Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
Once a child is born the father has to pay maintanence otherwise it is not the mother who will suffer but the child. If the man doesn’t want a child he should abstain from sex for once conception has occurred it is upto the woman as she is carrying the child. Biology has made it so that men don’t get a say wrt the child once they have had sex.
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
For married folk if the woman was impregnated by the Husband, the man should have to pay child support. Guys who don’t have any qualms about pre-marital relationships shouldn’t get married if they’re not ready for kids. Marriage is no joke.
If the wife is pregnant and the husband isn’t the father, the state can still make him pay child support when the couple separates; unless the guy has an awesome lawyer. Now that’s unfair. But the state doesn’t care for the man. It does whatever is in the best interest of the child.
Asking a man to pay child support for a kid born out of wedlock is plain wrong. Consent to sex does not equal consent to having a kid. A man can’t stop a woman from getting an aborting because it’s her body, her life, her career or her finances. However, a woman can force the financial burden of child support on a man if she wishes. The man gets no say in the matter. I don’t see how that’s fair to men.
People here are going to say that men should be more careful who they have sex with, use birth control, or not have sex outside marriage. All that would be reasonable if the women folk were held up to the same standards. They are not though. A woman can get pregnant then get an abortion if she feels she is not ready for the responsibility. Whereas a man’s financial rape is in the hands of the woman who got pregnant.
In case a woman gets pregnant out of wedlock the resulting kid shouldn’t be entitled to automatic financial support from whomever mommy names the dad on the birth certificate. If the guy signs a legal document saying he is going to take the responsibility only then should he have to pay. Such documents should be signed when the woman first finds out she is pregnant. If the man agrees, awesome. If he wants nothing to do with the kid, the woman decides what she is going to do depending on her personal financial situation.
Skipping child support on **your **kids born within marriage or in a committed relationship where you were okay with the idea of kids until ya’ll separated is plain wrong. Doesn’t matter if you baby mama spends most of the money on fancy bags or on her new guy. You should have made better choices in life.
^ replied like a real man. :k:
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
Marriage does not lead to pregnancy…sex does. Are you saying that when a man agrees to become a husband, he is automatically agreeing to becoming a father? Because there have been many cases where even a husband is tricked by a wife who gets pregnant…even when the husband has told her that he does not want a child.
You wrote consent to sex does not equal to consent to having a kid. Did you meant to include “when he’s having sex outside marriage”? Because the rest of your post gives the impression that for a man, sex with is wife automatically equals consent to having a kid.
Courts don’t order a guy to pay child support b/c mommy named him on the birth certificate. Either a guy agrees that he is the biological father OR a DNA test is done to confirm it. Either way…it’s not “whomever”…the kid gets child support from his/her biological father.
Another major contradiction based on what you wrote before this. So a man is consenting to having a child when he has sex with his wife AND if he’s in a committed relationship? 
And what is the definition of a “committed relationship”?
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
I answered Case 2 already. Case 1 is simple. It’s her body and she has to carry the child to term not him. Therefore, she decides if she wants to keep the child or not.
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
But women have recreational sex too without ever wanting to get pregnant. The thing is women have more control over getting pregnant than men do. A woman could easily trick a man and a gullible man will believe her. She may lie about being on birth control pills when she is actually not. A man would seem paranoid to use a condom if the woman he has having sex with has told him that she is on birth control. Unless a man is sleeping with prostitutes and must take precaution to protect himself, most men could easily be tricked by women they trust enough to have sex with.
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
If they choose to have sex then they should be prepared for the consequences. If they don’t want to be financially liable then they shouldn’t engage in sex.
women also cannot have abortion beyond 26 weeks unless for medical reasons. They have a say over the fetus before this as it is their bodies.
Being gullible is is a poor excuse for not paying maintanence for a child.
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
Condoms aren’t only about preventing birth. If a man is not in a committed relationship or married, he would be an idiot to have unprotected sex (same goes for a woman) because of the risk of STDs/AIDS. A woman does not have to be a prostitute in order to carry a STD. Plenty of non-prostitute type women end up with one b/c THEY trusted a man and had unprotected sex.
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
Why should women have 26 weeks to decide and men get no time to decide? They get told the woman’s decision and BOOM, he has to pay for child’s expenses. If she wants the baby and he doesn’t, he shouldn’t be held responsible for the child. Just like how men aren’t allowed to force women to have babies. Why one standard for women and another for men? Argh!
What if the guy wants a child and his GF/wife is hellbent on getting it aborted? This is unfair to him, isn’t it? What if he is willing to raise the baby and take care of all expenses? Should she be forced to give birth to the baby? No, right? It would be perfectly fine and just to leave her because she aborted his child or she shouldn’t whine if he gets a surrogate mother or even a second wife.
