Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
Some more insight, October 8 1971.
Here he is talking about framing the next constitution like he would run the government with 80 out of over 300 seats…
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
^ Easy to see how 'friendly' he is with the president. It is clear that Bhutto insisted on military option because politically he could not form the government.
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
I can understand your feelings but the problem is that countries learn from their mistakes, but in our case we have learnt nothing and are repeating them again and again. We need to understand (and remind ourselves) so that we could avoid them again, it would have been a hell for the people who have gone through that once.
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
The thing is on one side Mujeeb had his six points, logically they should have been discussed in the parliament. Bhutto on the other hand wanted a public debate, and refused to attend the assembly meeting (threatening people who would go to Dhaka & the government of the consequences of holding the meeting on the scheduled date) in effect throwing the country into a constitutional crisis. Due to the postponement of the assembly meeting, situation went out of control in East Pakistan and they declared independence on Mar 26,1971. Then the military operation started and everything finished. In october Bhutto seems to be asking the dictator to hand over the power to him.
I still consider the biggest role (maybe 70/30) of this debacle on the military, but still the politicians cannot be forgiven as well as they also had their rigid positions which further deteriorated the situation.
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
^ Easy to see how 'friendly' he is with the president. It is clear that Bhutto insisted on military option because politically he could not form the government.
Another thing I have failed to understand how Bhutto was representing Pakistan in UN on Dec 15, 1971 as a foreign minister (one day before the fall of Dhaka).
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
I haven't read the thread yet but I wanted to say that I would love to see Pakistan and Bangladesh re-unite one day!
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
^ What have you been smoking, “brother”? 
Pakistan and bangladesh should have friendly relationship, but we are way too different and far apart to be one country again..
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
Chalo, friendly and closer relationship se hi sahi - start to karein.
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
[quote="ninja_hattori, post:29, topic:257314"]
can you explain to whom addressing as suwar ke bachche?/QUOTE]
**
bangladeshio ko / residents of bangladesh**
he wanted to know from gathering if pakistan should recognise bangladesh as a souverign independent country ? when public replied vehemently in negative , then he said sit down let them go to hell many times before calling them ....... whatever is written above .
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
^ Easy to see how 'friendly' he is with the president. It is clear that Bhutto insisted on military option because politically he could not form the government.
Do you have any proof or just speculations based on JI's reports? Link if what you are saying otherwise silence is golden just like you did in another thread about conscience what ever you were talking about PPP when I linked a video. Last time I know you were not even born during Ziaulhaq time, I know you hate PPP but please don't spread lies regard past events.
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
The thing is on one side Mujeeb had his six points, logically they should have been discussed in the parliament. Bhutto on the other hand wanted a public debate, and refused to attend the assembly meeting (threatening people who would go to Dhaka & the government of the consequences of holding the meeting on the scheduled date) in effect throwing the country into a constitutional crisis. Due to the postponement of the assembly meeting, situation went out of control in East Pakistan and they declared independence on Mar 26,1971. Then the military operation started and everything finished. In october Bhutto seems to be asking the dictator to hand over the power to him.
I still consider the biggest role (maybe 70/30) of this debacle on the military, but still the politicians cannot be forgiven as well as they also had their rigid positions which further deteriorated the situation.
Thanks for your excerpts. It is clear from above excerpts that Bhutto being a politician wanted dialogue with Mujib he never ever told Yahya Khan to initiate military action. Bengalis since partition had deprived of equal status with West Pakistanis, but West Pakistanis particularly dictators and media always considered Bengalis as trash, second rate citizens. When Quaid-Azam made Urdu as national language in 1948, Bengalis came out protested against this decision. That was first wrong decision taken which created hatred between the two parts of the country. Bengalis were deprived of their rights; irony of the fact was that Kernafuli Paper Mill was producing high quality paper. Paper was sold cheaper in West Pakistan than in East Pakistan which was main producer of the paper. Same treatment was given to other resources such as putson, tea, etc. Ayub Khan was the main reason for paving the breaking of the country when he imprisoned Shaikh Mujib in false Agar Tala case. The hatred did not develop in one day it was cumulative effect since partition.
