Origins of Christmas

i sincerely apologize in advance if any of this seems stupid, or completely childish. Just some questions i have been wondering about regarding Christmas. i would appreciate it if Christian Guppies would respond (or anyone who possesses accurate, unbiased information regarding the following).

i would also sincerely appreciate it if for those wanting to make negative or hurtful comments, please consider it carefully before you do so because to each individual, her/his religious beliefs are as cherished and significant as ours are to ourselves; i am afraid i don’t possess any patience for that type of discussion. :flower1: My sincerest thanks in advance.

On radio yesterday evening one of the DJs was mentioning that it is normally perceived that Christmas falls around the time of the birth of Prophet Jesus (peace and Blessings be upon him). On the show he stated that this is inaccurate from a Christian perspective. i have heard and he mentioned this as well that the origins of Christmas lie with an Italian(?) monk who felt pained by the poverty in his parish, and took to distributing gifts to poor children. If i remember correctly, this was St. Nick. Is this why Santa Claus is referred to sometimes as St. Nicholas? And IF in Christianity it is not believed that Prophet Jesus (peace and Blessings be upon him) was born around December, does it provide some alternative date for his birth?

Another stupid question i have been wondering about for years - how did the word ‘Christmas’ itself originate? i am not at all certain whether this is valid, but if you break the word down you (obviously) get “Christ” and “mas[s]” (okay so not precisely the word ‘mass’ itself, but an abbreviated version of it) - during Christmas, i would assume one would have to go for mass at church, perhaps on Christmas eve or Christmas day? Is this theory related in any way to Christmas? (i sincerely apologize if it’s not, not trying to offend anyone AT ALL).

Some of my Christian friends go for church services on Christmas eve, while others go on Christmas day itself; does it make a difference on which day one goes or is it just about personal suitability?

One last query - what is the ‘Twelve days of Christmas’? i remember reading that poem in nursery books when i was much younger; sorry if this is a stupid question, but is that based upon some historical actuality? Who developed it?

Nadia,
I will attempt the Twelve Days exlpanation. I did a report way back in high school and found it very interesting. I had just thought it was a silly song that didn't make much since.

The Twelve days are from Christmas until the beginning of Epiphany (January 6th; the 12 days count from December 25th until January 5th).

The song is a Christian instruction tool dating back to the 1500's religious wars in England, with hidden references to the basic teachings of the Cahtolic faith. The "true love" mentioned in the song refers to God.

A Partridge in a Pear Tree = Jesus the Christ, the Son of God, whose birthday is celebrated on December 25, the first day of Christmas.
2 Turtle Doves = The Old and New Testaments
3 French Hens = Faith, Hope and Charity, the Theological Virtues
4 Calling Birds = the Four Gospels and/or the Four Evangelists
5 Golden Rings = The first Five Books of the Old Testament, the "Pentateuch", which gives the history of man's fall from grace.
6 Geese A-laying = the six days of creation
7 Swans A-swimming = the seven gifts of the Holy Spirit, the seven sacraments
8 Maids A-milking = the eight beatitudes
9 Ladies Dancing = the nine Fruits of the Holy Spirit
10 Lords A-leaping = the ten commandments
11 Pipers Piping = the eleven faithful apostles
12 Drummers Drumming = the twelve points of doctrine in the Apostle's Creed

wow, awesome, Seminole. i used to read this poem in my nursery books, never had any idea that it had so much meaning behind it. :o Thank you so much.

OK, sorry, what’s the Epiphany? According to this website, "The feast was called among the Syrians denho (up-going), a name to be connected with the notion of rising light expressed in Luke. I, 78.

The song makes much more sense now. Appreciate it, thanks a lot for your explanation.

Re: Origins of Christmas

Nadia_H, I past an essay that I think clarify a lot of your questions. For myself: I don’t celebrate Christmas because of it’s possible pagan origen - not wanting to give it any status as such, and also because of the commercialism attached to the day. I don’t condemn those that do celebrate it in any way either.

BTW: VERY sorry for the long quote, I did shorten it some though. :flower2:

Origin of Christmas Customs

By Pastor William Mark Bristow

Origin of St. Nicholas

Every year Christians ask me, “Should I celebrate with all the traditional customs of Christmas? They all seem so materialistic. Aren’t some of these customs really pagan?” So every year, I endeavor to bring out a few facts from our Christian heritage. Let’s start with the real shocker – There really was a Santa Claus (however, he is not the one that people know today). The real Santa Claus was a PREACHER!! Yes Sir! His name was St. Nicholas and he lived and worked as the Bishop of a little town of Myra, (now in the country of Turkey). Tradition says he was born in Patara, a seaport, and traveled to Egypt and Palestine as a young man. Eventually he became bishop of the church at Myra. During the period of persecution of Christians by Emperor Diocletian, he was imprisoned, but he was released by Diocletian’s successor, Constantine the Great.