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
People hide all sorts of things include STDs/AIDS. Unless he gets her tested, he has no way of knowing if she has STDs or is on birth control. The thing is I know too many stories where men have been tricked and I feel it’s really unfair. When men protect themselves, women complain that men don’t trust them. He would look ridiculous using condoms if his GF has told him she is on birth control.
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
I see how my first point number is flawed. There is an easy fix to that though. The marriage contract should have a clause where the man states if wants to have kids or not. “I agree to support all my biological children born out of this marriage” yes or no. Changes to the contract should be allowed later later in life barring some circumstances. I didn’t want to have kids, but want to have them now. I wanted to have kids before, don’t want to have them anymore and my wife isn’t currently pregnant. You can’t change a yes to no if your wife is currently pregnant. Though, you can change a no to yes at anytime. If your wife has a kid and you said no. The no turns to a yes if you don’t file for divorce within the first six months of the child’s birth. There will be exceptions for people who couldn’t do so because they didn’t know because they were not living with their spouse. They were overseas due to work yada yada yada. I know it’s not detailed enough but I hope it gets the point across.
I guess the above paragraph covers the second point also. I understand I wasn’t clear enough in my first post. I still hold my opinion that consent to sex does not equal consent to fatherhood.
I apologize for the lapse in my knowledge of the law. A woman goes to the department of child and family services (or CPS or whoever is responsible)claiming I am the dad of her kid saying I’m not paying child support. They send me a letter to my last known address asking me to accept or deny. I deny, she files a paternity suit. The kid is mine, I pay. I didn’t want the kid, but I still pay. I probably didn’t even know the kid existed until I got the letter. If I don’t get the letter and reply in time they’re probably gonna assume I’m the dad and rubber stamp the document that seals my fate. Please do let me know if I said something too wrong.
My wording wasn’t clear on this one and I apologize for that. I live with my wife for 5 years. We have a 3 year old and a 9 months old. We divorce. In this case I ought to pay child support. I can’t say I didn’t want the kids. I stayed with the mom for 3 years after the first one and 9 months after the second one was born. Why did I stay that long if I didn’t want the kids? I should have filed for divorce if I felt so strongly about it. This scenario agrees with my first paragraph on the “don’t wanna have kids clause” also. Assuming he filed to change the yes to a no after the first kid and the wife didn’t divorce him for it. He still overstayed his six months limit.
Same goes for if you have similar aged kids with you girlfriend. Why didn’t you bail when she started to look pregnant the first time. Or the second time if you didn’t want the second one.
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
Condoms have an extremely high failure rate of around 15%. This means a man can get a woman pregnant despite having a rubber on.
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
You’re making it seem like sending a check every month is exactly same as forcing a woman to go through pregnancy/birth? Men aren’t allowed to force women to have a baby b/c again, its her body and she bears 100% of the risks of this process. Even with abortion…risks are low BUT they still exist and again, it is the woman’s body taking ALL the risk. This standard exists b/c that’s just how God made us. I get the sending a check every months (money the guy could use for other things) sucks but this is in no way invading the guy’s control over his own body or putting him in any danger.
he guy is also free to encourage the woman to give the baby up for adoption OR as soon as she’s involved with another man seriously or gets re-married, encourage her/her new partner to adopt the child so he’s legally off the hook totally.
BTW, if the guy is willing to take the baby full time, then the mother would be on the hook for child support. Guy can choose to not to after her for it…but anytime during the 18 years, he can change his mind and make her pay. Neither parent can give up this legal obligation unless that child is adopted.
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
This is news to me. That is fair enough.
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
You’re assuming control over your body is more important than control over your finances. What if such a financial burden keeps you from starting a family with your current partner or providing for your other kids, the ones you actually wanted and love? The mental angst caused by slaving to pay for a being you never intended to create seems like a significant burden to me as a man. And “that’s how god made us” doesn’t work for people who do not believe in the existence of such a being.
And what if she can’t find such a “lal-loo”?
That’s not the point though. Usually she has the option to stop the child from being born, a man doesn’t have that.
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
Child maintainence is for the child. If the man can’t provide he shouldn’t procreate. I have no sympathy for the mental angst of irresponsible adults.
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
Well said, bro!
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
Because medically a fetus is medically not viable outside the mother before this.
Biologically this is how it is. A man has to pay towards child maintenance and that is for the child. You are failing to c that if this is not enforced the child is the loser
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
Failure rate is 2%. Again if he absolutely doesn’t want children he can always abstain. No one is forcing him to have sex
Re: Reproductive Rights - Do men have any?
No, I am not failing to see that. If the guy doesn’t want the child and she is hellbent on giving birth to it, she should be responsible or she shouldn’t be allowed to give birth. Sounds cruel right? It’s also cruel to me that men have been used by cunning women in order to collect child support money.