Once Hero and Now Zero

Society Pakistan & World Affairs
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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

Salim,

Thanks for enlightening about the history on Nuclear Technology in Pakistan. I agree with you what you are saying. But don’t you think a person who was responsible for making solid foundation of Nuclear Technology was hanged in fraud murder case and a person who made first nuclear device has been disgraced of corruption, confined even not allowed to meet with his family members, is wrong. He was brought to zero from peak and disgraced. He was not sacrificed to save the country but to save some corrupt military janta.

My post was just comparing expert in nuclear technology in India and an expert in Pakistan. One is president of the country enjoying all kinds of respect and honor and the other one is confined and disgraced by very same people who made him once hero.

FARID

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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

And AQK hero supporters are constipated with conspiracy theories. The firms in Malaysia, the banks in Dubai, The Ayataullahs of Iran, and the Gaddah-fi of Libya all are saying AQK was central in centrifuge refuse being peddeled to all these rogue regimes.

However the mental constipation won't allow conspiracy theorists to see the light.

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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

Antiobl: From all your mails on the issue, it seems that you are too much concerned about proliferation, especially accusation that proliferation is done by Pakistan and particularly A Q Khan. Why are you so much concerned? Why it hurts you? Can you please tell us what troubles you about proliferation?

Farid:

[quote]
But don’t you think a person who was responsible for making solid foundation of Nuclear Technology was hanged in fraud murder case and a person who made first nuclear device has been disgraced of corruption, confined even not allowed to meet with his family members, is wrong.
[/quote]

I do not think that you are right in comparing the mishaps of Bhutto and A Q Khan. To me, what happened with A Q Khan was a way of clearing Pakistan of involvement in proliferation. I wish that such should not happen but I think that this is what government of the time thought best way of coming out of the situation. A Q Khan was all over the documents as he was probably the front man in proliferation but I do not think that A Q Khan was acting for his own personal benefit but whatever he was doing, it was for the benefit of the country, as country needed money for the research and missile technology.

[Note: Clearing Pakistan of proliferation at the cost of AQ Khan by present government cannot be considered as done to save some person or group of people, other then Pakistan (from sanctions). Reason being that General Musharaf or others around in the government, none are amongst those who were there when proliferation happened]

As for Z A Bhutto, no doubt that Bhutto played a major role in initiating nuclear program in Pakistan and no one denies that credit to him. Well, nuclear program was already there under ‘Pakistan Atomic Energy Commission’ but Bhutto started Pakistan nuclear program for purpose of making Pakistan nuclear power. But then, one also have to remember that few years after initiating, he was out of power and thus taking the program to its conclusion happened under Zia-ul-Haq (who did not compromised or stalled the program but carried it forward to its ultimate conclusion).

As for hanging of Bhutto, it is nothing to do with nuclear program. The people that followed him kept the program going and did not changed that policy. Thus, one should see hanging of Bhutto according to its own merit.

I believe that many know the reason behind his hanging, though few like to mention that. I cannot put complete blame on Zia alone as Bhutto contributed more towards his fate then anyone else.

What happened?

Firing occurred on PPP dissident, Ahmad Raza Qasuri, but his father, Nawab Mohammad Ahamad Khan Qasuri died.

November 11, 1974: Ahmad Raza Qasuri files First Information Report (FIR) in Lahore, implicating Bhutto in the murder of his father Nawab Mohammad Ahmad Khan.

After taking power, Bhutto started FSF (Federal security force), a paramilitary force, parallel to army and loyal to Bhutto (just like Hitler’s SAS). FSF was directly under the control of Bhutto. Many believe that Bhutto had committed many political murders but there is no concrete proof, as obviously, if he was involved, he was not the one pulling the trigger. FSF (Federal security Force) did all the killings (or torture if that was sufficient) and it is believed that FSF was acting on behalf of Bhutto.

Question arises that when FIR was registered against Bhutto in 1974, why it was not dealt in the court at that time? Why the case stayed suppressed? It is unlikely that Bhutto was unaware of that FIR as Ahmed Raza Qasuri was outspoken critic of Bhutto. It seems that for Bhutto, FIR meant nothing so he did not care. Was Bhutto thinking that being a powerful prime minister, no law could come against him and harm him?

Well, that arrogance cost Bhutto his life. After Bhutto ousted, Bhutto was arrested on Qasuri Murder charge on 3rd of Sept 1977. Before then, he was challenging Zia-ul-Haq martial law in public. Bhutto was making an enemy for himself and then old FIR came in to arrest him (Qasuri again initiated the dormant case).

