Pakistan's failing ISI/agencies

[Shamraz_Khan]

^^

Any thing goes wrong BLAME ISI or Army this is the norm of today.

Incompatible Politicians/Advisers are saints hence have no responsibility what so ever, It was said yesterday in GEO that the information was clear about this incident!!! but what measure did the govt. took to stop it, a truck and a Suzuki with 1000 KG of explosives were on the roads of capital city on the day when Zardari had to address the joint session of the parliment??? how come no body saw these two vehicles???

Jusgt blaming somebody or some institute for the sake of blaming is not a positive act by any means, i must say people blaming ISI or ARMY for this are totally influnced by the propoganda of west and our enemies.

No body speaks out about our enemies, who are there looking after and working on all aspects to destabalize our country, but every thing from Al-Qaida to Taliban is blamed to ISI???

ISI did created Taliban and CIA created Al-Qaida, why no body blame them???

RAW created and is funding BLA, no body speaks about them, only ISI is blamed!!!

if anyone to be blamed then it is our politiciains and us, we voted for these politicians, again and again... thinking that they have changed.. we are truly a nation of fools...

If army was not involved in politics & if it was doing its constitutional duty assigned to it in the constitution it wouldn't blame for anything either. The fact of the matter is ISI and jihadis in army are playing double game & it would not surprise me if someone within ISI was involved in this.

[hanibal]

If army was not involved in politics & if it was doing its constitutional duty assigned to it in the constitution it wouldn't blame for anything either. The fact of the matter is ISI and jihadis in army are playing double game & it would not surprise me if someone within ISI was involved in this.

So Now when Army has totally out of the picture, they are still being blamed!! funny isn't it. The Politicians are however, so weak that they are not been able to appoint a single person in the huge cabinet for Interior Affairs and have to rely on IQ of Rehman Malik to sort things out. what a pitty!!!

I agree the Musharaf is responsible for the mess we are in and army was backing him then, but we should not forget that it is again army who had withdrawn their support for mushy, which have ultimately resulted in his resignation, and if Zardari and other politicians had guts, they could have easily have hold him in the court of law for his mis-doing...but unfortunately this is not the case, the leadership has its very own interest, these interests are seem not to be in the favour of Pakistan.

To me Politicians are equally responsible for Army's involvement in the affairs.. it is their very own weakness of character which has enabled them to fill the vaccum.

BTW, why do u think RAW or CIA or anyother Agency is not behind the attack? Did RAW changed their mission and now working in the interests of Pakistan???

[Himalaya]

Agreed! So many posters here live in Cloud Cuckoo land. They think by the Army/ISI stepping back that their "glorious" politicians would bring a brighter future for the country.

I laugh when I see some of the posts. I would love to see the Army/ISI role removed from politics but the reality is Nawaz Sharif and Zardari would still remain incompetent and corrupt politicians.

Was nt Nawaz Sharif an ISI stooge? Were Zardari and Bhutto force into being corrupt at gun point by the army?

Neither one of them made any single effort to run a government. has zardari built up political career over the lastfew decades? NO - he came in over his wifes dead body. Zardari the great democractically elected President has done nothing but lie - he turned his back on promises before he was elected and what do you think he will do when he has the power? When he has the power he will have the power to do what he wants. Musharaf became corrupted when he was in power. Zardari reputation has been sullied long before he got into power himself.

Oh look Pakistan is a democracry - WOW - youknow for some people that is the most exciting thing - a democracy cant run when the largest party gets a significant % of its votes from the feudal Seraiki and Sindhi belts.

The whole democratic procedure in Pakistan is a waste of time - most of the people within the country are illiterate - you need literay and some form of freedom to have a democracy.

People underestimate the role of the ISI - maybe rightly so. But people forget that on the eastern side of Pakistan there is India - a country which will NEVER accept seeing Pakistan on the world map and will and has gone out of its way for the destrcution of pakistan. On the western side you have a government in Afghanistan which is anti-Pakistan and afghanistan has always claimed the pashtun belt of Pakistan - and it always will.

