On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

A person who defends another for justice is indeed doing right. The shuhadah are of two types: Those who are shaheed to the ummah, and those who are shaheed to Allah (SWT). Those people who are shaheed to the ummah have to be openly defending Islam in the process of their life being taken and they are not given a burial ceremony they are just buried. Their reality can be different. Some of the people who are shaheed to the ummah are indeed accepted as shuhadah to Allah (SWT), but some are not and while the ummah is stooped in deception about their state Allah (SWT) knows the truth about them. Otherwise there are also those shaheed that are treated like normal deaths or accidental deaths and are given burial ceremonies and treated like dead victims, but in reality their inner state has been accepted by Allah (SWT) as of the shuhadah. These people can never been known about in this life unless a wali gets a dream or something like that. So it is incorrect for us to say that Mr Taseer is shaheed, but we can pray for him to be given that status.

Now coming to the blasphemy law

In the state of anger a person can be very offensive and especially so an ignorant person will not find it easy to hold back. Such ignorant people may not even know the law of the country. The point is should a person who attacks Allah (SWT) or our dear prophet Muhammad (SAW) be sentenced to death?

The answer surprisingly is that it ‘depends’.

So far the way this is being done is that if witnesses stand up against a person then despite their denial they are sentenced. This method is actually against the spirit of Islam and against any known law of Shari’ah.

The correct way to implement blasphemy law is when a person “OPENLY” and under “TESTIMONY” commits blasphemy. So when in a court or behind a camera of a news reporter a person openly does blasphemy then they must be sentenced in accordance with the given punishment.

If a person denies saying anything, apologises or recants under oath and remains silent and states they have made a mistake under oath that in anger had stated something bad then this is the ticket to freeedom and should be given the opportunity to apologise and should then be let go completely or may be serve community service for a short while, depending on an agreed and just balance of scales, but either way no hudd punishment can be given here.

The problem with the law at the moment is that people can gang up on someone who they don’t like and give witness statements of blasphemy and then there is no way for the person to escape the full penalty then you ask where is the justice in that because the person could have said it out of anger for the people when taunted and could have been completely ignorant of the law and its punishment.

If a person however blasphemes under oath or behind a camera causing REAL fitnah then the situation is different.

Those people who are in agreement with the actions of Mumtaz Qadir should understand that he acted outside the law and is hence a murderer and if he is killed he will not be shaheed according to the ummah because the person who he killed was not PROVEN to be gustakh-e-rasool in a court of law. He was pinned that label (guilty before being proven innocent) and some hot-headed person took his life.

It may be that Taseer was wrong but before being proven wrong he was killed otherwise he also could have been right.

Now people should step back and think that just because an ignorant woman blasphemed and the situation was ignorantly handled three people may lose their life over this … The holy prophet Muhammad (SAW) who we are trying to defend will never have accepted this … never … Allah help us!

Re: On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

Great post psyah!! I'm in total agreement.

Re: On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

Irrespective of the the actual punishment if blasphemy is proven, this is quite a sensible approach.

Re: On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

So define blasphemy for me please

what if Mr XYZ stands tomorrow and declare himself as a prophet - will this also get acknowledged as blasphemy ?

Re: On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

The more I'm getting to know about Salman Taseer the more I'm getting the feeling of him being shaheed.

Re: On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

^^ How much does one know about the ''the definition of shaheed'' ?

Re: On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

Peace Naabigh

The issue is not about blasphemy ... or at least it should not be. It should be about the fitnah of the blasphemer. Now an atheist does not believe in God this is blasphemy of course it is. However, because it does not affect the society if this particular atheist happens to live in Pakistan then he should not be touched by the law. He is free to believe as he believes.

If however he declares in public his beliefs and tries to propagate them or tries to ridicule the beliefs of Muslims in public, under oath or has written and published a book or addressed a media channel with the intent of propagating the belief then his blasphemy is causing a fitnah and must be stopped with punishment.

So if someone says anything against our prophet Muhammad (SAW) they should be brought to court, but if they apologise then the fitnah ends, if under oath they explain that they said such and such in anger and didn't mean to create a public outcry they should be free to go. Only when they try to create a social problem with intent and not apologise about it ... then it should result in punishment for the state that implements blasphemy law.

Now if a person declares himself a prophet in a state that implements blasphemy law he is actually causing fitnah openly in public and by so doing he is taken to court, he is given the opportunity to take back what he said and have his recant on record, if he does not choose this option and continues in his mission even under oath then he should be given the punishment as per the law.

