[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by SaadiaB: *
Irem, I still believe that you should complete your studies in US. Ask someone who did hers first in english and 'had' to do it in German language, it ain't a piece of cake to learn another language and complete education in that language dear.
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sadia baji :-) bhai kee uni mein jo masters prg hae, they dont need t learn german, and same for some other masters prgs there...everything's in english and there r tons of int'l students there :) agay thori bohti mehnat toh kerne ke lyay mein tayyar hoon hi inshallah..
sadia baji :-) bhai kee uni mein jo masters prg hae, they dont need t learn german, and same for some other masters prgs there...everything's in english and there r tons of int'l students there :) agay thori bohti mehnat toh kerne ke lyay mein tayyar hoon hi inshallah..
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i understand that you want to be near your family, but isn't it still better to stick to where you are (my opinion - you don't have to agree with me), as far as german goes, maybe you won't need it in your uni programme, but you will certainly need it in your daily life basis. Believe me you will feel lost if you don't understand or cannot communicate at first, that's when you will miss your american education and uni life. But if you feel that its worth it then I would say go for it, good luck, of course you will learn a new culture & language and this has enough benefits too.
oh well.........chaltahai........germany is quite a good place to live
infact i think its the only country in europe which offers you free education........what you have to pay is only the cost of living......so its not bad here
yes it is expensive if you compare it with netherlands etc. but quite cheaper thanuk or us
yes it has become quite difficultto get a job here but ithink its not a problem only in germany
ppl r ok ......from my experience i can conclude they r quite nice ............
n well its a really good place for a student if you ignore the language factor.........plus there r several courses offered in english
i personally have met 2 ladies from america who r americans studying here irem......i got the impression frm some of yr posts .........but anyway its ok ......none of my business.....:)
by the way ...r u planning to come to berlin.....???????
the m.s degree you get from germany is called a diplom(a). soo first u will have to explain it to everybody that its not what they think it is BUT it’s a master’s degree. and boy thats going to take some effort. :~) they don’t really have a b.s. degree so i don’t know how u will fit it. i am assuming thats how it is in all the uni’s in germany.
the world you live in is a teeny weeny bit materialistic. welcome to the real world kidoo..:~) so, it won’t matter how good you are at work when you apply for a job but when an employer would look at ur application and would see that u got ur degree from germany it would be a REAL turn off (no offence to anybody) thats how it works. the only way u would get a job is if u were the only
canditate for that position. its just like back in pak somebody with a degree from the us would be preferred over a canditate who is a graduate from ANY other non u.s. university.
the market value of a degree earned from the u.s is higher.
b/w in pak u are going to have even more fun explaining them about it.
unless ofcourse you have contacts :~) well i am a self made errrr b o y and i prefer doing things on my own soo i normally
cross this factor out
as far as ur giving the excuse of the amercians are getting strict with muslims and this and that blah blah blah GROW UP :~) as long as u don’t do anything wrong; there is nothing to worry about. in general, sensible ppl, go for who U are. ppl tend to blame the system for their own follies. we should appreciate the good things which the u.s has to offer. and then again there are good and bad things about EVERY society. and education offered in the us[atleast in top 20 uni’s ] is good.
hopefully, i myself would be visiting germany again but not for education. no doubt its a nice place with nice ppl. interestingly
i have noticed that ppl in europe don’t really like the amercian way of life.
b/w my roommate is from germany(exchange student) AND believe me he doesn’t want to go back to germany to complete his education. he is keen to stay here. one of the things which he likes here is the student-teacher relationship and according to him (he is from uni of duisburg) he did not learn that much in germany compared to the u.s. :~)
german education system follow the annual system. for each course u are prescribed lots of books. there is no set pattern u have to follow. the teacher comes to deliver his/her lecture and goes. u are basically on ur own and so on..
but then again no matter where u are u have to study urself…
but in situations like these one has to decide whats best for him/her. and what are ur priorities.
bottom line: my sixth sense tell me that no matter what u hear; u will still be going to germany.cause’ ur family wants u to go there and most imp of all ur bro is there sooo quit venting out [not to mention whining] that u want to stay here and start packing ur stuff :~)
on a side note there was a time when the german i.t industry needed workforce. not anymore.. this was the reason a lot of ppl from pak/india started going to germany. and compared to u.s/uk it was easier and cheaper. incentives like free education is a big attraction for desis’s
heart beat, some good and correct points you got there. I didn’t wanted to discourage Irem but let me disagree with some of your assumptions here.
A degree from Germany / EUROPE is never a turn off my dear. you don’t really know what is means to have a Masters ‘Magistrat’ from Germany / Austria (both have almost the same schooling/uni system)
I know that companies around the world (middle east, asia, even america) are eager in getting professionals from Europe, so I don’t agree that Irem or anyone will have to do explaining about his/her degree.
