Pakistan today is the most dangerous place on Earth

God help Pakistan’s fight against extremism. These people have ruined the name of Islam. It is downright embarrassing to tell people you are Muslim. I am proud of Islam but ashamed of Muslims. And why the #$# do all these crazies have “Muhammad” in their name–like Mohd. Atta and this sniper fellow in Washington? Where in his life do they see an example of hate and violence? I blame the mullahs for fomenting this hate and not teaching people peace, patience and tolerance. Ordinary Pakistanis/Muslims must resist these extremists at all costs.

Nuclear Enabler

By Jim Hoagland
Thursday, October 24, 2002; Page A35
The Washington Post

The discovery that North Korea has been secretly enriching uranium for the nuclear weapons program it promised to freeze in 1994 demonstrates the dangers of putting faith in a confirmed and practiced liar. So does the news that Pakistan provided the nuclear technology and perhaps uranium to Kim Jong Il’s regime.

Pakistan’s role as a clandestine supplier shatters the Bush administration’s efforts to paint that country as a flawed but well-meaning member of the coalition against terror. Pakistan today is the most dangerous place on Earth, in large part because the administration does not understand the forces it is dealing with there and has no policy to contain them.

Pervez Musharraf’s Pakistan is a base from which nuclear technology, fundamentalist terrorism and life-destroying heroin are spread around the globe. American and French citizens and Christians of any nationality, including Pakistani, are indiscriminately slaughtered by fanatics as occasion arises. This nuclear-armed country is in part ungoverned, in part ungovernable.

The Bush administration’s response is to protect both the life and reputation of President-for-life Musharraf and pretend that he is moving toward democracy. Huge amounts of American aid pour into Pakistan – even as Washington’s ability to monitor how that money is spent or stolen declines sharply.

This response pushes toward a disaster that Bush officials – and a Congress that has been negligent to cowardly in exercising oversight on Pakistan – will one day protest that they could not have seen coming. The truth will be that they ignored warnings that were in plain sight, as the first Bush administration did on Iraq’s Saddam Hussein.

The second Bush administration sees the dangers that “axis of evil” members Iraq and North Korea pose. It is fashioning considered, realistic responses to those dangers. But it seems paralyzed by the perceived need to secure Musharraf’s help in fighting al Qaeda and stabilizing Afghanistan. Official Washington will not even tell the truth to or about Musharraf, much less hold him accountable for his lies and subterfuge.

U.S. policy today amounts to giving money to Pakistan, which agrees to take it. This is a country where American diplomats are limited to one-year tours and not allowed to bring dependents. Nongovernmental organizations that normally would help the U.S. Agency for International Development gauge how aid money is being spent have closed down out of fear. The remaining AID personnel would take their lives in their hands by insisting on effective monitoring.

Elections rigged by Musharraf in his favor this month were praised extravagantly by State Department spokesman Richard Boucher as “an important milestone in the ongoing transition to democracy.” That praise cannot be applied to the process or to the outcome, which gave new prominence to a fundamentalist Islamic coalition that promptly said it would seek to ban coeducation.

Rewards rule in all areas: The sanctions on U.S.-Pakistani military-to-military cooperation imposed in 1998 after Pakistan’s nuclear tests were personally lifted last week by Central Command’s Gen. Tommy Franks, who attended a joint exercise involving a grand total of 330 troops.

This came on Oct. 17, as David Sanger of the New York Times led the way in identifying Pakistan as the source of North Korea’s uranium-enrichment process. A secret barter arrangement was suspected during the Clinton administration. It continued after Musharraf came to power in 1999 and was finally confirmed last summer, U.S. officials report.

Pyongyang sent missiles and missile technology to Islamabad in return for nuclear technology. There are strong indications that both nations have helped Iran develop nuclear and missile programs as well.

Asked about Pakistan’s supplier role, Secretary of State Colin Powell said on television last Sunday that Musharraf had promised him that Pakistan was not engaged in this trade now. Powell then refused to talk about Pakistan’s past role and would not even explain his silence on it.

Talking about the past would have exposed Musharraf’s pattern of lies and evasions, which Powell has increasingly tolerated and covered for as they have become more flagrant. The secretary knows Musharraf lied publicly when giving pledges last spring to end cross-border terrorism – pledges he has broken. Musharraf even lied about whether President Bush had talked to him about that subject in a September meeting in New York.

The past provides no reason to hope that Musharraf is telling the truth about not helping North Korea now, either. He has paid no price for lying to Powell about ending terrorism in Kashmir or about cooperating fully in crushing al Qaeda. The only consequences for duplicity have been rewards and protection. Why in the world would he suddenly change an approach that is working on every level for him?

© 2002 The Washington Post Companyhttp://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A8422-2002Oct24.html

Also in the following
Thursday, October 24, 2002
Bush can no longer defend Pakistan
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/92542_hoagland24.shtml

Did you hear what State Department said about Pakistan?

9-11 CHANGE EVERYTHING!

This report is utter BS. Pakistan is not the most dangerous place in the world, I know of at least two westerners who continue to work there and love the place. Americans aren't stupid, if it was in their interests to consider Pakistan as an enemy rather than an ally they would do so.