Yahya Khan instead of initiating army action should have allowed Shaikh Mujib to convene the assembly, west paki politicians should have been kicked a$$ by the dictator to attend the session at any cost. Dictator of the time and his cronies in power were not mentally retarded, they could have clearly visualized the repercussions of mililtary operation. But West Pakis knew that once Bengalis were given power, they would never ever rule Pakistan again because the Bengalis weremajority in majority, no political party of west pakistan cound have beaten them in elections. Military, bureaucracy, media and people of West Pakistan were totally against Bengali rule. That was the major reason of the breakup. I was kid at that time and I know how mcuh emotions were boiling on both sides.
This band baja that Bhutto was responsible of this tragedy was created by JI and estabilishment of the time. JI which was always behaved b-team for army and media were main culprits in creating this hatred. All these stakeholders needed a ecape goat. Who could be easier prey than a politican from Sindh? JI which created Alshams and Albadr genocide top ranking professors and students of Dhaka University. magar na to military ne is treagedy se koi sabaq seekha nahin JI ya b-team tonga parties of military ne, and they falsely blaming Bhutto, shame on them.
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
Indian view: The stories of rape and slaughter in East Pakistan, gained huge sympathy in India, especially as a vast majority of the refugees were Hindu's.
Initially the refugees were allowed to come into India, but soon the refugees (Hindu & Muslims) started to swell into millions. (10 million)
India started suspecting that Pakistan was deliberately trying to get rid of its Hindu population and Awami League supporters, and it was than that the idea to create Bangladesh, gained wide spread support within India.
The rest is history....
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
Pakistani view: Mistakes were made, but India proved to be a conniving enemy in the light of Haseena Sheikh's recent admission that her father was backed by India to create, and train a militia for domestic terrorism to malign Pakistan, hence resulting in Bangladesh.
Pakistan started suspecting that India was deliberately backing a terrorist outfit and creating anarchy in East Pakistan, but lacking a direct route to East Pakistan, the logistics of fully being able to defend East Pakistan against arch-rival, and treacherous enemy proved to be a losing battle since the arch rival had a border with East Pakistan.
The flaw on the part of today's Pakistani politicians and Army heads at the time was that they didn't attempt a rescue of patriots who were left behind, and still reside in Bangladesh today.
The rest is history....
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
Pakistani view: Mistakes were made, but India proved to be a conniving enemy in the light of Haseena's Sheikh's recent admission that her father was backed by India to create, and train a militia for domestic terrorism to malign Pakistan, hence resulting in Bangladesh.
Pakistan started suspecting that Inda was deliberately backing a terrorist outfit and creating anarchy in East Pakistan, but lacking a direct route to East Pakistan, the logistics of fully being able to defend East Pakistan against arch-rival, and treacherous enemy proved to be a losing battle since the arch rival had a border with East Pakistan.
The flaw on the part of today's Pakistani politicians and Army heads at the time was that they didn't attempt a rescue of patriots who were left behind, and still reside in Bangladesh today.
The rest is history....
yes India was involved in proxy war in former East Pakistan, but failure to realize the repercussions of military operation particularly targetting innocent Muslim Bengalis and Hindu Bengalis were proved detrmental and disasterous for Pakistan which again major responsiblites lied on the dictator general president of Pakistan. The solution was absolute political not the use of mighty fire power west Pakistan army displayed against its own people in former East Pakistan.
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
yes India was involved in proxy war in former East Pakistan, but failure to realize the repercussions of military operation particularly targetting innocent Muslim Bengalis and Hindu Bengalis were proved detrmental and disasterous for Pakistan which again major responsiblites lied on the dictator general president of Pakistan. The solution was absolute political not the use of mighty fire power west Pakistan army displayed against its own people in former East Pakistan.
No doubt the political hunger for power then and now is no less, infact has only increased in decades since then. Mistakes were made by Politicians and Armed Forces heads of West Pakistan back then for sure. Their decision, trust in wrong allies (U.S.) and lack of addressing real issues amounted to a void which India filled with treachery.
