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*Originally posted by Aryan_Shponkai: * Don't be so proud of these cheap bombs that GOD gave youse now. If God can give you it, he can take away as well.
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Well said. And God hates those who are proud.
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*Originally posted by PakistaniDragon: *
Well said. And God hates those who are proud.
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As you say. But he loves honorable people. :)
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Originally posted by Grand Vizier: * Yes, Iran threatened to invade Afghanistan in response to reports of mass murders of Shia *Muslims by the Taliban in Herat province. The Iranian Ayatollahs believed that they too had Allah SWT on their side,
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Muslims pitching against Muslims.
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*Originally posted by Grand Vizier: * that their motivation was nothing other than protecting Muslims.
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The Iranians wanted to take adantage of the lawless nation and set-up a puppet government.
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*Originally posted by Grand Vizier: * But ultimately, they did nothing, because the Taliban was not a threat to Iran itself, and they lacked the resources for a prolongued military occupation of Afghanistan.
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No, they eventually lacked the faith.
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*Originally posted by Grand Vizier: * This is different.
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There is no different. This is another war where innocent people are getting killed.
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*Originally posted by Grand Vizier: *The tribal rebellion, as recent attacks in Pakistani cities have shown, represents a clear and present danger to Pakistan as it is providing cover for terrorist elements who attack Pakistanis.
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This is what the Indians have been saying about the Kashmiris since 30th July 1988.
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*Originally posted by Grand Vizier: * There is no choice over whether or not Pakistan has to crush the tribal rebels.
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The choice is to choose between war and peace. But the military has obviously chosen war.
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*Originally posted by Grand Vizier: * They are a menace to our people, our nation, and must be surpressed for the sake of us all.
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Figure it out why they didn't bother bombing any cities in the past for the last 57 years, but they did so when the Army needed them to (this happened as soon as the $3 billion aid was proven).
Yesterdays friends are todays enemies…
[thumb=H]25_4_2004_Nek-Wana2809_6376362.JPG[/thumb]
Rebel Whom Army Embraced, Then Killed
ISLAMABAD, 19 June 2004 — Nek Mohammad, the long-haired rebel tribesman and former Taleban commander who defied Pakistan’s campaign to drive Al-Qaeda from its tribal belt, was being publicly embraced by generals just two months ago.
Yet yesterday the military proclaimed major success in tracking, targeting and killing him, in a precision nighttime strike on a mud-walled compound in the remote district of South Waziristan on the Afghan-Pakistani frontier.
Yesterday morning thousands of tribesmen converged on Mohammad’s dusty home village of Kaloosha, some 10 kilometers from the outskirts of Wana where he was killed on Thursday night.
The funeral ceremony was silent, residents said, devoid of customary speeches, and most of the stunned tribesmen had come to see whether the diehard warrior really was dead.
With his flowing dark locks, long black beard and a Taleban-style turban, the swaggering tribesman in his late 20s had cultivated a heroic image among the largely anti-American Pashtun tribes straddling the Afghan-Pakistani frontier after leading a bloody resistance to the army’s largest ever Al-Qaeda offensive in March.
He claimed victory after the army withdrew, suffering 46 troop deaths, and offered him amnesty.
“The world knows who has really surrendered,” Mohammad declared before thousands of tribesmen after a government ceremony on April 24 to formally grant him amnesty, in return for laying down arms and helping to register hundreds of foreign fighters.
Regional army commanders embraced Mohammad at the ceremony and garlanded him with flowers.
Until then Mohammad had topped a government wanted list for harboring Al-Qaeda fugitives. He was a chief target of the bloody March offensive, but led fierce resistance which resulted in the army’s worst ever casualty toll since joining the US-led war on terrorism.
Mohammad was from the fierce Yargulkhel clan, an offshoot of the battle-hardened Waziri tribe which was famous during British colonial rule for constantly attacking British troops. The Yargulkhels have long defied authority.
“Nek Mohammad is seen as David defeating the Goliath of the US and Pakistani army,” said Peshawar-based commentator Iftikhar Ali in April.
“The people have a lot of respect for him. He is a hero for struggling against America.”
Mohammad’s links with Al-Qaeda fighters went back to Taleban-ruled Afghanistan, when he was a commander for the hard-line Islamic militia near Kabul, regional experts said. He trained central Asian fighters — Chechens and Uzbeks — who had found sanctuary in Afghanistan from their own regimes in Afghanistan under the Taleban’s 1996-2001 rule. “That’s where he gained a massive following of Central Asians,” said a veteran Pakistani reporter on the tribal regions. “He was one of the most popular Taleban commanders.”