Before 2001 India had no role to play on the western border - they were nothing but a thorn in the side. Now there is a complete change. India is taking advantage of the Affghan situation hence the trouble on the western border both in Balochistan and NWFP. If the trouble on the western border was solely war of terror related then it would only affect the pashtun areas but no the Balochistan issues has also heated up.

Without the ISI supporting the Taliban - Pakistan would be in a worse position than it is today. Lets face it India would have complete control over Afghanistan. Ideologically I do not support the Taliban but in reality they do keep the Indians and Americans at busy - neither of them are to be trusted. Musharaf was desperate to have the "moderate" Taliban in power - at least they were allied to pakistan

Its quite clear there are outside supprters of some militant factions too.

Imagine this if America is upset with the Russian action in Georgia and cites its national interests - can you imagine what would happen if India and Pakistan went to war.

How ISI and Army exactly failing Pakistan in nutworld of saints politicians of Pakistan? If army gets the blame always even in civilian government, whats the purpose of civilian rule?

ISI is doing very best for the Pakistan so as Pakistan Army, without them Pakistan cant survive a day or two.

[Shamraz_Khan]

So Now when Army has totally out of the picture, they are still being blamed!! funny isn't it.

Really? Thats news to me. Army has never been out of picture for last 60 years of our sad history, and they never will unless there is strong and stable democratic system which is frankly not in their interest. Otherwise corrupt generals would not be able to send their kids to ivy league school in the west.

[quote]
The Politicians are however, so weak that they are not been able to appoint a single person in the huge cabinet for Interior Affairs and have to rely on IQ of Rehman Malik to sort things out. what a pitty!!!
[/quote]

Leaders grow out of the system & when you don't have functioning system this is what you get.

[quote]
BTW, why do u think RAW or CIA or another Agency is not behind the attack? Did RAW changed their mission and now working in the interests of Pakistan???
[/QUOTE]

I don't believe in conspiracy theories. Why would CIA or RAW attack hotel & when will we accept the fact that homicidal jihadi terrorists created by our own army are the biggest threat to Pakistan existence?

[hanibal]

Really? Thats news to me. Army has never been out of picture for last 60 years of our sad history, and they never will unless there is strong and stable democratic system which is frankly not in their interest. Otherwise corrupt generals would not be able to send their kids to ivy league school in the west.

Do you see any General in Power? These corrupt Politicians cannot afford to have a Free Judiciary, So in result, Some other people comeup and take the role of check & balance, whom to blame again? Free the Judiciary, implement Law & Order and Army's role will be reduce back to barracks. Failing to do so, Army Boots will march in the parliment houses.. Only honest politicians can keep army away, How many of those we have in Cabinet?

This incompatibility is again invitaion to 4th coop.

Leaders grow out of the system & when you don't have functioning system this is what you get.

Totally agreed, I myself is the strong believer of the same, but what did our politician have learned? Sulaiman Taseer, is busy in destablizing Punjab Govt. , Rehman Malik have no idea what he is doing, Farooq Naik is defending and legalizing action of previous govt. I don't see a single politician whom we can say that he have learned anything in last 8 years exile or punishment.

I don't know about future, but i don;t feel the difference between an elected President and Mushy. both are self-centered and looking after their very own interests.

I don't believe in conspiracy theories. Why would CIA or RAW attack hotel & when will we accept the fact that homicidal jihadi terrorists created by our own army are the biggest threat to Pakistan existence?

and can you give me a single proof that ISI is behind it? is this not a conspiracy theory?
As far As RAW and others are concerned, can you tell me my, RAW and/or other indians security agencies supported Mukti Bahni in Eastern Wing of Pakistan? Give me a single reason for RAW's not-involvement in the act.