September 3, 1977: Bhutto is arrested in the murder case of Nawab Mohammad Ahmad Khan Qasuri.

Later, Zia-ul-Haq who till then was promising to hold election in 90 days (starting from coup day, 5th July, 1977) gone back on his words

October 1, 1977: General Zia announces postponement of elections until the "process of accountability has been completed."

The events that unfolded later:

**March 18, 1978: Lahore High Court sentences Bhutto and four FSF officials to death in the murder case of Nawab Mohammad Ahmad Khan Qasuri.

May 6, 1978: Supreme Court begins hearing an appeal against the Lahore High Court verdict against Bhutto.**

**February 6, 1979: Supreme Court, in a majority decision, rejects appeal of Bhutto and four others.

March 25, 1979: Supreme Court rejects a review petition of all the five convicts.

April 1, 1979: President General Ziaul Haq rejects the mercy petition.

April 4, 1979: Bhutto is executed**.

Now, it is debatable that justice was done or was not done. Allah knows best and those who were involved. Regardless, it was Zia that got him hanged or court, one thing is obvious and that is, Bhutto’s arrogance, ignorance and belief of self-importance was also a major factor for him to get hanged.

Politicians should realize that their power comes from people (that includes army). No politician can survive if that politician do not have respect and love amongst the people (including armed forces).

If army general is stronger then the politician [because particular politician is not loved and respected amongst people (including armed forces as those in armed forces are also part of the population)] then if politician are ruling, they are ruling with consent of the generals. If politician has love and respect amongst the people, no general would touch them.

Politicians should be wary about behaving arrogantly or ignorantly. For an army general, if that general is honest and have love/respect in the forces, army would come for his rescue. For politicians, if people do not come out, that politicians can get hanged easily if generals want to.

Politicians have to earn that love and respect amongst the people (just like a general earn that rank over the years and love/respect amongst forces). Sometime politicians earn that respect due to ignorance of the people and sometime their love and respect comes due to party. If politicians are crook and have that love/respect because of ignorance of the people, time comes when they lose all that love and respect (as happening with NS and BB).

whos my good friend here?
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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

Wow !! Sa1eem bro you are a champ.......love reading your informative posts :)

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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

Let me first say that my hats off to your thorough analysis of Bhutoo's atrocious behavior against his political adversaries.

People must remember it was Bhuttoo who started torture chambers in Dulai. It was Bhuttoo who instituted looting of banks, educational institutions, and industries in the name of Leftie Kommies.

So Saleem mian! there are not many on this forum or in Pak media who have in depth knowledge like yourself and I commend you for that.

Proliferation is bad for Pakistan and it was never good for Pakistan. AQK and his group of nukie peddlers went beyond any reason and got Pakistan onto the track of rogue regimes like Iran, Libya and North Korea.

Look! We have 150 million people living in our country. Our obligation to them and to ourselves is to never take them to the rogue regime side. Never Ever, Never!

The price of rogue regime is too big to pay. AQK was simply a petty smuggler, who in his little mind, was acting as Robin Hood-hood for Islamic brother-hood-hood. Even if we look at all the money he may have made for "national" interests, it was in the tune of few million dollars. That hardly ever gets us going anywhere. We need $3 billion every year. And AQK was never able to provide through his smuggling even a fraction of that.

However the same namak haram filled his own pockets and spend Rs. millions on his personal stuff like weddings and other lavish shenanigans. If it was his own money, I'd have no problem.

Unfortunately he sold the most important stuff to the likes of Iranian Moolahs. The same Moolahs who turned around and pointed their dirty fingers straight at AQK.

This is the biggest embarrassment for any nation let alone a nation of 150 million people. And that's my point. People like AQK have forced us down to the levels of pathetic Arabs.

Americans give us $3billion a year and further $20 billon in the form of trade. No namak haram can sell nukie stuff to earn that much.

Bottom line: If you have to be a rogue, then be the rogue fighting for the topmost power in the world. You know that makes sense.

Why cant people just leave her alone!!
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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

AQ Khan is still the hero of average Pakistani as they still think that he has been made escape goat to save Pakistan from sanctions (and truly so). You have to be dumb to believe that AQ Khan was doing all this and was able to keep it secret from Pak Army and Govt?

All of this mess was created by those “brotherly” countries (named, Libya and Iran). I hope the event was an eye opener for Pakistan’s rulers and they will stop singing brother hood hood hood….

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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

Absolutely. And the fact that the givernment allowed him to keep the money and not allow foreign countries to have access to him proves that AQ Khan made a deal with the government to take the blame for Pakistan’s government policy of giving technology to friendly nations (that later backstabbed us).

