Rape and emotions

Re: Rape and emotions

You are one of the verrrrry few exceptions out there Sarah and kudos to you. I don;t agree to the fact taht emotions are base though. They may not go hand in hand with logic but ideal for me would be a balance between logic and emotions where each keeps the other in check, not a complete replacement of emotion by logic.

Social norms evolve through out time so who is to say that common expectations from rape victims won;t change. I am not too sure if human reactions to rape will change though. at times it seems u r saying that rape victims are forced to go through therapy because that is what is expected of them. Expectations take rise from facts. a typical rape victim will display emotions, will feel battered, will feel disgust and that is why we come to expect that from other rape victims too. If a rape victim is strong enough to not display any emotion then im sure he/she is strong enough not to give a damn about expectations too.

One more thing, I disagree to your last sentence "I will also go as far as to say that rape is not about violation of personal space. It is violation of space intended for one man". I think that is a reducing statement. Do women not have any sense of worth when detached from a man? Rape is not about violation of space intended for one man, it is about a violation of whats most private and personal, not just one organ but the entire body.

Re: Rape and emotions

Good post Femme Fatale.

Going back to the issue of typical reaction to rape (if we can ignore all the bullying that’s taken place in this thread that is) I don’t get why we must get so defensive about having a ‘less than normal’ reaction to it. Fine, some victims may have zero emotional reaction to the whole thing, treat it like an out of body experience and go about their business ‘merrily’ the next day. Good for you. But don’t be so sure about being ‘untouched’ by the experience … you (generically speaking) were probably already too screwed in the head and devoid of emotions to even care to begin with. And if that’s not the case, and you are able to suppress or deny (however you want to put it) a natural< yes not typical, not normal, but a natural reaction to it, i.e. emotional trauma and so forth, chances are you are well on course to ending up being such a case eventually. It’s like one of them slow poisoning processes that stays below the radar until you get totally screwed and turn into a monster. This is something as basic as the laws of physics (3rd law of motion to be precise), “there’s a reaction to every action” …see even Newton thinks you’re messed up for not reacting, and he’s way smarter than Kant :smokin:

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I consider people with no shame as dead people…Now when I say the word ‘shame’ it is solely based on one’s psychology…People with no shame have no sense of belonging…They cannot take for themselves something completely devoted to them and them solely…Untainted by the movements and reverberations of other entities…

Rape is more than just forceful coitus…It is the mental and psychological snatching, ripping and tearing apart of something precious to those who are alive…It is their self…A rape is devastation of the ‘self’…Now the ‘self’ itself is a psychological term…It is a mental denotation of something that makes us who we are…

When I say I am different from others, I am expressing my self…When I say I cannot be controlled by anyone, I am expressing my self…When I say I am independent of anyone’s control over me, I am expressing my self…The self is mental but it what defines who I am…

In the western lifestyle, the ’ free and liberated’ woman goes around sleeping with various partners…She considers it her ‘self’…For her to satisfy her lust, she sacrifices, according to us, the ‘self’ that is made up of her belonging to a family, a person, father, mother, tribe, family, nation e.t.c. in other words, according to us, she has no shame…She gives her self to whoever she deems fit not bonded to any other entity…She has no sense of belonging soul and heart to anything whether a life partner, husband, family, e.t.c., in other words, there is nothing to define her shame…She can be with one partner one day and another the next day…She has no sense of being devoted to anyone or anything…

In our culture, this shame, purely a mental word, is strongly defined…It is what shapes our women and gives them that essence of desirability, their ability to be solely and wholely devoted to something…Whether it’s a life partner, family, tribe nation, religion, she is solidly defined as being part of something or the other without the intervention of any other entity…

Rape is an assault on that sense of ‘self’ or shame…It is an attack on the very bonds and attachments that define our ladies, their sense of shame and their sense of belonging wholly and solely to something or the other whether a life partner, family e.t.c…

That is why, girls from families who have a well endowed sense of belonging are cherished…(Well at least by me, and I am sure others as well who subscribe to the notion of devotion)…It is because these girls have the capability to be wholly and solely devoted to something, their sense of shame strong and their sense of ‘self’ well developed…It denotes a living will behind their actions to be devoted to something, life partner, family e.t.c…Most girls from good families with deep roots in their noble heritage of traditions, would rather kill or kill themselves than be subjected to rape…So strong is their sense of utter devotion…And men like myself seek, cherish and desire such women from such families…And it is these kinds of women that give womenkind a good name…

So for a woman, who can easily give up her sense of ‘self’ and shame like a prostitute, it means she is dead…Spiritually…She has no sense of devotion, no sense of belonging, she is the kind that gives a bad name to womankind…She surrenders her sense of ‘self’ and shame to anyone…And the reason that a woman would be looked down if she was raped and she didn’t give a hoot, was because she so easily gave up her ‘self’ without a struggle…That means anyone can come by and take her ‘self’ as he wants…

Wallahi, I am amazed at my religion and my Prophet :saw:…He said, “For he, who has no shame, let him do whatever he wants…”

To many of you this will not mean much…But just try to understand, that this sense of shame, a purely mental and psychological thing, is tied so closely to my faith Islam…It is this shame that defines a Muslim…