[Spock]

Re: Pakistan's failing ISI/agencies

Thejoke, its clear that Pakistan has failed under the army's rule, directly or indirectly (through the ISI), so why not let civilians run the country now, what do you have to loose? Its becoming more and more apparent now, as far as our top brass in the army is concerned, they cant fight the Indians, they cant fight the US, and its very clear they cant fight these extremists. When they cant do that, all they can do is get into politics and start running the country with a dandey ka raj.

[Himalaya]

The only thing you have to lose is your country thats it, nothing else. The last 18 months have seen a strange meltdown in Pakistan - everything is going sour. Corrupt politicians are back in, Musharaf/Military messed up, the whole economy has turned topsy turvy. And you think people like Zardari, sharif can make pakistan glorious again (it was nt glorious before but things were a lot better prior March 2007)

I would love to see civilians run the country. Would nt it be an absolute dream come true to see Pakistani civilians run the country. I dont think anyone would disagree with that.

BUT the civilians that are in charge now are criminals like sharif, zardari. Why do you equate the rule of civilians with the thugs, the feudals, the elite driven society, the caste driven society, the suspected murderers, the looters, the puppets of outside countries that sadly are the real traits of most pakistani politicians. It aint just Musharaf and Altaf Hussain who have a murky past. its ALL of them. In reality they are no better than the others but obviously we all have politcal biases and are going to swing one way or another.

Dont mix those thugs with civilian rule. And before anyone points it out I know they are democratically elected - but by a people who are blind to them. it says a lot about a nation whose respresentatives are those mentionned.

I dont support military rule and I definitely dont support those thugs but i also believe in supporting those if they play fair.

I have no idea if the Pakistan Army can fight the USA or Indians - stranger things have happened. But both mentionned parties have their influence in Afghanistan thwarted through ISI sponsored militants.

I have no idea if one could call the ISI failing agency as the topic suggests - the problem with secret services is that whatever they do cant really be measured.

People might dislike the militants but chances are it would be them who will fight for pakistan not those liberals, secularists, or so-called politicians .....look at Afghanistan..the 3 groups mentionned legged it abroad and I daresay theywill do the same in pakistan....

Thejoke, its clear that Pakistan has failed under the army's rule, directly or indirectly (through the ISI), so why not let civilians run the country now, what do you have to loose? Its becoming more and more apparent now, as far as our top brass in the army is concerned, they cant fight the Indians, they cant fight the US, and its very clear they cant fight these extremists. When they cant do that, all they can do is get into politics and start running the country with a dandey ka raj.

[Decent_6Chora]

Re: Pakistan's failing ISI/agencies

Its very easy to blame everything on Army but as far as I remember correctly Naseer Ullah Babar (Interior Minister of a Political Government) very proudly owned Taliban as "our boys"

Every one has a part in mess Pakistan is in. You, me (awam), army and politicians. Army has always blamed it on politicians, politicians has always blamed it on army and we always welcome both corrupt army and politicians with methiaan and parakhey on mall road!

[Spock]

The only thing you have to lose is your country thats it, nothing else. The last 18 months have seen a strange meltdown in Pakistan - everything is going sour. Corrupt politicians are back in, Musharaf/Military messed up, the whole economy has turned topsy turvy. And you think people like Zardari, sharif can make pakistan glorious again (it was nt glorious before but things were a lot better prior March 2007)

I would love to see civilians run the country. Would nt it be an absolute dream come true to see Pakistani civilians run the country. I dont think anyone would disagree with that.

BUT the civilians that are in charge now are criminals like sharif, zardari. Why do you equate the rule of civilians with the thugs, the feudals, the elite driven society, the caste driven society, the suspected murderers, the looters, the puppets of outside countries that sadly are the real traits of most pakistani politicians. It aint just Musharaf and Altaf Hussain who have a murky past. its ALL of them. In reality they are no better than the others but obviously we all have politcal biases and are going to swing one way or another.

