Pakistani IT in US/UK

Society Religion & Philosophy
1

First I want to thank Roman for his wonderful and educational thread and I want to thank all the contributors for their insight.

This thread is related in some ways, but it specifically deals with pakistani IT in US.

I am a pakistani software professional with over 13 years of software development and management experience. Three months ago I was laid off and since than I have seen the IT with a different perspective.

As I search for my next job, I discovered that as a national group, Indian IT firms in US are by far the strongest of all. I was saddened by US economy and my search was not yielding much hope, having a muslim name and Pakistani origin does not help these days either. So I started looking for work in middle east. Again I discovered that Indian IT has roots deep into the middle east also. As I contemplated and saw the indian IT people that I know of and some of them I had hired. I discovered the difference between Indian and Pakistanis living abroad.

I believe it all boils down to unity among ranks. I know this very well that an Indian IT professional will always hire or recommend an indian IT professional first. Often will go out of their way to help them out. Indian in general has far more national pride and they always put their provincial and language difference aside and work together. This unity has translated into growth of indian IT firms in US, swallowing most of the offshore IT contracts.

Comparatively I have seen no such unity in Pakistani’s. Rather we are more divided based on the different languages or provinces where our heritage may have come from. Often I have seen Pakistani’s more busy trying to show off to each other who is more successful or wealthy, rather than helping each other prosper and grow in our own roams. I do not mean to offend any one and I know there are exceptions. But generally speaking I believe that my statement is true and factual.

To make the long story short, until Pakistani 's living in US are united, under one flag, one anthem and one language. The Pakistani IT in US cannot exert their entrepreneurial spirit, create IT firms and send offshore contracts back to Pakistan.

If I had offended anyone, I appologize in advance.

Sincerely

2

very nicely put.....

btway i am really surprised to c such a situation in US which was considered to be land of opportunities....can u plz explan a bit more how and when and y it happened and whos responsible for it and any chnace of improvement in it..?
is it the same for engineering ppl like electrical engs

3

I guess your question refers to the IT slowdown in US and not Pakistani unity. If I am wrong please correct me.

What happened to IT is fairly standard business phenomenon. Just to give you a real world example that has several parallels with IT growth and demise. Back in world war two, there was a huge growth for war related industry in US. 1000's of new companies spurred up, extra capacity wa added to factories, everyone was involved in research and everyone was hiring. All type of products were produced in huge numbers and economy was prospering. The reason for this growth ... 'SPECULATION'. Everyone thought that war would last several more decades and kept on production and research. Well it ended sooner than anyone predicted, Army had no need for all the people, essentially there were layoff and a mass group of people entered work force looking for new jobs. All the stock pile of extra production sat in ware houses and factories stop building new goods, as a result there were more layoffs. With people out of work, consumer spending is limited to bare essentials, as a result entire economy slows down.

The IT growth was based on 'SPECULATION' also ....the new media internet can transform everything. They were right that it will transform, what they were wrong at, was the pace of transformation.

Take care

4

thanx.........again u elabrated with agood example
fine but wat next is it temporary do u think IT is over just like when WW2 ended or its gonna pick up again?
My 2nd question was how are things in US for electrical engineers as as IT or a bit low or better specially for fresh graduates?

i hope u wudnt mind answering again
thanx

5

Well, as for as IT is concern, it will rebound but it i will not reach the level that it had few years ago. There will be some growth that will swallow a small number of IT force, other IT people will switch work and start new careers in other areas, and many will take pay cuts. The reason for decline is offshore contracting. I do hope that Us governemtn will step in and will regulate such offshore contracts and saves some jobs in US. First manufacturing jobs left, then call centers and now IT. What’s next, your receptionist and clerks??? This is not a good trend.

Unfortunatley not too long ago the american blue coler workers were losing jobs to asian markets. And white color people used to say to them, you guys were getting paid too much, american made goods were expensive and so we had to find cheaper work force. But don’t worry in a short time you can retrain your self in some office career and will make some good money like other white coler people do. Once those manufactiuring jobs left US, they never came back. And yes most of blue color workforce did find something in the white color world mainly because there was a good economy.

Now that white coler folks have lost their jobs, there is a panic. Unlike blue coler, they have invested large $$ and a minimum of four to five years in getting educated. So retraining for them does not make sense and often it is not an option. What does it mean for the out of work IT workforce that is not willing to retrain, such as myself :slight_smile: Three things.