A german / european degree is hot in pakistan, i know a friend who is earning good in pakistan working with a german instituation, so ** Irem ** why join the stream, why not be unique, everyone from pakistan who can afford it, goes to uk/us for studies, be daring try something else out, trust me you will never regret of going your own way instead of listening to people ‘who’ saying what is good or not, remember you set the norms and not others for you!
Yes there is not a ba/bs/bsc degree over here, there is part one and part two of the degree, part one compare to b.s of us/uk part two to masters.
I agree with HB with the learning system in the unis is very hard/complicated, thats why the uni are over-fulled, so the professors never can give you time, HB is right about what he said.
Heart Beat, I have been to an american school and to a german school, but i learned more theory in the german school and I learned nothing in the american school other than being confident and having lots of extra-ordinary activities, so if we generalise that the european system is not so good as to the american system (just because you happen to go to one) i can encounter and tell dozens examples of faults in the american eduation system, the main thing is if you are eager to learn so you can even learn in a village in asia/africa and be the best educated person in the world, as what is a degree on a paper to the real knowlege that one pocesses.
Maybe you had a bad day, don’t vent here and leave poor irem alone :~p
and yeah back in pak they have these things in the KICHARI’S too!
do u even know what u are talking about :~)
do i really need to say something on this!!!
so in order to get a job after graduating from a german uni, one is suppose to find a german institute in pak!! and if one graduates from an austrian uni, one should be in search for an austrian uni in pak!! interesting!!
NOTE that irem is a computer science major
b/w u mentioned institution which i believe makes it related to education. and it would even more interesting if she is teaching german.
i have spent most of my life in pak. i have not only had an opportunity to be a part of pak education system BUT was lucky enough to have a glimpse of the working environment too. Don’t get me wrong but sometimes its annoying when ppl who have spent most of their lives abroad and then they expect to understand my pak better than me.
and what do u think u are doing? :~)
besides, the basic idea of posting here is to hear other ppl’s view. and i am sure irem is going to make her own decision. so, stick to the topic
american school!!! in austria i believe!
whatever the case maybe, u are the one to be blamed for that. should have worked harder. :~) b/w education is not all about theory. and if theory is what u wanted to learn, why bother to go all the way to the uni; sit at home and go through all the books or perhaps take the course online.
when did i say that european education system was not as good as the american? please don’t make assumptions. i only quoted what my german roommate said. :~)
and thats what i said in one short sentence. which ofcourse made more sense and was more practical :~)
and after that one is sure to get a job with tarzan in the thick jungles of africa! yeehhaa!! what else could one ask for!
b/w u know what is taught in the villages of africa or asia?
haha hehe u are a funny girl! b/w u are right i did have a bad day; i got rejected from a local university in germany! i got admission in mit but i am keen to get admission in a german university which would facilitate me to get a job in a german institute back in pak.
regards,
hb
what if someone who graduated from germany got a job in a german instituation, at least he/she got a good paying job, as someone who got a degree from usa and no job at all.
so Irem is a CS major, even better, she will learn the same stuff over here, we are not from mars you know.
What makes you think that you understand pak better than me, its something that we both cannot compare, you will see pak differently than me, i dont have work experience in pak but i do talk with different ppl about working conditions and my best sourse is my own father. kapeesh!
I am no stopping from ppl saying their view over here, but you stared with gegrading a WHOLE country just because it does not fit into your status. you are a typical high nose type of man, who like to critise things that dont fit their shoes.
There is an american school in vienna, but I went to an american school in VA, USA. Hey what can I do if all I learned was abcd and gloeing things together on a cardboard. :-p but i tried my best to write full sentences, so you see i did work hard, you cannot accuse me of not trying.
b/w u know what is taught in the villages of africa or asia?
I know as my dad went to a village school before going to college, he did not have the best education then but he sure did make the best of out of it, otherwise i would not have been here at all.
**i got admission in mit but i am keen to get admission in a german university which would facilitate me to get a job in a german institute back in pak **
so thats why mr. high nose is so full of us universities, i wish you all the best in MIT, may u make the best of it :k:
I respect ur views; period! But as I mentioned in my previous post; do not make false assumptions . I think i was quite clear in my posts. anywaz, please read my posts again which would help you to better understand what i meant.
P.S. i did not get admission in mit. it was just a joke. :-|
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by irem: *
i have found americans to be very nice, but then again my experience is limited to the americans in my uni and around here and the area i'm at is known to be very open and tolerant and nice is lyay Allah ka ehsaan raha hae....
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^A few good apples on a bad tree. Canadian culture is more influenced by the Europeans and Asians. We dont carry the huge ego Americans do. For Americans its- HIP HIP HORAY-AMERICA ALL THE WAY. In Canada we are more down to earth. We love our country, but we dont push it into other people's face.