Dont mix those thugs with civilian rule. And before anyone points it out I know they are democratically elected - but by a people who are blind to them. it says a lot about a nation whose respresentatives are those mentionned.

I dont support military rule and I definitely dont support those thugs but i also believe in supporting those if they play fair.

I have no idea if the Pakistan Army can fight the USA or Indians - stranger things have happened. But both mentionned parties have their influence in Afghanistan thwarted through ISI sponsored militants.

I have no idea if one could call the ISI failing agency as the topic suggests - the problem with secret services is that whatever they do cant really be measured.

People might dislike the militants but chances are it would be them who will fight for pakistan not those liberals, secularists, or so-called politicians .....look at Afghanistan..the 3 groups mentionned legged it abroad and I daresay theywill do the same in pakistan....

Bottomline is, that the ISI screwed up. They messed up with the whole Taliban thing, and they messed up with the country's politics, and now its basically a renegade group who is desperately trying to protect its existence. Its time to either revamp it totally, or put a lid to it. I wonder why they decided to attack the Indian Embassy in Afghanistan, because with idiotic moves like this, there will be disasterous retaliatory measures taken, apart from the embarassment we faced after Washington exposed the ISI's role in the bombing.

[GoldenAsif]

Only if you have studied little history you would know that Bhutto played minimum part in breakup of Pakistan. The seeds of disintegration were sowed by Ayoub & the clowns in the army decade before country split apart.

Also, the reason country is where it is today b/c of corrupt traitor generals & their involvement in politics...economic mismanagement, to institutional instability, to creating religious/non-religious terrorist groups, to outright thievery, our brave generals have hands in it.

I agree bad feeling had been brewing for sometime b/w East and West Pakistan. But Bhutto's refusal to concede defeat and hand over power to Mujeeb (who was the rightfully elected PM) proved to be the final nail in the coffin of this already fragile alliance b/w East & West. Furthermore irresponsible slogans like 'tum udhar hum idhar' did not help anyone.

[Shamraz_Khan]

Do you see any General in Power?

Generals may not be running things directly, but they're definitely pulling strings from behind the scene. Let me give you just one example of that. Remember when govt tried to put ISI under interior ministry & was forced to backtrack on that? That is just one example how military is still doing its own shenanigans & unnecessary involved in where it has no business.

[quote]
These corrupt Politicians cannot afford to have a Free Judiciary, So in result, Some other people comeup and take the role of check & balance, whom to blame again? Free the Judiciary, implement Law & Order and Army's role will be reduce back to barracks. Failing to do so, Army Boots will march in the parliment houses.. Only honest politicians can keep army away, How many of those we have in Cabinet?
[/quote]

I don't want to get in judiciary debate b/c topic has be discussed countless times, but let just say one thing. Its not the politicians who will keep the crooked generals away from politics, but strong democratic institutions that can hold them accountable for their actions.

[quote]
and can you give me a single proof that ISI is behind it? is this not a conspiracy theory?
As far As RAW and others are concerned, can you tell me my, RAW and/or other indians security agencies supported Mukti Bahni in Eastern Wing of Pakistan? Give me a single reason for RAW's not-involvement in the act.
[/QUOTE]

Well, I do not have proof of any of that, but can you with all honesty say that ISI has nothing to do with what is going on in Pakistan today?

BTW, for 8 years Americans were allowing Pakistan to fix ISI & take care of terrorists on its borders & eventually they concluded that ISI & PA were not trustworthy or sincere in dealing with jihadis in tribal badlands. And, Americans know everything that is going on and thats why they're launching border raids b/c they cant trust ISI or share lintel with them.

[hanibal]

Generals may not be running things directly, but they're definitely pulling strings from behind the scene. Let me give you just one example of that. Remember when govt tried to put ISI under interior ministry & was forced to backtrack on that? That is just one example how military is still doing its own shenanigans & unnecessary involved in where it has no business.

