I would like to thank UTD for restoring my faith in Pakistan
Thank you my freind 
PS Not many would argue that Afghanistan is a better place to live today than it was under the Taliban.
Dude, you should know better. The State Department will defend Genghis Khan if he was declared as an ally of the US.
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*Originally posted by Akif: *
There is a reason why all your references are from opinionated websites, and not hardcore news media.
Anyway, presence of remnants of taliban in Pakistan is not what Im denying here. For that matter, they are present in just about any country of the world, the way this group is formed, and the way it works. HOwever, to suggest something like "Pakistan is harboring taliban and organizing cross border attacks against neighbors is a plain old stupid story that the world has fallen for one too many times, and I couldnt care less.
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Listen, when Pakistan army trucks pick up Taliban fighters after they get their butts beaten by coalition troops in Afghanistan, you can call it support in some levels of Pak officialdom.
When Taliban leaders openly live in Quetta, give interviews and recruit followers while your govt says they cannot find them - you can call it official support.
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Colin Powell....the same man who sat in the Security Council and so shamefully lied in the whole worlds face about Iraq and its WMDs. Hes one to be trusted?
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By that logic, anything from Musharraf's mouth cannot be trusted. He is still saying Pakistan never supported the Taliban and that Pak army never took part in Kargil. The list of official and busted Pakistani lies is bigger than the phone book ;)
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Like I said, the ineptness of the US and afghan forces in Afghanistan, and the ineptness of india in held kashmir speaks whenever they blame Pakistan for 'cross border' crap...not much else. After all that Pakistan is doing on its border with Afghanistan, if they still have doubts, they can shove it.
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You are not in a position to say shove it to America. You have received a free pass for the A.Q.Khan drama and lot of other things. Your economy is dependent on American aid. If you keep up with this attitude with Americans, they will soon have to enter your land to clean up the sanctuaries, like they did a few months ago in Angoor Adda which forced you hand in Waziristan.
Re: Pakistan; with friends like these who needs enemies?
2 years later and it’s just more of the same…
ISLAMABAD, Pakistan - A peace deal between Pakistan’s government and Islamic militants in the northwestern tribal region of North Waziristan has created a virtual Taliban mini-state where mullahs dispense justice and fighters are launching cross-border attacks into neighboring Afghanistan a think tank reported Monday.
The U.S. military confirmed that attacks have risen sharply since the deal was reached earlier this year despite concerns it would give a freer hand to Taliban and al-Qaida-linked militants who fled to Pakistan after the fall of the hard-line regime in Afghanistan in 2001.
“Over the past five years, the (President Gen. Pervez) Musharraf government has tried first brute force, then appeasement. Both have failed,” said Samina Ahmed of the International Crisis Group that published the report. “Islamabad’s tactics have only emboldened the pro-Taliban militants.”
That grim assessment came against the backdrop of an alarming surge in violence in southern and eastern Afghanistan this year that has killed close to 4,000 people, threatening the Western-backed project to rebuild the country and establish democracy.
Government policy has allowed militants “to establish a virtual mini-Taliban-style state,” the Crisis Group said, citing reports of pro-Taliban militants attacking music, video and CD stores, closing barber shops, imposing taxes and establishing courts to impose summary justice.
The Pakistani government rejected the Brussels-based group’s report as “baseless allegations” and described the violence across the border as Afghanistan’s internal problem.
A senior tribal elder confirmed the Taliban had gained sway in North Waziristan. Tribesmen were bypassing the government and traditional tribal leaders and approaching their pro-Taliban leaders in the towns of Miran Shah and Mir Ali to settle land and money disputes. Religious students were even helping to direct traffic, he told The Associated Press.
The elder requested anonymity because he had been threatened by militants for meeting government leaders.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061211/ap_on_re_as/pakistan_taliban_rise
Re: Pakistan; with friends like these who needs enemies?
UTD, I am a very liberal guy and I do value Pakistan's friendship with the US, (like I do with other countries, and am hopeful of peaceful relations with India too) but I do not think we should be destabilize our own country because of weak intelligence on the part of the US. Your country has (intentionally, or unintentionally) proven to be a very lousy ally in the past, and the relationship has been very selfish. This whole mess was created by the US in the first place, for abandoning this region in the late 80sd.
If you want to learn from your mistakes, maybe you should see how China has treated us over the course of years, despite the fact that we werent even 1/10th as thankful to them as we were to USA for anything they did for us. This peace deal with our own people in our north is a step in the right direction, we want ultimate peace in our country, and quite frankly, we dont care if you feel bitter because of this. If you call us an ally, have some faith in us and let us do something you cant manage (your failures in Iraq and Afghanistan, and strikes at civilians in Pakistan are enough to prove all that).
Re: Pakistan; with friends like these who needs enemies?
I think it may still be to early to see the long term outcome of this policy. Fact of the matter is that an all out war with the militants has caused more problems then solutions... So unless the think tank can come up with a better solution, we should wait and see...
Re: Pakistan; with friends like these who needs enemies?
WoW, Undie, suddenly now amreeka remembers friendship...LOL.... Don't even go there undie, per amreeka there is no friendship but INTERESTS...
Re: Pakistan; with friends like these who needs enemies?
- takes out his binoculars and zooms into the Taliban-concentrated areas.... hey those terrorist got nukes, someone look there, they got nukes !!!*
Re: Pakistan; with friends like these who needs enemies?
Couldn’t agree with you more Spock :k:
Re: Pakistan; with friends like these who needs enemies?
Excellent post. :k:
President-General Musharraf has not made the same foolish mistakes of past rulers of putting all our eggs in one basket, and so he has quite adeptly put in a few insurance policies. After the fall of Kabul, the US adminsitration promised that they would not allow an anti-Pak govt to come to power in return for our support, but it did in the shape of the Northern Alliance warlords. So we have every right to correct that situation, and the N.Waziristan deal is the first step
in that direction. Anyway, whatever the anti-Republican NYTimes says the Bush administration has gone along with it, and the Brits have even started talking about replicating this type of agreement in the Kandahar area where they are based.
Re: Pakistan; with friends like these who needs enemies?
So we are celebrating independence from USA by making a deal with NWFP locals because they won't by nation rules.