Quran verse promotes separation in family

If you check surah 9 verse 23 it says don’t be friends with your parents or siblings if they don’t believe. Not everyone will have same beliefs, so why does Islam have to be intolerant and promote division between family?

Quran, Surah 9 Verse 23 (9:23):
**YUSUFALI: **O ye who believe! take not for protectors your fathers and your brothers if they love infidelity above Faith: if any of you do so, they do wrong.
PICKTHAL: O ye who believe! Choose not your fathers nor your brethren for friends if they take pleasure in disbelief rather than faith. Whoso of you taketh them for friends, such are wrong-doers.
SHAKIR: O you who believe! do not take your fathers and your brothers for guardians if they love unbelief more than belief; and whoever of you takes them for a guardian, these it is that are the unjust.

Re: Quran verse promotes separation in family

The mentioned verse just tells me that I should stop talking to you.

Re: Quran verse promotes separation in family

So you think it’s right for Quran to say that my parents and siblings should stop talking to me because I don’t believe in Islam? :confused:

The verse doesn’t say “stop talking”, it says “don’t take them as a friend or guardian”.

Re: Quran verse promotes separation in family

Wise Guy try explaining following lines from the Bible and you will get your answer.

*34 "Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword

35 "*For I came to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; *

36 *and a man’s enemies will be the members of his household." *(Matthew 10:34-36)

51 "Do you suppose that I came to grant peace on earth? I tell you, no, but rather division;

52** for from now on five members in one household will be divided, three against two, and two against three..."** (Luke 12:51,52)

"And He said to them, "But now, let him who has a purse take it along, likewise also a bag, and let him who has no sword sell his robe and buy one." (Luke 22:36)*

Re: Quran verse promotes separation in family

http://www.siasat.pk/forum/showthread.php?50593-Javed-Ghamdi-Salman-Taseer-Asma-Jhangir-Khuda-ka-khof-karen-plz!-Nice-Column-by-Orya-Maqbool-Jan/page5

When we talk about islam, it becomes inevitable to talk about muslims as well. It is also very important that we look at islamic history in context of real world.

To begin with islam and muslims are two different things. Islam is deen=moral based divine ruling system and muslims are those people who claim to be committed to islam or to follow islam.

In the world we live, there are only two main ruling systems possible a) man based absolute imperialism and b)moral based divine imperialism.

If we study history humans started out as families joined together in form of extended family that formed clans and tribes that joined together and formed kingdoms. Kingdoms over ran each other and there came about great empires that world has every seen.

It is fact of life that things start spreading and once they can no longer spread they may hold or start declining. The same happened to huge empires that they could not carry their own weight and with a little help from outsiders as well they collapsed after they became saturated with singularity of power base or power became concentrated in one person ie emperor and his selected team.

As we all know after collapse of absolute world empires new world orders came about in form of political and economic empires. Various ideas were tried to solve problems that faced people at large but as it is right in front of ours eyes things are finally coming to a halt. All this because when this new idea came about for ruling people by separating politics and economics, it gave people a lot more hope than absolute imperialism. In this new system people on one hand could have share in the land and resources but according to their own ability and effort the while on the other hand they could play part in decision making as politicians but again according to their own abilities and efforts.

There had to come a time when politics had to become a power game between fewer and fewer people because a lot of them got eliminated by process of elimination ie competition. The same happened in economic field that land and resources ended up back in fewer and fewer hands by means of different mechanisms. This left masses in the world with little or nothing to live on.

People are trying to find new ways to cope with this situation but I see no way out of it other than islamic ruling system.

This raises a question, what is islam? A ruling system=deen or a religion=mazhab or a tradition= maslak?

The answer is islam is a divine ruling system, not a manmade religion or a tradition.

This also raises a question, why islam is not a human tradition? It is not a human tradition because it is based upon divine revelation ie the quran.

The next question is, why islam is not a religion? It is because a religion is man made system of beliefs and the other name for it is make belief or set of dogmas invented by some people for some reason to serve their intended purpose. This raises yet another question, why did people invent religion? The answer to get deen=divine rule of law out of their way.

