What about the last verse.
** “And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers”** [Aal ‘Imraan 3:85]
How can they have salvation when they do not believe in the Quran or our Prophet :saw:.
Remember you have to believe in all the books and all the messengers sent by Allah :swt:.
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*Originally posted by ahmadjee: *
Now, let us all know if you consider the verses I quoted in contradiction to the ones you posted and if you don’t than how do you understand the verse about Islam being the religion of choice?
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I ve already said they apply to the Christians and Jews before Islam, the people who were the true followers of their prophets.
And yes if the call of Islam has not reached a people than as long as they dont commit shirk then Allah knows best of what is their outcome.
Thankyou
So you agree that the Christians and Jews do not believe in all his books and all his messengers (ie. the Quran and Prophet :saw: ), so they have disbelieved.
But then again, Allah being the Omni-potent can change His mind, right?
Kaleem.. I understand what you are saying. However, I take Allah's characteristics of Rehman and Raheem very seriously. Allah also says at one place, that why do you (my creations) think that I created you to punish you. Thats not the purpose of creating man.
The way I look at it, Allah sent his messangers to bring people to monotheism so be able to succeed in after-life. And in order to reinforce the message, He said that if you don't do as the messangers tell you, you will be thrown into hell-fire.
If you do as Allah, and His messangers tell you to do, then you will be assured of a place in paradise. However, from that point its a one-way traffic, and that is because Allah is Rehman and Raheem. All those who lived their lives on the right path, will be assured of a place in paradise, as Allah doesn't go back on his word to reward us. But those who did good deed, but did not embrace Islam, their fate will be in the hands of Allah, and He can very well chose to do whatever He wants. He can forgive their sins, and can enter them in paradise. Thats all His power. Don't you agree?
Lets try to get the discussion back on track. I agree to what you are saying. What I am saying is that, ok, so Allah has promised paradise to muslims who obey Allah’s message. Fine, Allah will not go back on His word. But when it comes to those who sin or don’t believe in the message, but do other good deeds, can Allah not change His mind? Because He is Omni-potent and Rehman and Raheem, and his intention is not to punish the human beings but to bless them with his Rehma’a. Is it out of bounds for Him? Does He even have any bounds?
Kaleem, I think you are going in a different direction. Lets see your response to this or my last post.
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*Originally posted by Kaleem: *
In the end no one knows what is in store for us in the afterlife, all we can and should do is try to be better Muslims.
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Its exactly my point. We, as in we, should do good so that we live our lives according to the message we are given by Allah. But we are in no position to issue decisions on what Allah will do with the rest. Yes, He told us that those who don't believe in Islam are in a loss, but then we also know that Allah is Rehmaan and Raheem, and most importantly, is All Powerful and can do whatever He choses. So we should not be posting forecasts of dire consequences about other people, except if are trying to scare the people into Islam.
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*Originally posted by Kaleem: *
Faisa, I Agree.
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Great. So now what do you say to our musalman brothers who say "i do know that mother teresa is going to hell". I mean, "really?"
Guys, can we focus on "Powers of Allah" instead of arguing which messangers we believe in?
Kaleem... exactly.
No when you say Allah, you mean muslim Allah or hindu Allah oo shinto allah or jewish god? Because singular source of profundity can have various names based on geographies. To give you an example, the concept of 0 was developed almost around the same time in two parts of the world that had no contact with each other. SO a common belief or approach in this case to knowledge didn;t need to be in place. i think most people around the world feel this way. Those that don;t await muslim hells, jewish hells, christian hells or even the three gates of hindu hell...
Kaleem, so all those people who lived before the 7th century and died ended up in hell? God seems like sadist in that case. He didn;t even give them a choice.
Isn't Allah referred to as 'Rab-ul-Alameen' and 'Rehman'. Where does it say that he is exclusively a God for Muslims. So if we go by that logic, then I believe that he would surely have his own judgement on such matters.
By the way, it would be nice if someone can quote that hadeeeth regarding TAqwa and Parhazgari. I'll try praphrasing the translation, it goes like,
" Tum main say ziada naik woh hai, jo ziada muttaqi or perhaizgaar hai"
Is Allah exclusively addressing Muslims here? Any help would be appreciated.