Under the circumstances they have received unflinching support from Musharraf and no doubt that's why they are giving it back in return.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Mr Xtreme: *
This report is utter BS. Pakistan is not the most dangerous place in the world, I know of at least two westerners who continue to work there and love the place. Americans aren't stupid, if it was in their interests to consider Pakistan as an enemy rather than an ally they would do so.

Under the circumstances they have received unflinching support from Musharraf and no doubt that's why they are giving it back in return.
[/QUOTE]

Ditto

For more info, ask Chinse as well French, who are willing to support Pakistan despite they lost their men.

Regardless of how we feel, Hoagland represents a voice and thinking of a significant number of "establishment" americans. When he writes what he writes, and Powell refuses to answer on record it indicates that there is a problem. Hopefully Pakistan's new Govt. will address whatever the issues are.

So if the nukes were to fall into the mullah's hands, how soon do you reckon before the US special ops, take'em out.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Chaltahai: *
So if the nukes were to fall into the mullah's hands, how soon do you reckon before the US special ops, take'em out.
[/QUOTE]

Don'T talk about SPECIAL US troops, every war that has been fought was fought in alliances! Us is a bigmouth!

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Chaltahai: *
So if the nukes were to fall into the mullah's hands, how soon do you reckon before the US special ops, take'em out.
[/QUOTE]

It's a good point. Fact is, if Musharraf wasn't fully behind US the Americans wouldn't tolerate such a situation. Like I said, they aren't dumb.

Is this sniper guy a muslims, as suggested in the 1st post.

Pakistan is not the most dangerous place on Earth, you can board a bus and usually make your journey, 999 out of 1000-what are the odds in Israel?

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Mr Xtreme: *

It's a good point. Fact is, if Musharraf wasn't fully behind US the Americans wouldn't tolerate such a situation. Like I said, they aren't dumb.
[/QUOTE]

but they are some times gullible. Listen to Collin Powell..well..yeah he did in the past but now he has promised(again for the 5th time) and I don't want to talk about it any further. Yeah right.

united states of america must get rid of not only nukes but also the fundementals there in pakistan. i dont care wether Musha stays or goes because infront of molvis he is toothless and so when molvis are gone he will be puppy dog. but best idea is to move him to arabia or some place there and bring real democracy but after chasing the molvis extremist fundementals out of pakistan to may be gantanamo bay which is a place in cuba where there is lot of demand for molvi services!

because unless until we get rid of nukes, molvis and musha i agree pakistan is very very dangerous place like the author is saying. eviryother day if you read papers on websie from usa you will not esomebody from pakistan is aressted for carrying this or carrying that or something! i also understand from same and similar sources that al qaeda regruping right there in pakistan even before so called election there. now add the mix of extremist molvis and it becomes more dangerous! i think it should become and try to become less dangerous before we can allow aid etc anymore!

good one mo_best. It seems as thought the militant hindus, like Dhir ,of our forum are having a ball at that. What are the odds of survival of a person crossing a busy intersection in Bombay..probably not much. ..

Elections rigged by Musharraf in his favor this month were praised extravagantly by State Department spokesman Richard Boucher as "an important milestone in the ongoing transition to democracy."

This sentence alone tells you this writer has no idea what they're talking about. Everyone knows elections were not rigged, otherwise how the hell did the mullahs gain so much?

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Ali_R: *
Don'T talk about SPECIAL US troops, every war that has been fought was fought in alliances! Us is a bigmouth!
[/QUOTE]

What makes you think that there wont be an alliance in that case ? :)

Yeah, and cos more people die in bombay in accidents, we should ignore the nuclear threat and terror network spread out around the world. Read a similar line of thinking in The Dawn. Wonder whether it has something to do with Pakistani mindset.
http://www.dawn.com/2002/10/17/op.htm#4
Media phenomenon
…Terrorism is a much more bearable phenomenon. …
The average American’s likelihood of being killed by a terrorist would still be comparable, at worst, to their chances of winning a lottery. …
the horror in Bali was statistically and strategically insignificant. Good police and intelligence work will reduce the number of such incidents, but it will never eliminate them. They are part of the cost of living in a complicated and interconnected world.

So the conclusion is Mumbai is more dangerous than Pakistan. Shame on washington post.

[QUOTE]
Originally posted by PyariCgudia: *
**Elections rigged by Musharraf in his favor this month were praised extravagantly by State Department spokesman Richard Boucher as "an important milestone in the ongoing transition to democracy."
*

This sentence alone tells you this writer has no idea what they're talking about. Everyone knows elections were not rigged, otherwise how the hell did the mullahs gain so much?
[/QUOTE]

what you mean? fully rigged both refrendum furst and so called allegdly election. but when he rigged second one he was badly mistaken because he wants to get rid of bhutto and co and in same idea did not know how to do molvis and mullahs also because how you rig for military only in election? you have rig for some party and he said aha, now i can rig for bhtto or i can rig for extremism molvi party? which is better devil, he chose rig for molvi. thats all.

thats what happens to all bad people at end. they try and do this and do that but finally at end of all that they rig for wrong persen because all persens become wrong persens for them.