If we study the quran carefully, we will see stories of the past prophets and their followers and those stories are full of struggles between prophets and the chiefs in their lands and tribes or kingdoms.

The prophets always without fail tell rulers of their time to let people be free, be just to them, treat them fairly, show compassion to each other, live like a single family and work together for progress and prosperity of all in the land.

In short they provide moral basis for their societies based upon their divine revelations and this is known as islamic rule.

In light of this explanation one has to see what did muslims do after the death of the prophet?

1)They changed the ruling system back to what the prophets including the last prophet fought hard against ie imperialism.

2)Islam stood in their way so they invented priestly class and employed them to mistranslate and misinterpret the quran and existing ahadith in such a way that their rule could be justified and on top of that they invented many so called ahadith and brought about so called islamic fiqh in opposition to what was already there.

3)Anyone whom they thought enemy was either eliminated or isolated or one had to go underground.

4)Since people could no longer oppose kings and rulers of time therefore those who were very concerned about islam went under ground and started various movements some known as tareeqat or sufi movements so that thereby people could transfer true knowledge of islam from person to person avoiding imperial detection.

However this did not hide for long and when rulers found out about such secret movements they infiltrated them with their agents and derailed them, took advantage of them and used them for themselves and if they could not then they destroyed them.

They knew full well that if islam succeeds they are bound to fail. It is because imperialism and islam are enemies of each other therefore conspiracies against islam are not only from outsiders but from within as well.

So the wide spread islam we have today is result of backing of ruling elite. This is not the islam that we find in the quran and quran based ahadith or islamic fiqh that is based upon the quran and the authentic ahadith and their proper interpretation.

If we read surah albaqarah, the very same story is found in there about bani israel as is story of muslims after the death of the prophet ie how bani israel became a useless people and then prophet moses had to revive them. The struggle between moses and his people was about deen v mazhab as well as between moses and pharaoh was imperialism v deen. People of moses would die for their make beliefs than give them up and imperialism of pharaoh v divine rule was not an easy thing to achieve for moses.

The quran is book of revelations for revolutions not a make belief story book for little kids or baby minded people. One needs to translate and interpret 2/26 correctly to understand this.

Muslims of today do not have real concept of islam and that is why they are so divided. General information as to what islam is wide spread but knowledge comes by questioning and finding answers about things as to why, how, when or where etc. Questioning helps find right places for involved pieces of information in grand scheme of things to put them together in such a way that makes sense or gives us the complete picture.

It would be more beneficial for people if they are told rules of law formation and their application because then all disputes will end. By withholding necessary rules and dishing out mere information mullas are creating deliberate confusion in the ummah and the rest of the world.

On one hand mullas thinks ummah is not capable of making sense of things for itself and then they tell them half truths, how are they helping ummah by doing things this way?

Surah fatiha is not paid attention to and story of Adam and Iblees is not understood in the quranic context

As for the story of Adam and Ibless, the story in the quran is very much different regarding Adam and Iblees as to what is said in the books of ahadith and tafaseer. It is wrong to attribute falsehood to Allah in the name of the quran. Why don’t mufties debate about words in the quran and the information about them in the quran? What are they afraid of?

As far as the quran is concerned, there is no any supernatural being other than Allah himself.

The quran is clear right from the beginning that to Allah belongs all that exists, for he is the lord of all of creation. He has provided for all things and gave the constitution to humanity to live by to fulfill their needs and desires.

This is explained in surah alfatiha in first 4 verses. The surah ends with seeking guidance of Allah from the divine book that is given and tells the outcome of following or not following the guidance by bringing in people of the past.

Surah albaqarah begins with elimination of doubt in divine guidance and clearly states what kind of person one needs to be to benefit from the revealed book. One needs to be muttaqi=one who does not break the rule. It is because the book is a rule book ie a constitution for rule of law in the land. Or divine book=divine constitution=divine rule=heavenly kingdom=paradise here on the earth.