First of all, are you saying these politicians are so incompatible that they are controlled by a string, just like a horse or a donkey? if yes, then we all know that no donkey or horse can work on his own.
Secondly, This example clearly shows that, our politicians have no roots in the public and they are brought in govt. only by these generals. otherwise, how come an army general ( who is employee of the country) can dictate the ruler/CEO of the country?

I don't want to get in judiciary debate b/c topic has be discussed countless times, but let just say one thing. Its not the politicians who will keep the crooked generals away from politics, but strong democratic institutions that can hold them accountable for their actions.

and can you give me one example that how a strong democratic institues can be build? only a free and independent judiciary can have this role, any country lacking this, is suffering from croupt politicians and army generals.

Well, I do not have proof of any of that, but can you with all honesty say that ISI has nothing to do with what is going on in Pakistan today?

BTW, for 8 years Americans were allowing Pakistan to fix ISI & take care of terrorists on its borders & eventually they concluded that ISI & PA were not trustworthy or sincere in dealing with jihadis in tribal badlands. And, Americans know everything that is going on and thats why they're launching border raids b/c they cant trust ISI or share lintel with them.

If you don't have any proof then how come you can blame ISI for this incident? I don't understand how Americans allowed us for cleaning the mess? tell me, who rejected the proposal to barb-wire the whole border so that broder-crossing and so called cross border terrorisn can be controlled? who proposed it, yes it was Pakistani forces who proposed this solution but Americans ( in form of Afghan Govt) rejected it, nor american niether NATO generals speaks on this issue, may is ask y?

This was not the only thing! when Pakistani Security Forces suggested bio-metric system, then again guess who refussed to comply... Again Americans... may i ask y?

The war against terrorism started in 2001, targeting Al-Qaeda, very few key members of Al-Qaeda were detained or killed, but a large number of innocents who have nothing to do with Al-Qaeda were either killed or detained. May I ask the best intelligence agency in the world ( CIA) armed with latest technology and arms was not been able to loate bin-laden and his group members?

Now since american have launched their attacks on Pakistani grounds ( as per ur statement, the Pakistani forces were not able to clean the area in given time period) all they got from they did is killed, women and children...

enough said...

[Ambassador1]

What do you mean what happened? I am ready to enroll in General Kiyani's team for training and fighting against whoever 'dreams' to destabilize Pakistan. What gave you an idea I changed my mind? You wanna come join me?

If that is ever required, I'll do whatever in my power to bring along 10 more with me from my neighbourhood.

Just a day or two ago you were asking the army where to head to fight for the country.... what happened in a day or two?

[Aalsi]

ISI was created by the CIA.

Spock bhaijan. Do you know when that happened?

[TheRealDeal]

Re: Pakistan’s failing ISI/agencies

Official notice given to the agencies to clean up their act, lets hope they actually listen for once!

Security agencies asked to get their act together: Cabinet expresses concern over intelligence failure -DAWN - Top Stories; September 25, 2008

Security agencies asked to get their act together: Cabinet expresses concern over intelligence failure

ISLAMABAD, Sept 24: The federal cabinet on Wednesday expressed concern over deteriorating law and order situation in the country and said the Marriott tragedy was the result of intelligence failure.

A meeting of the cabinet, presided over by Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani at the Prime Minister’s House, asked law-enforcement agencies to act more effectively to combat terrorism because they had ‘miserably failed’ in pre-empting the Saturday disaster, informed official sources told Dawn.

The cabinet, the sources said, desired that law-enforcement agencies must get their act together because they had failed miserably to lay hands on perpetrators of the acts of sabotage.

The prime minister himself told reporters that he had stopped his ministers from issuing statements on matters relating to law and order and said that such statements should be issued only by the information secretary.

