Proper Manners of Eating

[hareem01]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

But where does the reward for following the prophet cross the line to punishment for shirk?

Allah (swt) says in his Glorious Book “Verily in the Prophet you have a perfect example”.

Today, proper manners dictate using utensils. In most cultures today, eating with hands is gross and animalistic.

Then how do these people eat? without their hands?

I think you mean they use knives and folks and spoons and sticks........they think eating without tools is animalistic.
^you are giving me examples of non muslims. I think Non muslim have a right to think like this. Thats it.

By continuing ancient traditions for the sake of following the prophet's cultural habits - in spite of using common sense - borders on worhsip in my book.

I dont care about a non muslim's book

[hypnotix-2000]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

I dont care about a non muslim's book

Yeah? Well what if I said the same thing?

[Seminole]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

Allah (swt) says in his Glorious Book “Verily in the Prophet you have a perfect example”.

Sure, in spiritual matters, I get it. But following the cultural habits of 1400 years ago? Spirituality doesn't change, culture does.

[quote]
Then how do these people eat? without their hands?

I think you mean they use knives and folks and spoons and sticks........they think eating without tools is animalistic.
^you are giving me examples of non muslims. I think Non muslim have a right to think like this. Thats it.
[/quote]
No, I said proper manners dictate using utensils. In most cultures today, picking up your food with fingers is gross, it has nothing to do with religion.

[quote]
I dont care about a non muslim's book
[/quote]
Sometimes the truth can only be seen by those who aren't blindly following tradition and culture.

[muali]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

**Hareem* and cricket player......we all know that islam's set rules or sunnah are not just copy and paste thing..... every rule/sunnah has an explaination ,has a meaning to it........*
eating with the right hand is indeed a sunnah..... but its a sanitation issue if we look into the explanation......

[psyah]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

Peace to you too dear brother

Apples and oranges brother...

So the focus should be on modesty overall, and not on pots and pans of gold. There is no disagreement there... I pointed out the focus on the subject and object.

Dear brother I beg to differ... I have already given you an example.

While I undertand the hikmah, and that if we were knocked back into the dark ages all of a sudden, then perhaps we would need it; but not today... as such, this is not exclusively the sunah of the Exalted Prophet Muhammad, it is the sunnah/tradition of the ancient civilizations.

Peace hypnotix-2000

You wrote this: In essence, I am asking how many Muslims and non-Muslims (especially on this forum) do you see eating in utensils made of precious metals.
I replied with the statement that if people are not seen eating pork is it important that they know or do not know that eating pork is not allowed?

This is not an apples and oranges situation. The ESSENCE of your statement boils down to what is observed.

The focus on pots and pans made of gold is still the focus as that is what is written. The essence in the words do not remove the literal nature of those words unless you can present that the use of gold is only supposed to be viewed as an allegory. Until that time we cannot rule out either method.

You say that you have provided an example, but I was not asking for an example. I want evidence that is documentary evidence of an historical record that demonstrates people used to use different hands for the purpose of hygiene. If you cannot provide this how can you even suggest it as though it was actually done?

We Muslims are not concerned with what past generations have or have not done. If the prophet Muhammad (SAW) did it, then we imitate ... out of love. The hygienic aspects are a bi-product. Rationalism puts the cart before the horse. I am still game to agree with you, all you need to do is provide a basis for your thoughts other than your rationale. Can you meet the challenge?

[Seminole]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

@psyah

We Muslims are not concerned with what past generations have or have not done. If the prophet Muhammad (SAW) did it, then we imitate ... out of love.

Out of love? What about other prophets, how did they eat? Don't you love them too?

Now if someone said they follow the ways of the prophet because he did "XYZ" the righteous way, and the way preferred by God, it's one thing. To imitiate the way he ate "out of love" - is worship.

[hareem01]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

Yeah? Well what if I said the same thing?

then you're misled.

[hareem01]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

Sure, in spiritual matters, I get it. But following the cultural habits of 1400 years ago? Spirituality doesn't change, culture does. No, I said proper manners dictate using utensils. In most cultures today, picking up your food with fingers is gross, it has nothing to do with religion.

Well, there is nothing wrong in using tools to eat............but preferably muslims should eat with their right hand with or without the tools.(as Prophet Muhammad(SAW)) did.

Sometimes the truth can only be seen by those who aren't blindly following tradition and culture.

I'm sorry.........I dont rely on non muslim writer's sources.

[hypnotix-2000]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

Salam dear brother,

@psyah

We Muslims are not concerned with what past generations have or have not done. If the prophet Muhammad (SAW) did it, then we imitate ... out of love.

Muslim is someone who submits in peace to whatever - In the Islamic sense, it is one who submits in peace to God. Sunni is someone who imitates whether it is out of love or ignorance - in the Islamic sense, it is someone who imitates the Exalted Prophet.

@psyah

The hygienic aspects are a bi-product. Rationalism puts the cart before the horse.