The 3rd verse tells what kind of person or people muttaqies are ie they strive for peace on the earth in the name of the one who cannot be seen. They establish divine rule on the earth whereby they keep open the land and resources for all its inhabitants ie this land is for all and so all provisions in it are also for all to make use of according to the will of the creator for benefit of all.

So all wars and terms for peace are decided within first few verses of the quran. The quran then goes on to identify problematic people by way of their mindsets and attitudes and the way they conduct themselves. The quran then brings in ideas to make them think and wraps up all this at verse 2/20. It then advises people to live by divine rule from verse

2/21 O people, live by world order of your lord who has furnished you with ability of good conduct like those before you so that you could become free of harmful ways of existence.

2/22 Who brought about for you the earth as a starting point for your development and progress and made the universe the ultimate limit and sent down from the heaven water thereby He brought about fruits for your sustenance, so do not set up rival gods with Allah, and you do have the knowledge now.

2/23 Yet if you are in doubt as to the ruling system we have revealed to our messenger then bring a world order as good as this. Call upon your supporters as well whom you serve beside Allah if you are truly in doubt.

2/24 But if you cannot do this and surely you cannot then think about the fire of hate you are creating between people which is fuelled by people through denying access to provisions to others, it is ignited by those who reject and oppose the revealed world order of Allah.

2/25 However, deliver good news to those who strive to establish peace by way of reason and do what is right and good for others that for them await blissful kingdoms through which rivers flow. Every time they will be fed with fruits therefrom, they will say: this is what we were fed with before, for they are given things similar to those who were like them but passed before them; and they will have therein companions that are good for them; and they shall abide therein for as long as they live and maintain state of affairs.

2/26 Surely Allah does not bring to life nations by example of a nation that is dead, weak or mean but by an example of a nation that is far above that, so that those who strive for peace know for sure that it is the truth from their lord, yet as for those who ignore and oppose Our guidance say, what did Allah mean to convey by way of this like example? Thereby He lets many remain stray due to their mindset and thereby he guides many due to their attitude, however He lets stray thereby only such as have adverse mindset and destructive attitude to His world order.

2/27 Those who seek and conspire to move mankind away from the constitution of Allah after ratifying it, thereby seek discord in what Allah has commanded unity and they cause fights and wars in the earth. These are the ones who are in loss themselves and are cause of harm for others.

2/28 How can you reject and oppose life giving guidance of Allah, for you were a dead nation and he brought you to life thereby? Moreover, He will let you die then He will bring you back to life again thus you shall return to Him to answer for all that you are doing.

2/29 He it is who created for you all that is in the earth as well as attended to the cosmic space above and perfected them the seven heavenly bodies. And he has full knowledge of all things.

2/30 Behold! Your lord said to the chiefs in the land at the time I am going to appoint in the land a Khalifah for you. They said, are you going to appoint therein such as will create fights and cause bloodshed, whereas we declare that sovereignty belongs to You and that You are free of all evil that wicked people do and attribute to Your? He said, I know what you know not.

2/31 So Allah taught Adam the official titles and their full detail the rights and responsibilities then Allah put them before the chiefs and said, explain to me about these titles as to what they are all about if you are truly worthy of these.

2/32 They said, free of all faults are you, we have no knowledge save that which you have granted us, indeed you are the knowing one the wise.

2/33 He said, O Adam, appoint them with these titles. After he had appointed them with the titles Allah said, did I not tell you that I know secrets of the heavens and the earth and that I know what you reveal and what you conceal?

2/34 And behold we said to the officials, now submit to Adam as your Khalifah and they all submitted save Iblees, he rebelled and he was of those who opposed guidance from Allah.

2/35 And we said, O Adam, dwell you and your people in the blissful piece of land and participate therein as you desire but not at the sacrifice of the divine constitution because you will become one of those who breach divine contract.

2/36 However, Iblees conspired against Adam and his people causing their down fall and got them out of the blissful state wherein they were. So we said, live with animosity in some of you for others, and in the land for all of you is a dwelling place with livelihood for a time.

2/37 Thereafter Adam remembered some words of his Lord so he turned to His guidance, indeed He is the one Who guides again and again

2/38 Thus We said, settle in there all of you and when there comes to you My guidance then whoever follows my guidance, upon them will be no fear nor will they suffer regret.