After the Taleban regime collapsed, he returned home to Kaloosha and set up sanctuaries for other Central Asian fighters fleeing US-led bombing, said Professor Sarfaraz Khan, a Central Asian expert at Peshawar University.
Western diplomats say Mohammad had been supplying arms and tribesmen to Al-Qaeda-linked fighters for cross-border attacks in Afghanistan on aid workers, troops and government targets. “He is, indirectly or directly, responsible for the deaths of up to 400 people in Afghanistan,” a Western diplomat based in Pakistan told AFP on condition of anonymity. As more clashes erupted between the army and militants in recent months, Mohammad’s hero status waned as residents grew weary of fighting. “If this means war is over, then we are happy,” tribesman Mohammad Ullah told AFP.
“We’ve been living under curfew and feeling like prisoners because of constant exchanges of fire. The bazaars were closed, transport charges hit the sky, the price of tomatoes doubled,” resident Naeem Wazir said. “Who knows what will be the repercussion of Nek’s death, but we are happy that our children will live in peace.”
Pakistan should never ever turn on it's friends like that.... won't Pakistan need them again?
Once the elections are held in Afghanistan, foreign troops will abandon that country very quickly.
Pakistan will need another puppet government again, but who's going to volunteer to be used and abused this time?
It's in the best interests of Pakistan, not to make enemies within. Scars of a conflict don't die out the next day.
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*Originally posted by PakistaniDragon: *
Pakistan should never ever turn on it's friends like that.... won't Pakistan need them again?
Once the elections are held in Afghanistan, foreign troops will abandon that country very quickly.
Pakistan will need another puppet government again, but who's going to volunteer to be used and abused this time?
It's in the best interests of Pakistan, not to make enemies within. Scars of a conflict don't die out the next day.
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its in the immediate interest of Pakistan to find a solution to the Wana problem, root out the foreign terrorists who have been responsible for loss of life inside Pakistan and and have been implicated in the attack on life of our leader Mush.
Pakistan relations with current govt in Afghanistan are amicable and hopefully there wont be a need to any puppet govt in future. Keep in mind these terrorist entities in Wana are neither wanted in Pakistan nor in Afghanistan.
mera naik MUhammad....
MAy ALLAH shower his blessing on shahheed....betrayed by pakistani forces ....died by saying ALLAH o AKBAR....
Innallilah e wa inna alihay rajeoon
what abt the 45 Pakistani Muslims killed by him because he was harboring criminals?
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*Originally posted by digitalsurgeon: *
two wrongs dont make a right.
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In politics, they do brother.
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*Originally posted by JaGGa: * its in the immediate interest of Pakistan to find a solution to the Wana problem, root out the foreign terrorists who have been responsible for loss of life inside Pakista
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But there's no such thing as 'foreign' elements in Pakistan.
It's all a made up thing... just another drama.
That's why i'm saying, they're creating unnecessary enemies.
I know it's worth $3 billion, but it's not worth a civil war.
Re: mera naik MUhammad....
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*Originally posted by bao bihari: *
MAy ALLAH shower his blessing on shahheed....betrayed by pakistani forces ....died by saying ALLAH o AKBAR....
Innallilah e wa inna alihay rajeoon
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Ameen.
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*Originally posted by ravage: *
what abt the 45 Pakistani Muslims killed by him because he was harboring criminals?
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They were stupid enough to follow orders from the top brass so they got killed not martyred.
What more were they expecting when they attacked their own brothers?
Just because President Musharraf says they are 'criminals' or 'foreigners' etc. it doesn't means he's telling the truth.
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*Originally posted by PakistaniDragon: *
They were stupid enough to follow orders from the top brass so they got killed not martyred.
What more were they expecting when they attacked their own brothers?
Just because President Musharraf says they are 'criminals' or 'foreigners' etc. it doesn't means he's telling the truth.
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True......i agree with u
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*Originally posted by Zakk: *
Yesterdays friends are todays enemies...
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Story of Pakistan Army.
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*Originally posted by PakistaniDragon: *
They were stupid enough to follow orders from the top brass so they got killed not martyred.
What more were they expecting when they attacked their own brothers?
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Nek Mohammed ordered attacks on his brothers and met with one penalty for it in this life...
Pakistani security forces went into Wana to *arrest*Muslims, not to kill them. The killing of Muslims began when some people in the tribal area decided it was better to kill fellow Muslims than to be arrested by them.