  1. Survival of the fittest
  2. Pure Luck
  3. Connections
  4. Move .. to India, Israel, Russia

As time will pass by some new jobs will be created and the worker pool will start to shrink. As it shrinks, the remaing people will have a better chance of landing work. So all it boils down to is, how long can you wait and the longer you are out of work the better your chances of landing a job.

As for me I am trying hard to stay fit, I practice and teach myslef new IT tricks everyday. I have laready exhausted all my connections in the US and have none outside of US. So for me, like hundreds of others, its all about luck.

As far a Electrical Engineers concerned, nothing that is happening to IT applies to them. Reason IT had such a demand and crash was that it was a new invention … Internet and all the speculation surrounding this new media. Electrical engineering is very stable because it has been around for over 70 years unlike modern IT which is maybe 15 years old. It is not new, there is no speculation or hype about it. So electrical engineering jobs, solely depend on how the economy is doing. I do believe that once IT has passed through this low point it will emerge as stable career just like electrical enginering.

Take care

PS: Anyone hiring in New Zealand??? :rotfl:

6

oh cool..thanx a lot

yes ppl may hire u here in NZ but not only we have a low dollar here but also relatively low pays as compared to rest of the world
so its up to you
regards

7

Sometimes, it is good to get out and see rest of the world ..... even if it means a little pay cut. And if you are single, more reason to take the plunge. Because you know very well all good things must come to an end one day and all marriages comes with chains and shackles ... enjoy life while you can ..

any NZ inks/websites I should start looking into??

thanks

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Salaams Boston

Very unfortunate to hear that your without an IT job. If I may provide some advice: Have you considered changing field at all? I understand that you might have spent good money and time on the IT training, but the economy is just not there. In my discussions with economists, the economic recovery just may end up being a jobless recovery.

I am assuming by you nick that you are in Boston, if so, you are uniquely positioned to either change occupations or obtain furthewr education. In all honesty, I do believe that IT is a sinking boat, even with a rebound in the economy..outsourcing will always manage to undercut domestic employment. Euro, Asian markets except for a few bright spots are stagnating.

Have you tried the headhunters/reruiting firms? Recently I quit my job to begin a Ph.D program, and these headhunters were aggresively pursuing me. I was in business, not sure if it will be the same for IT, but it doesnt hurt to try.

I hope everything works out for you, inshallah.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Boston: *
Sometimes, it is good to get out and see rest of the world ..... even if it means a little pay cut. And if you are single, more reason to take the plunge. Because you know very well all good things must come to an end one day and all marriages comes with chains and shackles ... enjoy life while you can ..

any NZ inks/websites I should start looking into??

thanks
[/QUOTE]

Boston,
question for you: would you consider a move to Pakistan if you are offered a good IT position + nice salaray? even for short trem, say 2-3yrs!

Iam asking b/c I know a friend of mine - a well respected IT guy, who quit his fortune 100 job earlier this year and a few month back moved to Pakistan-Islamabad and got a decent job upon arrival!

10

ASA RajputFury

I do not think that it is a sinking ship . it maybe very damaged but it will survive ... instead of being an luxury cruise ship it may transform itself into lets say .. a corgo ship.

Anyhow, I love IT and I think that going bac to school and changing careers is not a good option for me. If I did not had 13 years of IT under my belt and I was junior person, I might have considered that. Besides you have to look at the investment vs rewards. I will need to work 4 or 5 years just to recover my investment in school. Even after that there is no guarantee that the my new career will survive the ever changing global market. Besides I got parents and sisters to look after also, going to school will mean no income for quite some time.

I did saw the off shore developemnt trend couple of years ago and I moved myself into the services sector. IT service sector will not be sent off shore for some time. It requires physical presence, but unfortunately I must wait for economy to bounce back and services sector to pick up again.

ASA Humtum77 ...
Thanks for the advice. Yes I would go back for few years. but I wonder can I work in Pakistan and send enough money back home to my family in US???

11

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Nibss: *
oh cool..thanx a lot

yes ppl may hire u here in NZ but not only we have a low dollar here but also relatively low pays as compared to rest of the world
so its up to you
regards
[/QUOTE]

u should thanx first where u are at the tmoment.. look at all the naimats of allah.. one thing.. ull come back to where u started!!!