justice…but that wont happen…heck the CJ restoration full judgment is nowhere to be found still…
Not everything is written in the books of law written centuries ago, *ijtehad *as religious legal lingo puts it…is lacking…of course the SC’s motives are clear…
Do you know what happened the night when the election results were being announced in 2002. They had to stop the announcement of the results till morning as the results started arriving in Governor house Punjab showed Nawaz League was claearly winning in Punjab inspite of the fact Govt. had arranged massive rigged votes in every constituensy.
Nawaz Sharif is the favourite leader of Punjab, the same way Altaf Hussain is for Karachi, and BB is for Sindh. They are all not saints but that's the way it is. Chaudrys are just one constituency leaders...
If you have seen the dawn polls some days back Nawaz Sharif is the most popular leader in Pakistan. All his seats come from Punjab unlike BB whose vote bank is divided between Sindh and Punjab. Just translate these votes in to number of seats in Punjab and you will see the equation.
This is the reason why Musharraf wants to stop NS at any cost....
but in 2002 were you at the governor house, PMLNHQ, Raiwind, Jeddah or a voting booth?
he's notorious rather than popular, his very political existence was nourished on the lap of a military dictator who was far more dictatorial than the present democratic military ruler. What is his politics all about? personal agendas, lies and deception. Like other parties.
And what can we say of our masses and their favorites they change faster and more irrationally than the change in their list of favorite actors/stars...
Just to put it simply again though, Mian saab only found the moment while Musharraf was in mid-air to exercise his right? isn’t it obvious what he was upto?
And that too for no apparent reason other than his paranoia and personal displeasure? Who the heck was he? No God, no dictator, no apostle nor king but a mere elected servant of Pakistani people, but he never knew that did he…?
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