Another point. I am guessing you are a) Brown, & b) Muslim. Racism is high in America. The whole Black vs. White thing is so intense, other minorites are also feeling the crunch. In Canada the population is almost a 50/50 split between Immigrants and Whites. The number of Immigrants is increasing very high here, mostly people from Asia. So you wont find much discrimination here.
Finally the choice is upto you. If you like America, go for it. Connect Four. I myself am biased in this topic as I have lived in Canada for ages, and love it. I have been to America alot too, but simply cant imagine living there. Too hectic. Canada is calm. As for the San Fransico thing, San Francisco has a majority immigrant population, thus making it one of the better places in America.
^ Hogwash. That is why they are flocking to find jobs in America. 80% of Candian trade is with America. If we turn the tap off...bye bye..So know your place..canuck!
Irem.... aray baba.. just stay where u r and complete your education from here. Germany jaa karr bhai ko bhi tangg karo gi aur khud bhi tangg ho gi... kiya faida. Let your brother enjoy his life :~P
Waisay, life is not so bad here in the US. Kall ka tau kissi ko bhi nahi pata. Kiya pata Germany mein phir nazi aa jayein. Why worry about kall?
Concentrate on getting into a good school for Masters, and don't worry too much about geography of the school.
Agar ye baaqi parhay likhay log keh rahay hein ke US schools are better for Masters, tau phir sirf yahan se bhagnay ke chakkar mein itni achi opportunity kyon chori jayay?
Waisay before getting into a Masters program, why don't u get some work experience for a few months or year. And then start a Master's program.
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*Originally posted by Chaltahai: *
HMCQ: Why is it that you brandish MIT and like as it is a piece of cake for any avg. student to get into? I am saying this because it sets false expectations for kids who come here for advice and are bombarded with Tier-1 school info as the only resort regardless of their pedigree.
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Because the first teir schools is where she is most likely headed. Besides if people cant cut it to MIT, I am sure Harvard would accept them :). My veiw is that if people try hard enough they can get into most of the top 30 colleges in most of the programs. And you yourself have so often talked about how useful it is to have a Harvard or another big name school MBA. Same with masters program.
Irem. If you want to do something in humanities have you looked at Berkeley, Columbia or Harvard? They are all great schools to start with and I am sure with your background they would love to have you.
If you are aiming for a second tier college and comparing it with a first tier college in Germany or the UK, then thats a more comparable and there its really up to you.
As far as whats happening in the US, remember that you are planning on heading back to Pakistan and hence it should be of little issue what the US implements. There will always be the racism but it does not mean it would prevent you from finishing your degree. In fact some schools have contingency plans for their international students where the student could complete the degree overseas at a different school if they have problems making it into the US from a trip over seas. So dont base it on that when you decide.
My suggestion would be that you go for the OPT and work for a year in the US while you are thinking about where to apply. this will not only give you great experience of the marketplace and the type of jobs but also give you some money that could be helpful later on and more importantly it may help you decide what exactly it is you want to do in your life.
Hope that helps and feel free to ask questions here if they help you in your choices.
thanks a LOT for the replies everyone. i read them all and they were very useful. i’ll be back soon with detailed individual replies inshallah, busy with finals and stuff now. but thanks so much.
Irem where are you planning on working? here in the US or elsewhere?
The US is not that bad, I guess we Americans say that cause its home to us and I understand how you would feel being soo far away from your family and all. The international students I went to school with always were soo lonely when it got time for short holidays and spring break, so I understand. And you are right, the US now a days is kinda different.
One reason I did not go to an out of state school was because I get bored fast haha and I wanted to be able to hop in my car and come home anytime I got lonely or bored.
sorry for not replying in this thread for so long…
Hmmm…the latest now is that i’m going back home to pakistan right after graduation…
The MAX I could have stayed out here in the usa by myself after graduation could have been three four months anyway to work but I really didn’t feel like it also coz my parents would like for me to go back if I am not studying in grad school…dont really like the idea of just staying here and working…
so I think i’ma go back home right after graduation..
idea of going to grad school in germany has been dropped for now :biggrin: though definitely plan on visiting bhai there inshallah…
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*Originally posted by hskhan: *
Depends, if you want to work abroad,america is most probably the best for you. As they have more "brand name" univs. Canada also has a few, but admission is hard. From the perspective of living, Canada is a better choice hands down. If you've visited America and Canada from another country, you'll feel the difference the moment you cross the border. Canadians are kinder and more tolerant than Americans.
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Yeah right... I think amongst the US, Canada and the UK, Canada is probably the worst... I dont really blame them, they were meant to be american wannabes...
take it easy on the powder 
soo i normally