2/39 However, those who reject and oppose our revelations they will be the people consumed by fire of hate and in that state they shall remain for as long as they live.

In the next verse next story starts about israelites that takes us to story of abraham. 2/26 tells us why these stories are told so that Allah shows to people how to learn lessons fropm them and change themselves accordingly for the good of humanity.

It should leave one in no doubt that islam promotes unity of people who are concerned about well being of humanity. People who want to use and abuse humanity there is no room for such people in divine kingdom. This is context of verses that have been quoted from surah 9 and same is repeated in surah 58/21

Re: Quran verse promotes separation in family

Forget Quran or Bible, what US constitution says about LEGAL responsibilities of citizens towards some activity against the legal framework of state? Are families exempted or they are not expected/required to distance themselves from any unlawful activity of a family member?

Re: Quran verse promotes separation in family

LOL ... Unos's alternative is to behave like a mafia .... "do what the godfather says and don't question it" and "protect your own in right or wrong"

Unos ... what sort of logic are you trying to bring here? The Qr'an doesn't promote separation at all ... it promotes reducing infidelity ... those who are choosing infidelity will have the threat looming of familial disownership and hence will be averted from infidelity choosing to be with their families in piety.

You have failed to see the message and wisdom of the verse even when you cherry picked it for a bashing.

Verse 9:24
Say: If it be that your fathers, your sons, your brothers, your mates, or your kindred; the wealth that ye have gained; the commerce in which ye fear a decline: or the dwellings in which ye delight - are dearer to you than Allah, or His Apostle, or the striving in His cause;- then wait until Allah brings about His decision: and Allah guides not the rebellious.

Verse 9:25
Assuredly Allah did help you in many battle-fields and on the day of Hunain: Behold! your great numbers elated you, but they availed you naught: the land, for all that it is wide, did constrain you, and ye turned back in retreat.

Verse 9:26
But Allah did pour His calm on the Apostle and on the Believers, and sent down forces which ye saw not: He punished the Unbelievers; thus doth He reward those without Faith.

Verse 9:27
Again will Allah, after this, turn (in mercy) to whom He will: for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.

It's Allah (SWT) who gives blessings and endows victory and yet we do not turn to Him and choose a life of impious existence - the family is not higher than God and Islam ... it makes sense to the smallest child ... not to you Unos - You are deceived and want to propagate your deception.

Re: Quran verse promotes separation in family

And you think that is MORAL? Disown your children or siblings because they don't believe in Islam?

No, that doesn't reduce infidelity, it just makes people like me pretend to be Muslims so their family won't disown them. I don't care if the Quran is true, but I will love my child no matter what his/her belief is as long as he/she is a good human being, and that's all that matters. This verse is so immoral. These are the things which make me despise Islam and other religions.

I know, that's why Abraham was about to sacrifice his son to God. If I was asked by God to sacrifice my son, I would never do such a thing because I would love my child more than any God. At least I can see my parents, they are forgiving, kind, and merciful,and have provided me with food and shelter so they are higher to me than God and any religion.

Re: Quran verse promotes separation in family

Why this troll isn't banned yet????

Re: Quran verse promotes separation in family

This is a Pakistani forum and I'm muslim Allhumdulilah...and I think all members here are Muslims aswel..and if someone have any problem with Islam then why don't they go someowhere Esle???

I request all mods and admin please banned this so called member he is getting worst day by day.

Re: Quran verse promotes separation in family

@ op
You know no body cares what you think or say so stop doing all this and get the hell out of here.

Re: Quran verse promotes separation in family

Pakistani does not automatically mean Muslim, so stop assuming that all Pakistanis are Muslims and respect people of other faiths even if you don't like them. Stop with the triple posts. If you don't like my post, you can ignore my profile and continue on.

And how am I getting worst day by day? This is the first time I posted in days. What is bothering you dear Kinzz? Open up a separate topic and let me know rather than going off-topic here.

You know if you were not rude in this post and you had asked me nicely then I would of left.