The decision came two days after Prime Minister’s Adviser on Interior Rehman Malik and Information Minister Sherry Rehman had issued contradictory statements about the actual venue of an Iftar-dinner attended by top leadership on Saturday evening. While Mr Malik said that a last-minute change of venue from Marriott to the PM House had saved the top leadership from the suicide blast, Ms Rehman said the hotel was not the venue and the dinner had been shifted to the PM House from Parliament House at the last hour.

The prime minister reaffirmed the government’s commitment to curb terrorism and stressed the need for taking stringent measures to eradicate the menace. He said that criminals did not have any ground to stand on and they must be pursued relentlessly.

“Law of the jungle cannot be allowed to persist and we are deeply concerned about the life and property of the people of Pakistan.”

The prime minister asked the authorities concerned to arrange an in-camera briefing for cabinet members on the current situation.

The PM’s adviser on interior briefed the cabinet on measures being taken to pre-empt acts of terrorism and said that the interior ministry was working in close coordination with the provincial governments.

“The army and other law-enforcement agencies are cooperating with each other to bring the law and order situation under control,” he added.

The meeting condemned the Marriott blast and abduction of the Afghan ambassador. The cabinet was informed that a search operation had been launched to trace the missing diplomat and the scope of search would be widened, if needed.

The cabinet approved a proposal of the finance division for introducing a consolidated supervision of the financial sector by the State Bank under the Pakistan Accelerating Economic Transformation Programme.

It also approved amendments to the Anti-Money Laundering Ordinance 2007. The amendments will seek to curb financing of terrorism, expand the list of predicate offences and define money-laundering in accordance with the best international practices.

The cabinet approved a summary of the Interior Ministry regarding an agreement with the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) for helping the government review the training curriculum in order to enhance professionalism of police force.

It approved a summary for signing a visa abolition agreement with France and Guyana for holders of diplomatic and official passports.

The ratification of an agreement with Tajikistan on cooperation in combating trafficking of narcotics drugs, psychotropic substances and precursor chemicals was also approved.

The cabinet approved a summary of the revenue division for initiating dialogue with Venezuela for an agreement on avoidance of double taxation and prevention of fiscal evasion with respect to taxes on income.

It also approved the issuance of long distance international (LDI) licence to China Mobile Pakistan.

[Himalaya]

Well they all screwed up did nt they - CIA, mossad and anyone else who directly or indirectly supported militancy in Afghanistan. I dont think anyone can predict the future as to how things will turn out.

Is there any real proof that they were involved in the attack on the Indian embassy other than what America says?

How would anyone revamp a spy organisation? The real danger is that if its power is cut then India will have an even more stronger position.

The ISI should not interfere in domestic affairs and should stop supporting militants, but with a Taliban free Afghanistan and Pakistan - how would those countries be?

Afghanistan will strengthen and move forward - its relations with India will grow even stronger. The only benefit Pakistan would receive is greater law and order. There wil no no US aid and nothing to combat India's growing influence in Afghanistan.

Sadly - either way it looks like a doom and gloom situation.

Bottomline is, that the ISI screwed up. They messed up with the whole Taliban thing, and they messed up with the country's politics, and now its basically a renegade group who is desperately trying to protect its existence. Its time to either revamp it totally, or put a lid to it. I wonder why they decided to attack the Indian Embassy in Afghanistan, because with idiotic moves like this, there will be disasterous retaliatory measures taken, apart from the embarassment we faced after Washington exposed the ISI's role in the bombing.

[Tariq_Akhtar]

Re: Pakistan's failing ISI/agencies

Whole of Pakistan has failed - the people, the economy, the religion, the institutions. So why is it a surprise if ISI failed too?

25pct inflation
Currency in death spiral
Markets and Trade in last gasp
100s dying daily
Military bombing citizenry
Politicos picking fight with USA
Clergy sending kids to death and destruction
Crooks become president and flirt with foreign leaders
Every neighbor in the region leaving Pakistan in the dust

If you guys are happy to just blame India for this destruction and not accept own faults that caused all this, may be this is the fate Pakistan deserves

[Ambassador1]

Just read this post and extremely disturbed by the information in bold.