In Bhagwad Gita also, Krishna says that souls who believe in him rather than believe in false gods shall reach salvation. But in Hinduism, false gods mean the things most humans worship like power, money, sex, or other humans. Only in Judaism, Christianity and Islam, believing in their God is literally taken as worshipping through that one path. It could very well be a case of the followers of the Prophets not being able to understand the real meaning and taking the literal meaning of their preachings.
A similar distortion has taken in the place of hijab. Historically rich Arab and greek women of Byzantine used to wear clothes of muslin silk which were transparent, so when Prophet Muhammed said that women should dress modestly it was in that regard. (Even the daughter of hardline conservative Aurangzeb wore clothes that comprised of seven layers of muslin silk which were transparent). But this has been distorted completely and now women are forced to dress inhumanely.
I think it is childish to believe that the Almighty God who has created this wonder would be so petty minded to punish some people because they were not born as muslims or christians. I think it is sad that all the great teachings handed to us over time have been distorted due to misunderstanding or petty mindedness of humans.
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*Originally posted by M: *
What about the last verse.
** “And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam [religion of peace], it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers”** [Aal ‘Imraan 3:85]
.....
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That verse points to the foul ways of the Munkees the terrorists.
The ones who follow any religion other than a peaceful one, are condemned to fire in this world and an eternal hell in the hereafter.
Munkees need to repent and they may be granted forgiveness from Allah. Here is what Quran says:
I believe
I believe in Allah,
His angels (plural)
His Books (more than one)
His Messengers (plural)
And I
do not discriminate against any of the messengers
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*Originally posted by M: *
....so they [everyone but a Munkee MAToo] have disbelieved.
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Faith is always about you and your heart, Bud!
Where do you stand on this Ayat?
Do not judge others, because Allah is the only judge.
Before judging Christians the followers of Injeel, try correcting the path of all the cohorts aka terrorist Munkees.
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*Originally posted by ThandyMazaq: *
.... will NOT forgive those who died on the path other than that of [Mullah Munkees]. ....
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< Edited >
PA has shown that verse 3:85 as quoted by the < Edited > M was clearly out of context.
Verse 3:85 read in conjunction with 3:84 gives an entirely different meaning. Tandy is following his brother in arm when he quotes single verses without context.
< Edited >
antiobl,
Ok dude, enough! No more name-calling and no more personal insults. Try to participate in a more productive manner and focus on the topic.
Thanks.
Ok look we only follow Muhammad :saw: and we follow the Quran. Yes we believe in all the books revealed by Allah :swt: and we believe in all the messengers sent by him, but we do not follow them.
Can anyone explain how we follow what was revealed to Ismail (as) and Ishaq (as) and Yaqoub (as) and Musa (as) and Isa (as) ? Other than using the Quran?
These were for the people before Muhammad :saw: after him there is only one way.
Anything that was needed in the previous revelations can be found in the Quran & sunnah, and that is all we follow.
All the other prophets were sent to a particular group of people, whilst our Prophet :saw: was sent to all of mankind. He is the greatest Prophet of all and the Quran clearly calls him a ‘Mercy to Mankind’.
This is the belief held by the majority of muslims, and has been so for 1400 years.
Despite what some members of other sects may try and bring in to the argument.
Anyway Ill leave it at that since were already going off topic again.
PS. Antiobl, yes we know u consider all of us MAToos (commie, lefties or watever) no need to use that and base all your arguments on that everytime 
Without going into much details and philosophical pondering on things I would share how I understand the matter.
I know quite a very few things which are
I believe in Quran to be the most ultimate truth.
I know that in Quran Allah has told us about His decisions about anyone who does not come under the umbrella of Islam
Then, I know that Allah never lies
On top of that I also know that Allah says at various places in Quran that Allah never goes against what He promises
Having quoting the above statement, it is against my belief and understanding that Allah will go against His promise about the non-believers just to show His powers which He is capable of as His Sunnah and His way can never be changed according to the Quran itself.