Re: Oh God , we have wasted 1400 years and still.....
reply from dawa-i-dil :
regarding brelvi muslims, which i think brother masum is , views about salafi or we sunnis , i have a short debate on (***********) and then no reply to me , i gave it for convenience of readers , the thread was exactly same as above :
Sunni Soldier Of Islam
Senior Member
Posts: 1565
Joined: 11/18/2005
Aslama o alaykhum.
Umar bahi simle answer....the world is not in WAHABI PHOBIA, but it is under Wahabi terrorism
Brealeavis and Deobandis i have never heard them fighting but YES they hold debates to exchange views ad show who is on HAQ....
Deobandis/Wahabis and Shia have history of killing where ALHUMDULLILAH BREALEAVIS do not have histroy of killing but history of Its ULEMAS being SHAHEED and still pracitcing SABAR so please umar bahi dont say STUPIDITIES as i find it offensive i hope you dont mind.
ALLAH HAFFIZ
another reply:
Muhammad Mobasher Muhammadi
Senior Member
Posts: 2288
Joined: 10/20/2005
Brother Muhammad Umar, THIS is what exactly people come up with when they have no knowledge about Islam and fortunately Allah Azzawajal Has Blessed some with the knowledge to differentiate between right an wrong. The discussion is a layman conversation with all due respect.
The article in the forum is also pasted from a Najdi website who at first appreciated Ghous-ul-Azam and then came to what they do best, he says:
''Shaykh 'Abd al-Qaadir agreed with Ahl al-Sunnah wa'l-Jamaa'ah - the followers of truth - concerning all issues of 'aqeedah (belief), namely Tawheed, faith, Prophethood, and the Last Day.
There are some minor mistakes and errors in his books, and some innovations which are relatively insignificant when compared with his achievements. ''
Later, he starts praising Najdi Al Maloun and quotes him:
''Iforbid them to call upon the Prophets and the dead among the righteous and others, and from associating them with Allaah in any act of worship that should be done for Allaah alone, such as offering sacrifices, making vows, putting one's trust, prostrating and other actions which are due to Allaah and in which no one should be associated with Him, not any angel who is close to Him or any Prophet who was sent. This is the Message which was proclaimed by all the Messengers, from the first of them to the last of them, and this is the way of Ahl al-Sunnah wa'l-Jamaa'ah.''
The highlighted part is enough for us to identify the so-called scholar.
Najdi Al-Maloun also says:
''I hold a high position in my village and people listen to me. Some of the leaders denounced that because it goes against the customs they grew up with.''
The first sentence is the only reason people listened to him and the second sentence is a blind shot which appeared to him like a bulls-eye.
The so-called debate is NOT RECOMMENDED because it makes no sense at all.
Jazak Allah
and the last one was :
suhail raza
Senior Member
Posts: 393
Joined: 10/08/2006
Mashallah Brother tripple M . you have rightly justified the answer with your to the point quotations. If brother Umar feels that this is all stupidity then he should take a closer look at his Imaan and rectify himself.
then it was my turn so i replied :
Slam to all ,
First i am sorry that the it was painful to use the word" stupidies" to the first replier , actually i use in the sense of differences not blaming any sect I myself sunni and hanafi, alhumdullilah , how can i critisize my own school of thought .Secondly to the respectful MMM, brother , it is our imaan that only "prophets" are " masooms" , anyone else whether sahaba , tabai , taba tabi , wali , aulia , pious people and imams of shias are not "masoom".It is our belief.No doubt about that shiek abdul qadir jilani is the "imam" of aulias , the greatest of all walis and get highest in"taqwa" and "piety" but brother he was not " masoom" so there are chances of mistakes and sins , as nature of a human being.So it is strange to me that how we react
so much on this point !
Thirdly it is a point of common sense that a " shaheed" died once but in grave he remains alive as in Quran, similarly , prophet(peace be upon him) also died as when hazrat abu bakr(ra) said this to umar(ra) when taking his sword in his hand , he was shouting that " whoever will say Muhammad(ppeace be upon him) died , i will kill him" , then abu bakr(ra) replied that " whoever worship Muhammad(peace be upon him) , he should recognize that he has died , and who worship Allah , he should recognize that Allah will never lick the taste of death" but after that he is alive , see if shaeed can be alive , a prophet cannot be !!!!!!!!!!!! As far prophet is thousands of time higher than a shaheed and prophet like Muhammad(peace be upon him) , the " sardar" of all prophets !!!!!!!!!.So brother , point is that we should be too too touchy or allergic about that.They have Quranic verse that every creature has to die and this is true , afterwards what happens , it is ALLAh "qudrat" to whome He gives life like shaheed or prophets or aulia or anyone else , this is His right and kingdom, we have not to worry about it.Thirdly i want to say that Allah will ask from us on the day of judgement that how you offer prayer , namaz , roza , offer zakat , did hajj , helped poor , how you spent your youth , your old age , how you strive to spread islam ,how you fight against kufars , did you jihad against them , "huqooq -ul - ibad " the most .He will not ask us that , tell me whether you consider my prophet(peace be upon him) dead or alive and if you will not give the correct answer , i will put you to hell .Or neiher He will ask us whether Prophet(peace be upon him ) is noor or bashar , and giving wrong answer will lead you to hell, so brother , be calm and cool , these are minor thing , and insshallah they will not do any harm to our belief that " Allah is one and only , we worship him alone and Muhammad(peace be upon him) his last messenger and rasool" , This was what only taught by our beloved prophet(peace be upon him) and this is what only is asked on day of judgement.Inshallah.But we will use our whole of life on fighting on these worthless issues and drain our whole energies in this useless debate , not considering that poverty will lead to kufar as in hadees ,not consiering that a time will come when all other nations will fell upon you as some hungry fell on the meal as in hadees , but instead of fighting agaist these social , economical , socialogical,political and unity factors which our society in particular and muslim ummad in general are facing , we keep on fighting and dividing ourselves more and more.......................
And last thing brother are Abdul wahab or the aalim of the wahabi site(islam-qa) are 100% correct , no at all.No human being can be 100% right , if he is , the he has to be a rasool or nabi .The point is , why we keep on insistingthet a person should even be 100% right or 100% wrong !!!!!!!!!!!! Every human being , by its nature , have a tendecy of sin , faults and mistakes whether sahabas , tabai or aulias of Allah ,and they fell prey to them then why not abdul wahab or any other wahabi aalimis !!!!!!!!! why not shiekh abdul qadir jilani and others ,why not abu hanifa and imam shafi etc etc.
Brother , difference dosen't matter , is their no difference between imam shafi , ahmed bin hanbal , abu hanifa or malik.Did they ever fight on that or even said a harsh words to each other!!!!!!!!!!Difference is the essence of society , witout a difference , is a reasonable society can alive , if this happens , then this is a dum , deaf and blind society .Difference opens new paths and new ways of thinking as in hadees is diffeence of my ummah is "rahmat" but unfortunately we have made it"zahmat" by our own deeds and thinkings...................