Didn’t mean to digress, but the bottom line is, this sense of shame is tied to the core of the human psyche…It is from this that devotion bubbles up…Devotion to whatever, life partner, family, parents e.t.c…The person not having this is dead…He is cheap…Apart from having a cheap sense of living, their affection, dislike, love, taste and everything else is cheap too…For they have no devotion to anything…

So that’s why, I guess there is such a blockage and severe penalty in Islam for rape…For it ravages a woman’s sense of ‘self’…That’s why women are meant to cover up, so the desire to rape is lessened…

Wallahoalam…

Re: Rape and emotions

if u think what the person is taking away from u is precious there is no way u wont struggle to stop him from doing so....

i remember a guy here having a signature that read "if rape is inevitable, lay back and enjoy it", so if that is the way u think, then i dont think u will find many agreeing with u....

in Islam if a person dies in a struggle to avoid his wealth being stolen, he is considered a martyr....
i am sure the same applies for a woman trying to protect her chastity....

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[QUOTE]
I agree with hiccup completely, there is nothing special about male rape, it's just the reduction of a man to femininity when he is raped by another man. He is not expected to voice his emotions because that would make him a woman. His rape almost makes him impotent. There are no distress centers for men. There are no hotlines for men who have been raped. In the hospital where I work, there is no discussion of men's sexually abused past. It is mentioned in passing, not belabored to form trajectories for future emotions and coping styles as it is for women.

[/QUOTE]

Male rape has been considered the penultimate punishment and been used as a weapon, perhaps still being used in places like Afghanistan/Africa etc, and in such places i think there are no help lines available both for sexes.

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geek: You bully wannabe: you have tried way too hard. Better luck next time. Try redrafting your responce or somthing, if that fails at least copy paste newtons 3rd law correctly. Its equal and opposite.

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Haha. That this post wasn't even about rape and everyone jumped on that goes to show how brainwashed by patriarchy we are. And shame is a patriarchal concept too that limits women. Thank god for liberal education. Why so much fervor for the vagina and none for the development of the mind? Pathetic. Tell me this isn't patriarchy. Pathetic. I can't believe the stuff you guys come up with and how unaware of your brainwashed-ness you all are. Have fun with your shame and respect, and labeling of others who find your views pathetic.

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This has been a good test. In the future, I will bring this topic up with strangers to weed out who is brainwashed and who is not. And who actually can get beyond sex, which was what I was trying to get beyond and all of you are stuck in. Have fun in your holes.

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^You are assuming that I am justifying rape or sexual molestation...I am not..I am just saying that sometimes rape does not happen and women lie about it to hurt men.
I don't come from the same medieval class of citizens from this country as you do who get pissed off at the mere thought of someone talking badly about their women so you can save this typical desi attempt at geting a person's blood boiling for someone else.

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I high lighted what you said ref: evil. But whatever, each to their own and medieval is all relative. No ones blood is boiling, but im quite bored of this duscussion now. if you did say what you say you did, then it was a moot point anyway. the examples you gave were not allegations. So er yea. have fun.

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Great post!

I am short listing it for my 'bestoftheyear2006' list.

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This is what it was about -> Why do we want to pathologize woman who have been abused before we vindicate them? Rape is the paragidmatic abuse, but not the aggregate of it. Just one form of it.

Goodbye.

Re: Rape and emotions

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My answer was based on the bolded part of your diatribe…You are welcome to have whatever beliefs you wish, I just explained what I believed…

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Hey,you wanna change the title or something before you go? Maybe readjust a couple of your posts too while at it, where you've back-tracked and changed your story about 2343 times. Now if only we could all learn a thing or two from Newton and try not to take things( misquoting his laws for instance) too personally, half our troubles would be over.

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And lajawab, wth? tumko tou allah hi puche ga.

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. Your pseudo wittism regarding the eccentricity that is Newton was rather ironically amusing, so all I cared to do was correct.

Word of the day: Indifference. haha

Re: Rape and emotions

Sarah: I was a strong believer in the above for a long time, but slowly with time my belief has almost completely eroded. Due to the nature of my job, I have come in contact with women and men of diverse nationalities. I have come to realize that there is a difference between how a female thinks and how a male thinks, regardless of their education, nationality and ethnicity. I said in this forum before as well, that IMHO although for a major portion the human intelligence of females and males overlap, there is still a significant portion where it does not. There are proven physiological and physcological difference between males and females.

Socialized or Conditioned to be weak is a phrase I don't tend to agree. To me to analyze any condition, you must refer to its initial conditions. So here as well we must refer to the times when human societies were being formed. At such an initial stage of the development of societies, all the things must have fallen into their naturally equilibrium stage. There could not have been any conditioning at that time. Almost all the individual cultures and societies took up similar social systems, so there must be a reason behind that.

Females being "emotionally vulnerable" is a term crafted by male-oriented societies. Why being emotional is considered a weakness? It is strength of females to have stronger emotional responses and is in fact a weakness of the males.

Please do let me know, what is your opinion.

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Sometimes I wish I had just let it happen.. fighting it, getting angry, getting upset took way too much energy esp when noone took it seriously.. either let it happen and "enjoy" or given him the beating he'd never forget.. instead I did nothing but be a pathetic wimp and cry afterwards.