Even the “house arrest” is most certainly a matter of national security. The pakistan government probably fears that if AQ Khan was able to roam at will, he could be kidnapped by foreign intelligence agencies trying to find out the nuclear capabilities of Iran, North Korea, and along the way, Pakistan.

After all, remember that Israel kidnapped an Israeli nuclear scientist who had fled to Rome; and more recently, the CIA kidnapped an Italian citizen of Arab origin inside Italy because they thought he was a major terrorist.

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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

Thats what most people with some logical minds think. For the rest of the world he can be a crook or whatever, but as an outsider I would think he has done a great deal for Pakistan.

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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

No matter wht A Q Khan has done for himself but i think he is still a hero, even if you ignore the role he played in acquiring nuclear technology, you cannot ignore the way he protected our generals from worldwide criticism, our nation would have been declared a "rouge state" by now had he not taken all the blame.

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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

Sheikh Rashid was talking to Dr Shahid Masood on ARY last night and he said that the US has no real purpose in asking for Dr A Q Khan, and that the GoP had declared 2 mths ago that the chapter was closed as far as Pakistan was concerned and he has been 'forgiven' and is still a hero for the nation regardless of whatever mistakes he may have made. And that the president will not hand him over to anyone at any cost, and it's out of the question by all means.

Happy B'day Sheynie
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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

^^ Look it is the leftie liberals of USA who are asking for access to AQK.

Bush admin. on the other hand has already acquired all the info that they needed.

IHC declares Dr. A.Q Khan a free citizen
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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

whatever mistakes Dr Khan may have or has committed; cannot wash off his efforts, hard work and input,whatever it may be, in our nuclear pragramme!!

He was, is and would always remain our Hero

:jhanda:

there could be many reasons why he did what he says he did; we can assume nething, like he did it all for money, greed and all but It may well be for the reasons mentioned by **Saleem ! **
Allah knows what the intentions or the purpose was!

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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

Salim,

“February 6, 1979: Supreme Court, in a majority decision, rejects appeal of Bhutto and four others.”

This is not complete story. Ziaul-Haq kept on changing judges, ultimately he brought judges who were even not in majority to decide. It was split 3-3 decision. Chief Justice Anwar-ul-Haq favoured with other 3 and case was decided 4-3. later Retired Justice Nasim who gave decision in favor hanging, said that his decision was incorrect. Before that trial, Justice Yaqoob Ali of Supreme court approved bail the and released ZAB because of lack of evidence. Justice Yaqoob was kicked out from his seat by dictator Ziaul haq and rearrested ZAB. FSF director Maqsood who was main witness in this case, his where about are still unknown.

Justice Mushtaq who passed orders for hanging Bhutto, that ******* died a miserable death. During his funeral five more people died when they bit by poisonous bees in grave yard.

“April 4, 1979: Bhutto is executed”

The legend said that he was never executed but murdered by one of the general while he tried to get his signatures on blank cheques given by Colonel Qadafi for development of Nuclear technology. On his refusal he was kicked with military boots and died due to internal bleeding. After his death his dead body was hanged and brought to his native place. No one was allowed to see his face even his family.

Farid

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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

So Bhutto had checks from Gaddha-fi in 79! 26 years later the same Gaddah-fi still had no nukie. The parts of those half eaten nukie were transfered in 3 planes to Uncle Sam. Then the same Gaddah-fi pointed his dirty fingers to Pakistan and AQK.

Are you sure the blank checks were for AQK and not ZAB? Being an Arab, Gaddah-fi has Ilmul-Ghaib (black magic)?

Zia changed judges for many reasons and one of them could be Bhutoo. However anyone denying Bhutto's heavy handed tactics, Dulai camp, and other Kommie Leftie shenanigans surely is trying to rewrite hish-itory.

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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

Senate shows anger at US.
*
“The Senate on Friday criticised members of the US House of Representatives for what it termed their “unwarranted observations and demands” that Dr Abdul Qadeer Khan be handed over for interrogation and inquiries into nuclear proliferation.”*
http://dawn.com/2006/06/03/top8.htm

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Re: Once Hero and Now Zero

Prof. Khursheed should give it a rest. There is lot of $hite discussed in US Congress, we don't have to drag that $hite to Islamabad. However what do you expect from these politikos.

This is the time to be serious, somber, and mind our own business. AQK did make mistakes, and that is why we have locked him up.

Time to ignore the noise and concentrate on developing Pakistan's international trade. Oh BTW USA happens to be a very large trading partner and source of huge amount of $$$.