Perhaps, but it also puts the plough behind the bull...

@psyah

I am still game to agree with you, all you need to do is provide a basis for your thoughts other than your rationale. Can you meet the challenge?

I don't have to dear brother... you might want to look into research on cultural habits of many ancient and medieval civilizations. Even today, people in South India/Tamil-Nadu use the right hand for eating food, it is considered disgusting to use the same hand for ablution with water.

[hareem01]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

Out of love? What about other prophets, how did they eat? Don't you love them too?

We believe and love all the Prophets........but we follow only the Last Messenger(SAW).

Now if someone said they follow the ways of the prophet because he did "XYZ" the righteous way, and the way preferred by God, it's one thing. To imitiate the way he ate "out of love" - is worship.

Well, this is a worship..........but worship of Allah and not the Prophet(SAW). HOW?

Bcoz Allah has ordered us to follow and obey the Prophet(SAW)......So by obeying the Prophet(SAW), we are obeying Allah.

[Seminole]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

Well, there is nothing wrong in using tools to eat............but preferably muslims should eat with their right hand with or without the tools.(as Prophet Muhammad(SAW)) did.

He also rode a camel and relieved himself in the desert. He didn't have deodorant, flouride or a disposable razor. How far and when do you decide what to imitate? Did he have a remote control for the TV? Oops! You better get off the couch to change the channel. Oh, that's right he didin't spend his time watching TV, so it is preferable that you don't. Did he communicate on the internet? Then maybe you shouldn't.

It's CULUTRE. Not nirvana, not righteousness, not spirituality, not love, not obedience. But CULTURE.

[hareem01]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

He also rode a camel and relieved himself in the desert. He didn't have deodorant, flouride or a disposable razor. How far and when do you decide what to imitate? Did he have a remote control for the TV? Oops! You better get off the couch to change the channel. Oh, that's right he didin't spend his time watching TV, so it is preferable that you don't. Did he communicate on the internet? Then maybe you shouldn't.

It's CULUTRE. Not nirvana, not righteousness, not spirituality, not love, not obedience. But CULTURE.

No, its not culture ..........its inventions, its technology.

[hareem01]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

Seminole......this thread is about eating manners.....so please stick to the topic.

You can start new threads about tv or internet or whatever you like.....I wont mind.

[hypnotix-2000]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

Bcoz Allah has ordered us to follow and obey the Prophet(SAW)......So by obeying the Prophet(SAW), we are obeying Allah.

Allahu Amarnaa bihaa, right Hareem01? :)

[hareem01]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

^ I dont know bro.......how do you translate this?

[hypnotix-2000]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

^ I dont know bro.......how do you translate this?

Allahu:God (has), Amarnaa: Ordered us, bihaa: with/for it...

[Seminole]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

Seminole......this thread is about eating manners.....so please stick to the topic.

You can start new threads about tv or internet or whatever you like.....I wont mind.

That comes up every time there isn't a good answer - accusations of being off topic. But it is the crux of the matter. You can't ignore all the things that you do that the prophet DIDN'T do, but continue the argument that "it is the way to do because the prophet did" for these individual cases. It is all related.

Eating with your hands is not religious, spiritual or God ordained. It is cultural. In most modern cutures it is considred crude and GROSS to eat with your hands, I don't care what religion or culture you follow. You don't eat with your hands. Period.

You are right, inventions and technology have altered culture. Dishwashers make using utensils easier. So does hot water and Palmolive. The relatively inexpensive and ease of obtaining utensils today is not like 1400 years ago. Indoor plumbing and other hygenic innovations mean that different hands don't have to have different purposes any more.

If you consider it off topic to mention the things that the prophet didn't do because of inventions, then don't use the argument that it is preferable to eat with your hands when inventions make it much easier to not eat with your hands today.

[AQ]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

But where does the reward for following the prophet cross the line to punishment for shirk? Today, proper manners dictate using utensils. In most cultures today, eating with hands is gross and animalistic. By continuing ancient traditions for the sake of following the prophet's cultural habits - in spite of using common sense - borders on worhsip in my book.

Seminole: it is our religious right and you should not be so insensitive to attack our religion.

There is a quotation in urdu begaani shaadi maiN Abdullah deewaana

If you do not understand urdu, ask someone else...

[Seminole]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

You may think I have no concern, but I am expressing why I have not accepted Islam as the one, true religion. If followers could work out these cultural things that they have made into religious things then Islam could perhaps be the religion for all mankind.

If Islam is the only way to be close to God and not go to hell, then isn't it the concern of everyone, even those who are currently non-Muslim to try and understand the message? Either that, or accept that there are other ways. Otherwise I will continue to question.

[Femme_Fatale]

Re: Proper Manners of Eating

How many here eat with their hands publicly, as in meetings/conferences, weddings, on a plane etc etc??? A true devotee of sunnah should not have different rules for private and public eating then right?