The point is the law needs to be made clear and practical ... and correct as per Islam. At the moment it is not fully correct because of the examples given above.

No one is dearer to us than Muhammad (SAW) it does not mean that we lose our senses over him, but it means we should work with hikmah and do things to make people love him (SAW) instead ... How will our actions in recent events about blasphemy make others love Muhammad (SAW) ???

I truly believe in societies where Islam is not the major religion Muslims are forced to use reason and conversation more and that is proving to be a better setting for attracting more converts, but places like Pakistan at the moment are not managing to achieve the same thing yet.

Re: On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

Exactly my point - I hope I have conveyed my message through my simple question - I fully comprehend that there have been gross violation of this law - and innocent people have suffered - which should be stopped .

By it doesn't mean that we should completely make this law null and void this .

The law should stay there - by all means make it clear and practical .. also have punishments devised for people who misuse it

But if we are going to discard this law - then believe me - we will see many false prophets lining up in Pakistan .

Re: On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

how many false prophets have started up in other countries with large Muslim populations where they dont have blasphemy laws similar to Pakistan? Lets start with India, Indonesia, Malaysia, where there arent legal protections against false prophets. Has your slippery slope scenario played out?

Re: On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

Mirza Ghulam Ahmed - There were no Blasphemy laws in United India that time -

hows that for a starter ?

Re: On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

I have not been arguing that there should be a law for blasphemy in Pakistan or not, I'm saying if there is going to be one then it should be done this way or not at all. To answer the question about such countries and an alleged slippery slope the point is not that there is necessarily going to be one.

Causing fitnah for a society does not necessarily mean or translate to masses of people losing faith, but it could affect a few people. The point is about the fitnah itself not the measurable affects of the fitnah and certainly not about the blasphemy itself ... purely the 'fitnah creating' is what deserves punishment. - In the Qur'an "fitnah is worse than murder". " Wal fitnahtu akbaru minal Qatli " - 2:217

Re: On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

There are still no blasphemy laws in India, nor in Indonesia and Malaysia. In three countries comprising a Muslim population of about half a million, you have to go back about 100 years to find a single false prophet of any significance. As opposed to your claim that without such laws we'll have many false prophets lining up. Can you see the slight contrast between fact and fantasy?

Re: On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

My post was wrt Naabigh's claim about lots of false prophets lining up. I agree with you about fitnah. We have existing laws on the books that protect against fitnah, that protected all religious groups. Those are sufficient, as opposed to zia's laws.

Re: On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

Oh I see :)

Re: On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

In last 100 years we had these people claiming to be either a prophet or Messaih or Mehdi

Mahmood Muhammad Taha: a false claimant to prophecy who was based in Sudan- he was beheaded in 1985.

Jasmin: He appeared in 1998 in Bosnia, claiming the War of Bosnia and Herzegovina was the Battle of Armageddon, and claims that he is the Messiah.

Dr. Dwight York: Another fairly recent false claimant to prophecy was Dr. York n the late 1960s

Riyaz Ahmad Gohar Shahi: Another claimant to Mehdihood and prophecy.

You leave the door and you will see more popping in !

Re: On Shahadat and the correct implementation of blasphemy laws in Pakistan

Right... so you had to go back 100 years, you're including a population of about 3 billion (assuming you're including both Muslims and Christians), you've found 4 people. Two of them are people who live in countries without blasphemy laws, two of them are people who live(d) in countries with blasphemy laws. In the case of Mahmood Muhammad Taha and Gohar Shahi, the door was metaphorically closed, and they popped in. Gohar Shahi continues to have his little cult, and your door didnt do much about it. It seems like

a) The law anticipates against events that happen extremely infrequently. May I emphasise the infrequency bit.. 3 billion over about 4 generations, lets say 8-9 billion people produced your 4 horrible false prophets. Most of these people lived without blasphemy laws, yet did not experience an increased rate of false prophet production.
b) The law is completely ineffective, as many people claim to prophecy without the law as they do in its presence

May I again emphasise how ridiculous it is that you came up with this sorry list of names when I asked you to give names specifically from three countries: India, Indonesia and Malaysia. Three populous countries with Muslim populations, that do not have blasphemy laws against false prophets. You came up with four names, two goray (i.e. belonging to non-populous or non-Muslim countries) and two people from Muslim countries with blasphemy laws. In other words they failed on one of the two criteria I listed for you when I asked you to give examples. You were unable to come up with false prophets from the 500 million strong subset of Muslims, despite stretching your timeframe to 100 years.