Salam to all,
Matsui: for the REAL Islam your argument on culture,history etc. cannot stand. Let me tell you why: for the monotheist religions of Christianity, Judaism and Islam, the entire human race on planet earth starts with the “original parents” of mankind: Adam and Eve: this is in the Bible, Torah and Quran (Bible and Quran for sure and I think in the Torah as well). So for PRACTISING monotheists the idea of tracing back one’s ethnicity, culture, etc. to a particular chunk of land is ridiculous at best because mankind starts with Adam and Eve and all the rest is secondary to this primary belief.
So if you say go back 5,000 years to Indus Valley, I will say why stop at 5,000 years or 10,000 years, go back to the start of humanity.
Perhaps this perspective explains why monotheists “originate” from various continents on earth (ie Muslim and Christians and to a lesser extent Jews originate from Africa, Europe, Asia, etc. whereas Hindus are in majority only in one particular locality of planet earth??). If you are, as I think you are, a Hindu, I can understand why this concept may be a little difficult for you to grasp on account of the HUGE differences between monotheist and polytheist creeds of belief (I have had an opportunity to read and learn about the caste system in hinduism and you may believe this or not, one of my friends in Dubai belongs to the “achoote” class - we have been friends since childhood and he has been more than clear on numerous occasions that his family feels more comfortable and secure in Dubai than in India where in their home village they really are treated as third class citizens – being born into a particular class: Brahmin, Shoudras, etc.) - the monotheist view is TOTALLY different.
BTW, I think your comment on Pakestanis being second-class citizens of Arabia is totally misconstrued and somewhat unfair. It does not make sense. Pakestan is a reality, whether Hindi people like it or not. My post was directed at sharing what my view was on what has gone wrong in Pakestan especially keeping in mind the country’s identity crisis: it was initiated with the Islamic principles (Jinnah was in touch with the Arab League on various matters) but then soon after Indus Valley principles (that go blatantly against Islam) kicked in. So the idea is to give this independent nation a fresh outsider perspective and not to undermine their identity by implying in anyway that Pakestan cannot or does not have the ability to function properly or that it needs India hanging around it like a big brother all the time!
I have nothing against Indians. But I have a right, like you, to express views freely and honestly, my view is that Pakestan is much much much better off forgetting those customs and traditions that have originated from outside Islam because this is one of the root causes of tensions in that society. Now this has to come from the people voluntarily (if only they had time from 3.475534 hour long Hindi movies and playing 8.53434 hours of cricket games!)
Based on your argument, South Americans should abandon Christianity and start worshipping the Mayan and other dieties. they used to worship before the arrival of Spainish armies (which many believe the Spainiards copied from Muslims after living under Muslim “occupation” for 500 odd years in Spain itslef.
Try to sell your “skin” and “culture” argument across in a busy market on a Sunday morning in Argentina or Brazil - or maybe not!. So all I can say is that you should try to see the perspective of others beside India on this topic.
In fact you have proved my point: what apparently disturbs you is the fact that Pakestan CAN try to go the other way - In my analysis, India WANTS a love-hate relationship with Pakestan - the “hate” against Pakestan is what unites a huge country like India and the “love” fuels deluded fantasies of a larger sphere of Indian influence (either by enventual reunification - as India’s Home Minister said once in a gathering of Indians in Dubai and didn’t realize that some of Arabic dressed people could comprehend English (just kidding) - or at least some form of a common market where India is top dog. Again Advani was selling the “Rupa” to an Indian Chamber of Commerce meeting once - the new name for a South Asian currency like the Euro!). Those maybe a billion Indians’ views and they are entitled to it but mutual respect includes hearing others out as well and I really can see Pakestan doing much better if it had nothing to do with India: I don’t want war or tensions, but I feel that Pakestan’s resources are put to better use by having a “cool-off period” with India (say minimal communication for a period of 20 years) and then see the Pakestan that emerges from ashes!
I am sure we will be interacting more on this site.
I shall also try to address the points raised by my Pakestan brothers.
Anyway, lest we deviate from the actual post - which has more to do with Pakestan and Islam I shall stop now.
Ma’salama