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
Thanks for your excerpts. It is clear from above excerpts that Bhutto being a politician wanted dialogue with Mujib he never ever told Yahya Khan to initiate military action. Bengalis since partition had deprived of equal status with West Pakistanis, but West Pakistanis particularly dictators and media always considered Bengalis as trash, second rate citizens. When Quaid-Azam made Urdu as national language in 1948, Bengalis came out protested against this decision. That was first wrong decision taken which created hatred between the two parts of the country. Bengalis were deprived of their rights; irony of the fact was that Kernafuli Paper Mill was producing high quality paper. Paper was sold cheaper in West Pakistan than in East Pakistan which was main producer of the paper. Same treatment was given to other resources such as putson, tea, etc. Ayub Khan was the main reason for paving the breaking of the country when he imprisoned Shaikh Mujib in false Agar Tala case. The hatred did not develop in one day it was cumulative effect since partition.
Yahya Khan instead of initiating army action should have allowed Shaikh Mujib to convene the assembly, west paki politicians should have been kicked a$$ by the dictator to attend the session at any cost. Dictator of the time and his cronies in power were not mentally retarded, they could have clearly visualized the repercussions of mililtary operation. But West Pakis knew that once Bengalis were given power, they would never ever rule Pakistan again because the Bengalis weremajority in majority, no political party of west pakistan cound have beaten them in elections. Military, bureaucracy, media and people of West Pakistan were totally against Bengali rule. That was the major reason of the breakup. I was kid at that time and I know how mcuh emotions were boiling on both sides.
This band baja that Bhutto was responsible of this tragedy was created by JI and estabilishment of the time. JI which was always behaved b-team for army and media were main culprits in creating this hatred. All these stakeholders needed a ecape goat. Who could be easier prey than a politican from Sindh? JI which created Alshams and Albadr genocide top ranking professors and students of Dhaka University. magar na to military ne is treagedy se koi sabaq seekha nahin JI ya b-team tonga parties of military ne, and they falsely blaming Bhutto, shame on them.
I did not open this thread to insult Bhutto, I just want to understand the events leading to the disaster. I could only find some of his speeches which I have posted, he is saying in some of them that he had been telling Ayub to initiate talks with Mujeeb regarding the six points, do you know of something (as a reference) related to that?
As far as I am concerned, I believe that army was the biggest culprit but the politicians both Mujeeb and Bhutto had their firm and irreconcilable positions which further complicated the situation.
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
Yahya Khan instead of initiating army action should have allowed Shaikh Mujib to convene the assembly, west paki politicians should have been kicked a$$ by the dictator to attend the session at any cost. Dictator of the time and his cronies in power were not mentally retarded, they could have clearly visualized the repercussions of mililtary operation. But West Pakis knew that once Bengalis were given power, they would never ever rule Pakistan again because the Bengalis weremajority in majority, no political party of west pakistan cound have beaten them in elections. Military, bureaucracy, media and people of West Pakistan were totally against Bengali rule. That was the major reason of the breakup. I was kid at that time and I know how mcuh emotions were boiling on both sides.
This band baja that Bhutto was responsible of this tragedy was created by JI and estabilishment of the time. JI which was always behaved b-team for army and media were main culprits in creating this hatred. All these stakeholders needed a ecape goat. Who could be easier prey than a politican from Sindh? JI which created Alshams and Albadr genocide top ranking professors and students of Dhaka University. magar na to military ne is treagedy se koi sabaq seekha nahin JI ya b-team tonga parties of military ne, and they falsely blaming Bhutto, shame on them.
In one of those excerpts Bhutto (dated Feb 28,1971 post 19) is clearly saying that he will not be attending the assembly session in Dhaka, and if the assembly session is convened he will launch agitation in West Pakistan.
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
@ali syed............ you were not born/too young then............ you don't know anything...also you are in lahore...........
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
You can give your insight into it, I can only dig what ever information I can from the Internet.
Re: Responsibility for 1971 tragedy
Indian view: The stories of rape and slaughter in East Pakistan, gained huge sympathy in India, especially as a vast majority of the refugees were Hindu's.
Initially the refugees were allowed to come into India, but soon the refugees (Hindu & Muslims) started to swell into millions. (10 million)
India started suspecting that Pakistan was deliberately trying to get rid of its Hindu population and Awami League supporters, and it was than that the idea to create Bangladesh, gained wide spread support within India.
The rest is history....
More than simple sympathy, Indians wanted to 'teach' Pakistan a lesson and they used this issue for achieving that. They supported mukti bahini actively, but on the other hand Pakistani military's handling of the situation was also highly flawed which further complicated matters.