Pakistan Without Musharaf

Society Pakistan & World Affairs
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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

madhanee, I am not picking up interfering signals on purpose. You are back to your same old one track, military is bad issue, which is not the point here. the point is that with the reality as it is, what with things be like if muharraf was not in power.

true thinsg will be diff if military did not have this much power, and the assorted political families were just banned from politics, and that the politicians were less corrupt and that the mullahs were less idiotic. No argument with that at all, but..with all of the above being as a given, what is a better option for Pakistan at this time.

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

who would you like to see in power? start putting some names here.

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

yaar thats what i'm saying...there's no big change...the day musharraf's gone the people in this government would be lining infront of bilawal house or nawaz sharif's house...musharraf had a chance to put forward some stable functioning system but he didnt do that...you cant call this a stable system which needs a man in uniform to run it...there's a void which has been created by musharraf himself otherwise he will become irrelevant...

a good manager can get more work done from the same ppl that a bad manager can not. In case you have missed all my previous posts, let me state it again. Pakistan does not have a stable system, nor hjas it every had it in its history. It is my expectation and hope that Musharraf will make some progress towards it and start a change process that will reverse this decades old corrupt political system dominated by a few families and personalities and the military. However, external threats become top priority

as far as there being no big change, read the papers, you have to agree that the law and order situation has improved significantly. world bank reports show a better economic performance, business reports indicate a dynamic business enivornment providing increasing opportunities.

Now does it mean there will be an immediate and noticeable change in the economic condition of everyone, not at all..but is the overall trend positive.. you betcha

yaar, 99% people arent getting any rewards...therefore good economy or not...it doesnt make any difference...

where are you getting the 99% of people not getting any rewards.

if you are earning about 20000 Rs per month which according to pakistan's environment is a very good salary, its very difficult to support a family...you can well imagine how most of the population lives, ie. below 10000 per month...

poverty has been an escalating problem in Pakistan, overnight not everyone is going to become some sheikh.

as far as punjab is concerned, things had started to move towards the better during shahbaz sharif's rule...and mind you there was no 'uniform' to protect him...

things had started moving towards the better in Nawaz's rule too. I recall how peaceful karachi was for sometime after he took office versus when BB was in power, but it did not stay that way.

shahbaz sharif was provincial, diff dynamics there compared to a national leadership role. At no point was shahbaz sharif dealing sith the type of challenges that Musharraf has successfully dealt with and is dealing with.

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

It will be a disappointment to US and India along with other Pakistani neighbours if Musharaf was no longer the leader.

Let's be honest - Musharaf has done what has been asked of him by India and the US. He has managed to stop cross border terrorism (not fully but getting there) and handing over the terroriststo US.

Pakistan without Musharaf, at this stage, will fall into chaos. There will be power a struggle.

As yet, a true set-up for smooth transition of power and functioning democracy are not in place. I hope Musharaf uses his time in power well.

Let's hope Pakistan can one day look at its neighbour and say, we too are now like you - a functioning democracy and an infrastructure that allows for economic growth.

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

^

I don't know if I should be happy or extremely troubled that a Pakistan hating Indian is agreeing wth my position.

Maybe we should have a vakhra type da politician instead.

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

did some one put mushy's name for him to be here?

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

wah.. according to u MMA is anti musharaf..lolz…dear they r the B team of musharaf and every1 knows tht…they helped him everytime ..infact “offered their services” so i advice u,dont make statements which have nothing to do with the facts but spreading hatred and increasing distances between religious and “moderate” muslims…
u said economy is getting “better” ..lolz..i can defined the conditions very well RICH R BECOMING MORE RICH AND POOR R DOING SUICIDES…
every day u will hear tht 2 or 3 youngster did suicide beac of lack of job opportunities,
sorry dude i talk abt only facts and figures…for me “any impractical hope” and assumption r sin..

remember,i m not an anti musharaf

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

That is the exact issue, most seem to think he is not using that time wisely.. he is falling into the same pit as his predecessors.

I say Pakistan should go a step further and instead of looking at 3rd world countries for role-models and economical infrastructure it should find those role-models in developed nations who have proved that their models work.

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

Guy1 nay farmaya

wah.. according to u MMA is anti musharaf..lolz...dear they r the B team of musharaf and every1 knows tht....they helped him everytime ..infact "offered their services" so i advice u,dont make statements which have nothing to do with the facts but spreading hatred and increasing distances between religious and "moderate" muslims...

Wah...how did you assume that by fundos I meant MMA, by fundos I meant extremists...now if you have some knowledge that MMA is in bed with al-qaeda and thus among teh fundos I will be interested in seeing that, barring that MMA can not be considered fundos..idiots perhaps, but not fundos.

My advise to you is to figure out what is being said before giving advice :) I have no intention of spreading the distance between "religious" and "moderate" muslims. .. as if all moderate muslims are not religious, and all fundos are realy religious :)

u said economy is getting "better" ..lolz..i can defined the conditions very well RICH R BECOMING MORE RICH AND POOR R DOING SUICIDES...
every day u will hear tht 2 or 3 youngster did suicide beac of lack of job opportunities,,
sorry dude i talk abt only facts and figures...for me "any impractical hope" and assumption r sin..

I would recommend that you read pakistans assessment by world bank, and other international economic experts rather than basing it on "facts" that "every day u will hear tht 2 or 3 youngsters did suicide beac of lack of job.

remember,i m not an anti musharaf

Oh thank you for mentioning that.