By the 6th century his burial shrine was well known at Myra. In 1087 his remains were moved to Bari, Italy, which became a crowded pilgrimage center in his honor. Devotion to him spread throughout the Christian world, and he was chosen patron saint of Russia and Greece. Thousands of churches throughout Europe have been named for him. His feast day was set on December 6. He was credited with many miracles. In one story he saved three officers from death by appearing to Constantine in a dream. In another legend he provided bags of gold to a poor man as dowries for his three daughters.¹ When he died on December 6 in the year 345, he was revered for his generosity and kindness. It became the custom to give gifts to loved ones on his saint’s day, the date of his death. Later Christians adopted St. Nicholas for Christmas day, which commemorates the date God gave the greatest gift of all, Christ Jesus for the redemption of the world.

Origin of the Modern Day Santa Claus

Santa Claus is probably a Dutch mispronunciation of Sinter Klaus (Saint Nicholas). Kriss Kringle is probably an English mispronunciation of the German, “Christkindlein” (little Christ child). In 1822 Santa received a drastic makeover through the poem penned by a pastor. Rev. Clement C. Moore felt his church’s poor offerings were going to make a very dismal Christmas for his children. The weather was bleak and everyone needed some cheering. Rev. Moore held down a secular job to help meet expenses. He had been thinking of Saint Nicholas, from all accounts a very serious and austere man in appearance. A story began to form in Rev. Moore’s mind, his children would love a good story. What about a visit from Saint Nicholas? He looked over at the portly German fellow who drove the sleigh on their way home from work. A new vision of St. Nick began to take shape – the horse drawn sleigh … NO! … flying reindeer. Well, you know the poem by its first line, ‘Twas the night before Christmas… The poem was intended for his children’s ears, only, but after great insistence it was read to his congregation. A parishioner published the poem a few years later in a Troy, New York newspaper. In the 1950’s Coca Cola needed a spokesman for their soda at Christmas time. Someone drew an artist’s rendering of Rev. Moore’s St. Nick and Coca Cola made the jolly ol’ elf famous as we have him today.

How We Came to Celebrate on December 25th

Another question is always asked, “Why December 25th? We know Jesus was probably born sometime between April and November. - after all the scripture says that shepherds were watching their flocks in the fields?” Recently, I was seated at a table with hosts of a major television program. The question of the date of Christ’s birth arose and I was told in no uncertain terms that Jesus was born on the 15th of Tishri (Sept/Oct) which is the feast of Tabernacles, or Hebrew “cukkah”, (pronounced ‘sook-kaw’). Although this is a real possibility – I must tell you after hours of searching Matthew Henry, Halley’s Bible Dictionary, Compton’s Encyclopedia, The American Book of Days, the 12 Volume Interpreter’s Bible, Holman’s Bible Dictionary, Revell Bible Dictionary and volumes on Christian Sites on the World Wide Web, all definitely state, “we do not know when Jesus was born, or even what year.” (Although he had to be born sometime between 4 and 8 BC due to Herod’s reign and death which is known from archaeological records.) While it is accepted that Jesus was born in the small town of Bethlehem a few miles south of Jerusalem, there is no certain information on the date of his birth, not even of the year (see Jesus Christ). One reason for this uncertainty is that the stories of his birth, recorded in the New Testament books of Matthew and Luke, were written several decades after the event. And for several centuries the Christian church itself paid little attention to the celebration of Jesus’ birth. The major Christian festival was Easter, the day of his resurrection. Only gradually, as the church developed a calendar to commemorate the major events of the life of Christ, did it celebrate his birth.¹

Till about the year 250-300 there was little celebration of Christ’s birth, other than a solemn memory. His death and resurrection were all important to new Christianity. As the church spread around the world, it encountered the Roman/European festival of the Winter Solstice. This was a day of great festivity in the pagan world. Because there was no knowledge about the date of Jesus’ birth, a day had to be selected. The Eastern Orthodox and the Eastern Rite churches within the Roman Catholic church chose January 6. The day was named Epiphany, meaning “appearance,” the day of Christ’s manifestation. The Western church, based at Rome, chose December 25. It is known from a notice in an ancient Roman almanac that Christmas was celebrated on December 25 in Rome as early as AD 336.1 In about 547 A.D. St. Augustine was sent by Pope Gregory the Great as the first official missionary to England. He followed an edict from the Pope, “If the religious customs of the people are not evil in origin, they should be blended into Christianity.” (This is scriptural read Acts 15:19-20). The early church had a real problem with this all important festival of the SUN God. The church in the Holy Land had begun to observe January 6th at the birth of our Lord. The Austrian church observed May 20th. Still other parts of the church observed March 25th.