My questions:

1. What right America has to stop Pakistan from blocking its' borders btwn Afghanistan and india to stop cross border terrorism? Can pakistan not take this case to the security council with proof Talibans are being supported, financed, provided weapons to from across the borders by the neighbours? Can our intelligence agencies not find a proof and persue this matter with the security council, UN that the deteriorating conditions in Pak tribal regions are due to the support these militants are getting from the CIA's puppet govt. and india??? Why can Pakistan not block its' borders with Afghanistan and india to stop that GUNDD sent into Pakistan by these countries? Does Pakistan not secure that right of blocking these borders to save its' land? Why not???

2. Can you please tell us what is 'bio-metric' system and for what it is used?

3. Who said CIA does not know where OBL and its' core team members are hiding and where its' strong base is presently? It is in DHHUUUBHAAAIII. This place is infected with al qaeda leadership and members. I would not be surprised if our tribal idiots are being supported through them too. US is training batches of their army / airforce. All of this started from 1996 onwards. And now this dhaabbhaa has strong base of al qaeda. It is freely operating there but not a single CIA officer will think of attacking dubai to catch OBL or any of its core members / leadership. Why? Because Al qaeda is a CIA susidary for middle eastern / south asian operations by recruiting people from the same regions where they wanna operate. And UAE is being compensated generously for being so supportive of al qaeda.

But why would CIA tirelessly continue to look for al qaeda sh!t in Pak tribal regions??? Because actually they are NOT genuinely interested to hunt down al qaeda. They actually have a different plan. That's what they are working on.... destabilizing Pakistan, divide it and then suck all that they can out of its' resources. Ofcourse all those who help them do it will get their share including the traitors of Pakistan.

If they wanted to hunt down al qaeda, they would have actually bombed dubai than any other place in the world. As THAT is the 'safe haven' of al qaeda. Keeping world's attention on to Pak tribal region is just a game for attaining different outcome as I mentioned above.

If you don't have any proof then how come you can blame ISI for this incident? I don't understand how Americans allowed us for cleaning the mess? tell me, who rejected the proposal to barb-wire the whole border so that broder-crossing and so called cross border terrorisn can be controlled? who proposed it, yes it was Pakistani forces who proposed this solution but Americans ( in form of Afghan Govt) rejected it, nor american niether NATO generals speaks on this issue, may is ask y?

This was not the only thing! when Pakistani Security Forces suggested bio-metric system, then again guess who refussed to comply... Again Americans... may i ask y?

The war against terrorism started in 2001, targeting Al-Qaeda, very few key members of Al-Qaeda were detained or killed, but a large number of innocents who have nothing to do with Al-Qaeda were either killed or detained. May I ask the best intelligence agency in the world ( CIA) armed with latest technology and arms was not been able to loate bin-laden and his group members?

[Spock]

@Tariq_Akhtar

Whole of Pakistan has failed - the people, the economy, the religion, the institutions. So why is it a surprise if ISI failed too?

25pct inflation Currency in death spiral Markets and Trade in last gasp 100s dying daily Military bombing citizenry Politicos picking fight with USA Clergy sending kids to death and destruction Crooks become president and flirt with foreign leaders Every neighbor in the region leaving Pakistan in the dust

If you guys are happy to just blame India for this destruction and not accept own faults that caused all this, may be this is the fate Pakistan deserves

Everything you mentioned, was happening in the last 8 years, even crook PMs flirting (though his attempt was stared down at).

[Tariq_Akhtar]

Re: Pakistan's failing ISI/agencies

^ yes ofcourse, atleast for second half of Musharraf regn too. That's another reason to say it doesn't matter who rules, the destruction of Pakistan is more due to ther constant factors than leadership or political systems.

Take one guess what one or two of those constant factors are.