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

The most overused tactic of pakistani leaders to garner support and cover up their own shortcomings/incompetence is TINA (There Is No Alternative) to me lol

The whole worry of the MMA is a bit of a joke especially the way Mushys friends want them to be in power and want them to be the opposition while at the same time scaring people away from them...as far as the PPP and PML-N are concerned, minus their leaders I give Mushy credit he single handedly got rid of almost all their corrupt first line and second line leadership..they are all sitting on the same table with him :p ...

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

why do our alternatives only the same bozos, palejo, khar, bhutto, watto, mengal, type of folks?

the words of vidal gore apply so well to pakistan's version of democacy, when he said he left politics when he realized that both political parties were really the same party..

i.e. no matter who is in power u see the same fat cats milking the nation whether they are in opposition or in power..they need each othere to stay in power otherwise people may start asking the type of questions that the politicians dont want to hear.

Is musharraf the long term solution for Pakistan, no, is he a good short-mid term solution yes. and currently we are better off with him there than not.

Now regardless of whether or not the right system is in place..which is not, and should be.
the question of Pakistan w/o musharraf is with teh given set of circumstances, and with the given set of circumstances, which include the absence of a proper sustainable system, we are better off with him than without him.

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

lolz u r making me laugh…from where MMA became “Extremist”…beac they r against ur hero musharaf so they r extremist…where ur “freedom of speech” goes now…??:wink:
i was not talking abt al qaeda..i was talking abt the support tht MMA has been providing continously to musharaf…and no body can deny it…thts y MMA is known as B TEAM OF MUSHARAF…
and past is the full prove…MMA always provided way for musharaf…for ur information dear,musharaf and qazi hussian have met many times secretly…now dont ask for links…
by the way abt al qaeda,it might be an individual act…i m not sure abt it

and in the end u r talking abt world bank report blah blah…i give damn to these reports as we people cannot see any change…commodities r expensive…youngster dont have jobs…poverty si increasing…tell me this is the defintion of ecocnomy for u…good…

people of pakistan give damn to 12 billion dollars exchange and they also give damn who is in power whether musharaf or aziz or qzi hussian,they want the solutions of their problems…

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

That’s why I am saying they should look at India and learn how India has managed to become a regional economic power and soon to become a world economic power along with China.

Not to mention India being talked about a permanent member of UNSC with veto power.

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

fact is fraudz donkeys can and are ruling pak and not a squat any one can do about it.you think mushy is better from the lot ,the only good that perspective does to you is that you are less prone to frustration than pakistanis who dont agree with you.
i think takla shareef was better than mushy, not that i am saying invite him back.but if he were to come back i would vote for him any day any time, mushy on the other hand doesnt need your or mine or any one else's vote.doing as he please so he can say wat ever he like.he is indespensible, saving us from evil mullahs, extremist and the lot, do i believe in the sh!t coming from his half arsed brain? no, i think he is just another incompetent lazy sob of having his fun at the expense of paksitanis.and unless people wont do anything about it idiots like him will come and go so cheers!

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

Do you not find it odd that in a country of 140 million people, no other option is there besides Mush (who I love cuz he and I had a scotch twice). Maybe Pakistan should think about outsourcing the governance. Core competency and all.... :)

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

^There are always alternatives Mats (wb btw) ....but Pakistani rulers are obsessed with personalising their rule..and promote this myth of there not being any alternative.

I have yet to figure out what single decision Musharraf has made as far as foreign policy is concerned that any main stream politico would not have done?

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Re: Pakistan Without Musharaf

*lolz u r making me laugh...from where MMA became "Extremist"....beac they r against ur hero musharaf so they r extremist...where ur "freedom of speech" goes now....??;) *

I am making you laugh? challo theek hai.

You accused me of calling MMA fundamentalists, how did they become "fundos"
My point while my point that fundos who are after Musharraf and I dont consider MMA fundos.

i was not talking abt al qaeda..i was talking abt the support tht MMA has been providing continously to musharaf....and no body can deny it....thts y MMA is known as B TEAM OF MUSHARAF...

why is MMA part of this dicussion, YOU incorrectly assumed that when i spoke of fundos being after Musharraf, I meant MMA, while I meant alkayda and its cronies.

*and past is the full prove...MMA always provided way for musharaf....for ur information dear,musharaf and qazi hussian have met many times secretly...now dont ask for links... *

yet again, why bring MMA in a discussion at all :) You dragged them into the discussion because you incorrectly thought that when i said fundos were after mushraf that it was referring to MMA.

]by the way abt al qaeda,it might be an individual act...i m not sure abt it**

right... it "might" be an individual act, and it most likely is not.

and in the end u r talking abt world bank report blah blah...i give damn to these reports as we people cannot see any change....commodities r expensive...youngster dont have jobs.....poverty si increasing...tell me this is the defintion of ecocnomy for u...good...

You dont give a damn to world bank reports, and I dont give a damn about your personal assessment, I think WB knows a little bit more than you do :)

people of pakistan give damn to 12 billion dollars exchange and they also give damn who is in power whether musharaf or aziz or qzi hussian,they want the solutions of their problems...

sure, they want solution of their problems, and the biggest problem facing them was not getting their butts kicked for being chums with the idiot talebans. so let the guy work on solving the most important problem first.