In 625 A.D. central leaders of the church decided since people were going to celebrate the re-birth of the SUN on December 25th – the church would really celebrate – the most important birth, the birth of the SON of God. It took a little time but Christianity prevailed. Although two customs, the Yule long, and kissing under the mistletoe still remain from the pagan days, most every other custom we have today comes from Christ’s birthday.

Celebrating and Gift Giving

The word “CHRISTMAS” comes from the Old English term Cristes maesse, meaning “Christ’s mass.” This was the name for the festival service of worship held on December 25 to commemorate the birth of Jesus Christ. Gift giving is one of the oldest customs associated with Christmas: it is actually older than the holiday itself. When the date of Christmas was set to fall in December, it was done at least in part to compete with ancient pagan festivals that occurred about the same time. The Romans, for example, celebrated the Saturnalia on December 17. It was a winter feast of merrymaking and gift exchanging. And two weeks later, on the Roman New Year January 1, houses were decorated with greenery and lights, and gifts were given to children and the poor. As the Germanic tribes of Europe accepted Christianity and began to celebrate Christmas, they also gave gifts.¹

http://www.bible.com/answers/achristm.html#Origin%20of%20Christmas%20Customs

Length did not matter, usually i do not read long cut 'n pastes, but i knew if you had included it in your post, then you truly believed it was worth reading. Very interesting. i read all of it, many many thanks for your offering help :flower1: i appreciate it.

First things first, i apologize for stating in my original post that he was an Italian monk. i think i also had him confused as the one who distributed gifts to children in his community. i apologize to anyone who was offended by that.

Old Man, you mentioned that you do not celebrate Christmas; this is a bit personal, sorry, ONLY if you do not mind my asking, do members of your family (extended or immediate) celebrate it and, if so, do they ‘wonder’ at your reasons for not celebrating it? They probably just accept it as your personal preference? The reason i am asking this is because, to myself, in Canada it seems as though it is a very significant holiday for Christians (or that’s the impression i receive), and i guess i am wondering how other Christians in general feel about those who choose not to celebrate it for the reasons that you mentioned. The end of the article you posted is very interesting for diverse reasons. Unfortunately i never gave much time to consider that, for some Christians, the emphasis upon Santa Claus took away from what the real meaning of Christmas was to them… that was a very very interesting conclusion, informative for someone like me who doesn’t possess much knowledge regarding this issue.

Many many thanks for your help, i do appreciate it. :flower1:

Nadia_H, no-one can be offended if you make a wrong assumption/conclusion about another person’s religion by asking questions. There is anyway many differences between Christian sects and this issue at hand is actually a non-issue for most.

Some of my relatives will visit church, others won’t. My standpoint in general is accepted by all relatives/friends and most actually agree with it. Christmas is basically “tolerated” by Christians for the children’s sake - they look forward to getting gifts. My folks usually hang a big sock for each one in the house and everyone got a chance to put something in the socks. The next day when it is opened, it is a sort of gaint “lucky-packet” with an assortment of sweets/books/whatever while no-one knows who gave what. No big gifts were given.

When discussing issues of faith with Christians, it is good to realise that there is but few “true” Christians that has made a commitment of their lives to the God they serve. These are called “born-again” Christians and, although you will also find the odd bad apple amongst them, in general they will agree upon the same principles/issues. All “born-again” Christians will agree with my standpoint about Christmas. Christians actually has no “Holy” days. Some sects though might consider some days as “Holy”. The Apostle Paul taught that no day should be considered of more importance than another. Jesus Christ taught that one should live each day on it’s own merit and as if it is the last.

You’re welcome. I will never take any question about Christianity in a negative sense. It is us mortals that get angry when our religion is “attacked” and it actually prove that we are insecure when we can’t take criticism (criticism of your religion is criticism against you personnaly). Why should I defend God Almighty? He is much more capable to defend His Honour Himself! Anyway, I might even be wrong… :slight_smile:

Thanks Old Man for providing all that information. It cleared a lot of things in my mind about christmas as well.

>>I will never take any question about Christianity in a negative sense. **It is us mortals that get angry when our religion is "attacked" and it actually prove that we are insecure when we can't take criticism (criticism of your religion is criticism against you personnaly). Why should I defend God Almighty? He is much more capable to defend His Honour Himself!* Anyway, I might even be wrong.... :) <<*

Wise words.
i think i learned quite a bit from this thread. It was strange, just last night on the radio someone was stating that we have to start getting back to the real meaning of Christmas. For nonMuslims like me who unfortunately don't possess much knowledge regarding Christianity, holidays such as Christmas can be a useful opportunity to take more of an active interest in the issues lying behind these customs and traditions (not that i shouldn't be curious and interested about them the rest of the year as well).
Many many thanks for your patience in answering the queries. Deeply appreciated.