Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

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Seriously, every time there is a discussion on the Islamic lifestyle, sunnahs,…etc. there is this one smart ‘modern’ Muslim guy who always jumps in the discussion from somewhere and reminds you out of nowhere that the laptop, computer, aeroplane…etc. you use are all made by your so called kuffars, even when Kuffars are not part of the discussion. Well, I never knew technology can be a substitute for “IMAAN”

There is no denying their contribution. Even in the times of the Prophet (saw) the best swords, arrows, war equipment..etc. were made by Romans, Iranis…etc. There aren’t many inventions proven by the Suhabas, ta’ba’eens..etc.So what. Most of the spiritual knowledge (that people don’t even consider crediting) comes from Rumi, Imam Ghazali…etc. Also in the Islamic Golden Age (Probably dark times for Europe) there were many inventions by Muslims Bu ali sina, Ibn-e-alhaitham, Ibn-e-al-nafees…etc.

Secondly, interestingly whenever there is a spiritual debate going on among non-Muslims, how many of them quote Muslim Awliyaas, and give taa’naa to their own people, by declaring that most of the knowledge about spirituality comes from Muslims. Or when it comes to respecting their parents/ grandparents, giving them rights, not throwing them in old homes (whatever you call that) have you ever seen in general discussions, any Muslim country given due credit for any good aspect of it. OK, forget the country, how many times do they give due credit (talking about general discussions in daily life gatherings, or TV shows) to ISLAM for its amazing teachings, other than the extremist version of it.

I am not saying that we should take revenge and also not give credit where it is due, but our fan ship/ obedience for the western non-Muslim lifestyle never ends when it comes to degrading our own culture, country and people. YES, to some extent ok (like in terms of cleanliness of environment…etc.), but to go so far, that it seems their role models have changed. That instead of quoting Hazrat ALI (R.A) and Hazrat UMAR (R.A) you find their role models/ ideals being discussed and quoted by Muslims, more often in every presentation.

Rant over, forgive me if it doesn’t make sense. Wrote it in emotions, didn’t even organize what I wanted to write. Have been thinking over it for a long time, but a recent jolt in a discussion forced me to write about it.

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

I think this comes up when some over-enthusiastic discussant claims that the western civilization is full of evil, is heading for disaster, etc.

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

Also if possible, can anyone tell me what is the english translation of "ta'naa" ?

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

Does such response (in terms of spirituality) also comes from one of their groups, when another group among them claims that the Islamic civilization is full of evil, is heading for disaster, etc. ?!

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

Difficult to respond when most of it seems true. It already is a disaster.

How long would we dwell on accomplishments of the past by people who happened to be Muslim a few centuries ago? We have not much to show for in the last 500 years or so. Unfortunately, we were born in 20th century in Muslim families and therefore don't have much to be proud of, if we need to, of the current state of 'Islamic Civilization'.

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

Taunt i guess :@:

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

True. The question is: how does these self degrading comments and taunts of inventions helps in solving our problems or play its role in guiding our younger generation towards a motivational struggle towards self improvement, individually and as a society/ nation.

Btw, during the dark age of Europe, did they also use to demoralize their youngsters, children, by non stop admiration of the super powers of that time. Also, kind of indirectly presenting other societies as a model so that their children start copying them in every aspect ?!?!

Or did they adopt a more motivated/ inspirational approach to rise and target an aim in life ?!?

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

Yeah it's lame.

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

They don't. Neither does calling 'West' evil and full of filth.

Instead of only looking at the 'evils' of the superpowers, look at their universities and systems. This is how Europe came out of dark ages. Learn from them. Accept that you are weak at this point in time and the only way of getting strong is by improving yourself and not destroying others.

Many European countries are more 'Muslim' in terms of governance now. Only if we adopt their legal system where rich and poor are treated, more or less, fairly, we would progress a lot.

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

If yo look around Islamic world it certainly look like we are heading toward disaster actually we are already in the middle of storm.