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*Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: * Nek Mohammed ordered attacks on his brothers and met with one penalty for it in this life...
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Only after his people were attacked discrimanately. And discrimination it was. General Musharraf couldn't win Kargil so he's taking on a defenceless target to look good.
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*Originally posted by PakistaniDragon: *
Only after his people were attacked discrimanately. And discrimination it was. General Musharraf couldn't win Kargil so he's taking on a defenceless target to look good.
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Defenceless? The scores of Pakistani dead argue otherwise. And, as I mentioned, the Pakistani army did not attack. It went into an integral part of Pakistan to search for and detain selected men for questioning and charging with criminal offenses.
Nek Mohammed and his buddies decided that this non-lethal act somehow gave them the right to start killing Pakistani and above all Muslim soldiers.
The fighting that followed as Pakistani troops put down this despicable rebellion against government authority ended with an agreement that Pakistani soldiers would leave, so long as Nek Mohammed and his buddies helped identify just who the men Pakistan wanted to know about in the area were.
Nek Mohammed did not live up to his end of the deal, so the Army had to go back in to locate and detain the foreign men in the area for identification, and questioning and charging should they be suspected of illegal acts.
Again, rather confusingly, Nek Mohammed and his buddies decided that this non-lethal action gave them the right to start killing Pakistani and above all Muslim soldiers.
These actions show just how dangerous a man he was, they show the despicable depths of his treason in attacking Pakistanis soldiers for merely being in part of Pakistan, and show why the Army's actions in dealing with him were correct.
He was protecting fellow muslims from being shipped to gitmo. We all know that the amnesty deal was a farce.
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*Originally posted by fakir-e-azam: *
He was protecting fellow muslims from being shipped to gitmo. We all know that the amnesty deal was a farce.
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Of all the people arrested in pakistan under suspicion of AL-Qaeda links, pakiatani and non-Pakistani alike, I can think of a mere handful who have been deported to US custody. Khalid Sheikh Mohammed is one, and that Taliban guy arrested in 2001 is another. Other than that, they have either been deported to their country of origin where criminal charges were outstanding against them, such as Indonesia, or, in most cases, put on trial inside Pakistan.
Aside from which, is resisting arrest really justification to commit murder? If you think you are innocent of any crime, would you be right to put a bullet into those who come to arrest you?
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*Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: * Defenceless?
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Yes!
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*Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: * The scores of Pakistani dead argue otherwise.
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It's a weak army, anyone can take them out with ease.
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*Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: * And, as I mentioned, the Pakistani army did not attack.
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It laid siege to the area with tanks, threatened them with military action and tried to starve the innocent people with economic sanctions.
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*Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: * It went into an integral part of Pakistan to search for and detain selected men for questioning and charging with criminal offenses.
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There was no need for it. You don't send in the army to question a few people. It's a policeman's job!
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Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: * Nek Mohammed and his buddies decided that this *non-lethal act somehow gave them the right to start killing Pakistani and above all Muslim soldiers.
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Going around the region in tanks and hovering helicopters over them day and night is enough to provoke anyone. Pakistani army needs to get it's Islamic priorities right first before going around lecturing everyone else.
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*Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: * The fighting that followed as Pakistani troops put down this despicable rebellion against government authority ended with an agreement that Pakistani soldiers would leave,
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Shouldn't had occupied them in the first place.
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*Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: * so long as Nek Mohammed and his buddies helped identify just who the men Pakistan wanted to know about in the area were.
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Nek Mohammed wasn't a infrared or a heat seeking satellite.
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*Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: * Nek Mohammed did not live up to his end of the deal,
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It's not easy to find criminals that don't exist.
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*Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: * so the Army had to go back in to locate and detain the foreign men in the area for identification,
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A $3 Billion Lollywood drama with Musharraf as the Director and the US as the Producer.
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*Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: * and questioning and charging should they be suspected of illegal acts.
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The army already planned to murder them.
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Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: * Again, rather confusingly, Nek Mohammed and his buddies decided that this *non-lethal action gave them the right to start killing Pakistani and above all Muslim soldiers.
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Everyone has the right to defend themselves. Pakistani army didn't treat their Muslim brothers as Muslims so it served them right.
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*Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: * These actions show just how dangerous a man he was,
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He was a Muslim.
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*Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: * they show the despicable depths of his treason in attacking Pakistanis soldiers for merely being in part of Pakistan,
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An autonomous region.
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*Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: * and show why the Army's actions in dealing with him were correct.
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Bullying a peace loving people who have not harmed nor participated in anything else that rest of the Pakistan does for the last 56 years.