Okay then Vote for Quaid e azam or Shah faisal or someone

mr. frauidya,
sorry .. i know i was too harsh.. i apologize :)

hmm, ts sahab,

the answers to your questions are evident in my previous post.
answer1) it is people like YOU who is proving islam to be a religion of terrorism, by giving those verses from koran, without giving there context!
answer2) i guess we have the same point of view here.. probably
answer3) my approach towards how to treat christians and jews, and jehaad against them, is evident from the koranic verses i have mentioned in my previous posts. i guess you didnt read them :)

Dear someone else-

Not going anywhere!!!

so long...

ts says:
"How many reference do you require to know that Jews & Christians couldn't be our friends?"

someone else says:
" it is people like YOU who is proving islam to be a religion of terrorism, by giving those verses from koran, without giving there context!"

the verse below clearly shows that only in certain cases is it forbidden to be friends with christians and jews, while in others, being friends with them is encouraged.

(verse 90,91 chapter 4, Women)

".......take not to yourself any of them as a friend or helper; except those, that betake themselves to a nation who are joined with you by a compact, or come to you with breasts constricted from fighting with you, or fighting their people....if they withdraw from you, and do not fight with you, and offer you peace, then Allah assigns not any way to you against them."

i repeat,
"if they withdraw from you, and do not fight with you, and offer you peace, then Allah assigns not any way to you against them."

Now in the light of above verse, look at your statments:

"My choice is Adolph Hitler b/c he did something that 1+ billion muslims can't do...Elimination of Jews."

"you've got to eliminate the part of the body which is affected by cancer and is going to affect the rest of the body."

where in the koran does allah give you the right to eliminate jews by killing them? when it is clearly said,
"if they withdraw from you, and do not fight with you, and offer you peace, then Allah assigns not any way to you against them."
then how come you say u are there to eliminate them by sword? get a life!

i swear upon allah, that from adam to muhammad, all the history of prophets and religion, and if not all that, then just even the life history of muhammad, bear witness, that Religion doesnt teach hatred! religion does not teach cruelty, and fighting. religion does not allow killing of human beings!
religion teaches, peace, love, kindness and above all, patience!

"And for why didn't God eliminated them, If the God would've had to do everything for us, what is the purpose of us being here TK!!!"

Where in the koran does it define your purpose to be elimination of jews? your other references to the koran, are already not acceptable, becoz u dont reffer to where u took them from, and even if i do accept all of them, NOWHERE in them does it define the purpose of muslims to be the elimination of jews!
"And fight in the name of Allah, against those who fight with you, but aggress not: Allah loves not the aggressors."
(verse 191, chapter 2, the cow)

now to get you clearer:

"had allah willed, they were not 'mushrikeen' , and We have not appointed thee , a watcher over them, neither art thou their guardian."
(verse 108, chapter 6, the cattle)

Now what do you have to say? Allah has told you that it was his own will that they are unbelievers, and he has told you to mind your own business! and u talk about their "elimination" ? get a life!

when it has been clearly stated in the koran, "laa ikraahu fiddeen" then how come you are going for killing in the name of religion?

if u are true, find one verse where allah orders muslims to eliminate jews! You cant! coz there aint any!

The true religion is one, which attracts hearts with its truth! which attracts souls with peace! a true religion does NOT need swords!

want to have more? here:

"Say:'truth is there from your Lord; and let whosoever will believe,and whosoever will disbelieve..."
(verse 30, chapter 18, the cave)

now?? when Allah has given free will for everybody to believe or disbelieve !!! then how do you say you are allowed to eliminate jews?????

and thats not all, see this one:
"These revelations are just a "naseehat", then let him who wills so, follow the path that leads to his Lord"
(verse 30, chapter 76, Man)

look how beutiful the verse is, that these revelations are just to tell us, whosoever want, he can believe them... NO COMPULSION!
when such beautiful verses are present in the koran, i wonder why you still say that our pupose is to eliminate jews!

hungry for more?? here yo go:

"Say:'Allah I serve, making my religion His, sincerely; and you serve what you like, apart from Him."
(verse 15,16 chapter 39, The companies)

Now? when allah has allowed them to worship whatever they like, apart from him, then who are you to kill them??? how come it is your purpose to eliminate them????

allah have clearly told us how to treat unbelievers in the chapter called "the unbelievers". telling us to tell them:
"to you, your religion, to me my religion"
(verse 5 chapter 109, the unbelievers)

so where did it mention, us to eliminate them??? read the whole chapter 109, and see that allah has told us what to say to the unbelievers! and it does NOT mention killing or eliminating them! when allah has not allowed it, then who are you?????

thats not all. more to listen to:

" And if thy Lord had willed, whoever is in the earth would have believed, all of them, all together. Wouldst thou then constrain the people until they are believers?"
(verse 100, chapter 10, Jonah)

Got an ansswer to that?? when it is allah's will that they are unbelievers, then who are you to interfere?? allah has clearly ordered in the above verse, no to constrain!! no swords, no killing, no elimination!

Described above are just a few examples where it is evident, that allah himself is the one to punish the disbelievers, and it is not for us to kill anyone in the name of religion!
"if they withdraw from you, and do not fight with you, and offer you peace, then Allah assigns not any way to you against them."

now in the end, i will refer to this verse, which will COMPLETELY shatter all your dreams of eliminating jews or christians by sword:

"Surely they that believe (muslims), and those of jewry, and the sabeans, and those chistians, whosoever believes in Allah, and the last day, and works righteousness, no fear shall be on them, neither shall they sorrow!"
(verse 70, chapter 5, the table)

now what? anything more to say?

Dear someone else-

Your "contextual" interpretaion of Quran reflects your and your community's opinion. Since you belong to Qadiani community, therefore, your'e excused. Do whatever your beliefs are, I have no problem.

For me, your'e wrong and this argument could've turned into a long debate but I don't want to disrespect your beliefs and I have no intention to prove you wrong.

Just want to remind you though, be careful when you reply to the religious post of non-qadianis or atleast let the person know about your belief.

End of Statement. TS.

so long...

"contextual meaning" like:
someone says:
"everyone except saleem played well."
and u are quoting it as:
".....saleem played well."
see, the words are unchanged, the meaning is the oppositte!
so it wouldve been very nice of you to give the refernce to the context of the verses you mentioned. you produced blind texts, without even mentioning the chapter they're from.

1) when koran is used as the basic source of knowledge, does it matter as to what sect i belong to?
2) there are 72 sects other than Ahamadis, do they not disagree with each other on several points?
3) if the answer to the above question is yes, than acccording to your rule, should you not also mention the sect you're from?
4) If the answer to the above question is yes, than isnt it correct, by your own rule, that all the stuff you said should be disregarded by the other sects?
5) is this forum meant for people of only certain sects?
6) the answer of the above question being no, dont the people have a right to express their opinion as a human being?
7) Why did you come up with the "ahmadi excuse" after six days?

aright, i respect your feelings, no debate! The posts above are quite sufficient for people to see two point-of-views and chose the better one.

you go on preaching hatred and killing,
i go on preaching peace and love!

Let the public chose what they go for!

"to you, your religion, to me my religion"
(verse 5 chapter 109, the unbelievers)