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

most of the time if i say stuff like this, is generally when theres alot of westbashing going on, like, my parents and uncles and aunts who LIVE IN THE WEST ALL THEIR LIVES AND HAVE EARNED THEIR HALAL LIVINGS THERE, still sit and bash gorey all day long. if my brother and 20 other people have a job interview, and my brother doesnt get job, its because THE SYSTEM IS RACIST,if brother gets low marks in shcool, told off by a tutor, etc its cause TEACHER IS RACIST....yeah forget that my brother never revised nor did his homework, its all down to racism. so yea i get annoyed and tell them if you like pakistan so much, go back home. why r u here?

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

True, unfortunately. No one disagrees to that. But is our approach / attitude an effective one in dealing with this storm ?! Rarely received 'resilient' vibes from arm chair critics, people like myself. If we all become the "first one to criticize" but "the last to make oneself example" (in terms of initiating personal sacrifices against the flow), then our younger generation would justify their saying of "Our gene is dirty" (believe it or not, heard it myself). Also, statements like "nothing positive can ever come from this nation". The next thought provoking concept/ step among our children would be to "convert" to a better religion/ civilization.

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

Its Asian culture to respect elders (parents/grand parents) not just Islam. I must say you have some nerve generalizing about the west and Muslims.

Its not just Muslims who are "victims" of globalization. What you want every kid to wear their cultural clothes in a western school? Do you honestly think they will not get bullied for it? Sure, we should be proud of our identity etc etc but we should also learn how to blend into society.

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

^ Ok, if I didn't convey it well in my lengthy posts, lets make it short what I wanted to say:

We always think / talk about Muslims (in present age) doing nothing (materialistic) to improve the impression of Islam, and bring in the technological development of the west to support our views. By this comparison of (proving the already proven technical superiority) of the west, we think we have served our duty/ responsibility, that is expected from us (the privileged/blessed ones) in saving the sinking ship of the ummah.

While, in fact we (the critics) ourselves have practically done nothing enough individually to deserve the authority of criticism, but have done more than enough criticism/ day (with generalization) of our culture/ civilization/ religious practice...etc. and given more than enough support to the west to prove our own technical inferiority, while completely sidelining our own spiritual progression (generally) compared to the non-Islamic culture. It is this spirituality aspect that is attracting thousands of non-Muslims all over the world to accept Islam, despite the storm & the media attack against us.

I hope its clear now.

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

Al-Khwarizmi developed the concept of the algorithm in mathematics, without algorithm no computer science or computers. :D

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

The other guy, the one you call a "Modern Muslim", probably isn't as enthusiastic about religion as you. He doesn't like it when you start quoting religion, no matter what you're talking about. You mock him for not knowing enough about religion, so he get's mad and mocks you for not knowing about reality.

There are more religious people trying to infuse religion into everything than secular people messing with them.

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

^ I understand that you are talking about some other cases that you might seen/ heard of, as no one mocked anyone for not knowing enough about religion in the cases that I was part of.

Anyways, I agree with you Islam is already a complete was of life, that can't be taken out of or infused into anything, to begin with.

No where in any case the Prophet (SAW) excluded Islam from anything by saying; Lets not infuse Islam into this case. This matter/situation needs to be dealt with by keeping Islam aside. Btw, reality is that the Prophet (SAW), our role model, taught us to deal with everything in the light of Islam, whether we like it or not, whether we claim to be less or more enthusiastic about religion. Whether a Muslim feels it to be logical or illogical, he (after reciting Kalimah) is bound to keep Islam in his life through every breath, and a Muslim can't intentionally sideline Islam even for a second, as ALLAH has not given us this option to be 'deliberately' sometimes practicing Muslims & sometimes disliking it when Islam is quoted in a matter. Being a Muslim is a full time commitment of looking at every matter from ALLAH's & His Prophet's perspective.

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

That's the problem. The other guy, probably doesn't want to be a Muslim, but he's stuck with the religion or else he'd be declared a Murtid and killed for renouncing Islam.

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Re: Religious discussions mein 'Technology' ka ta'naa dena ?!?!

^ Oh...ok. May ALLAH help him and put his love in people's hearts...oh sorry..I mean, may he himself help himself to protect himself from ALLAH. (HIS anger I mean)

Please do update us about his situation. :(

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It's true that we do look for western role models...but Why not praise any one regardless of their beliefs?
Then again when do we praise other Muslims unless it's a matter of faith. Other then that we are just envious of our Muslim brother/sister.