ODI's losing their appeal?

I would not have posted it if Indian had lost because some of you might have accused me of sour grapes. But since India won :smiley: I will post it. I was thinking about it when I was watching this exciting first ODI on big screen with 100s of fans @NAZ cinemas in Fremont ,CA.

Recently I have noticed that scores of 300s have become very common, specially on subcontinent. One of the main reasons is the flat pitches that are being made obviously for marketing reasons. But I feel somehow its hurting cricket a lot. It not only makes mediocre players look like Viv Richard, it also hurt quality bowling. For me a good cricket match is one where there is even contest between ball and bat where bowlers too have some chance of showing their skills. Rules in cricket specially in ODIs are anyway heavily tilted towards batsmen and on top of it we provide them flat pitches. Slowly we would see teams think tank packing their team will 11 batsmen. They would think well our bowlers going to give 80/over anyway. Then why not play a batsmen .Let him bowl he cant do worst that that.

I already see teams scoring 300 runs in all ODI in this series. Why cant we make some sporting pitches where we would see some great bowling too?

Slowly, I am losing interest in ODIs.
I am desperately waiting for the test matches to start.

I know it’s hard to convince people with my thought after they just saw a great ODI match but still I thought I would share it.

I wouldn't write of ODIs that fast. Remember that's what brought excitement back to cricket after the spectacle of one result in every 100 test matches.

So what if the picth is flat - what happened to spinners? Nothing like a really talented spinner combining with a couple of hair trigger close in fielders. It is the fast paced pitches that drove teams to discourage spinners in favor of 4 and 5 pacers.

And on top of that, today's pacers seem to use speed too much and have no brains. They are more interested in making a show than engaging a smart batsman and building a ball vs bat duel.

Any ways

Will Irfan and VVS be back too?

Re: Have mercy on bowlers

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by fair_&_balance: *
I would not have posted it if Indian had lost because some of you might have accused me of sour grapes. But since India won :D I will post it. I was thinking about it when I was watching this exciting first ODI on big screen with 100s of fans @NAZ cinemas in Fremont ,CA.

Recently I have noticed that scores of 300s have become very common, specially on subcontinent. One of the main reasons is the flat pitches that are being made obviously for marketing reasons. But I feel somehow its hurting cricket a lot. It not only makes mediocre players look like Viv Richard, it also hurt quality bowling. For me a good cricket match is one where there is even contest between ball and bat where bowlers too have some chance of showing their skills. Rules in cricket specially in ODIs are anyway heavily tilted towards batsmen and on top of it we provide them flat pitches. Slowly we would see teams think tank packing their team will 11 batsmen. They would think well our bowlers going to give 80/over anyway. Then why not play a batsmen .Let him bowl he cant do worst that that.

I already see teams scoring 300 runs in all ODI in this series. Why cant we make some sporting pitches where we would see some great bowling too?

Slowly, I am losing interest in ODIs.
I am desperately waiting for the test matches to start.

I know it’s hard to convince people with my thought after they just saw a great ODI match but still I thought I would share it.
[/QUOTE]

wow..what a match., after pakistan lost 2 wickets i went to bed. losers like me deserve to miss such a match...inzi was the man though i still dont agree with his leading abilities but he played really really well...

but yarr i do agree with F&B. i mean what is going on.....330 plus used to be big score and when i say big i really mean it...hardly teams used to cross 300..... 270 used to be a big score...but now days it is so common....and F&B we have to be dead honest here...dont think i am against india but it is india whose bowling let the opposition score so many runs so frequently...i mean come on...india has now let the opposition cross 335 runs 5 times in exact one year....in one year....

first aus scored almost 350 against india in SA in world cup final, then again AUS scored above 335 against india in india and then again last month AUS scored almost 350 in the final and now the PAK A scored 335 in 46 overs and now pakistan has scored 344 against india....well pakis have also joined the race now and let india score 350......is there too much One day cricket going on and batters are really good... dont forget F&B, aus has scored 350 against india twice outside subcontinent on bouncy pitches but honestly i dont like seein matches in which so many runs being scored...it is killing cricket's standards

Excellent post f&b... exactly my thoughts...I think ODI's are quickly making specialists obsolete....and that is what concerns me a lot.

Technically mediocre batsmen who can clobber a few balls are today considered useful in a one-day side...fielding restrictions in the first 15 overs haven't exactly helped the bowlers' case also....

Look at the first ODI, this was not a battle between the bat and the ball but between bat and bat.

The bottom line is that rules of the ODIs today are tilted in the favor of the batsman. Adding to the bowlers' misery is the quality of the pitches in the subcontinent - like u pointed out.

The era of the batsman has arrived.

Welcome to the new world order.

Re: Re: Have mercy on bowlers

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by phoenixdesi: *

wow..what a match., after pakistan lost 2 wickets i went to bed. losers like me deserve to miss such a match...inzi was the man though i still dont agree with his leading abilities but he played really really well...

but yarr i do agree with F&B. i mean what is going on.....330 plus used to be big score and when i say big i really mean it...hardly teams used to cross 300..... 270 used to be a big score...but now days it is so common....and F&B we have to be dead honest here...dont think i am against india but it is india whose bowling let the opposition score so many runs so frequently...i mean come on...india has now let the opposition cross 335 runs 5 times in exact one year....in one year....

first aus scored almost 350 against india in SA in world cup final, then again AUS scored above 335 against india in india and then again last month AUS scored almost 350 in the final and now the PAK A scored 335 in 46 overs and now pakistan has scored 344 against india....well pakis have also joined the race now and let india score 350......is there too much One day cricket going on and batters are really good... dont forget F&B, aus has scored 350 against india twice outside subcontinent on bouncy pitches but honestly i dont like seein matches in which so many runs being scored...it is killing cricket's standards
[/QUOTE]

Pheonix...I agree some of the big scores were made against India.But you will see that scores of 300+ are very common against other teams too but not as frequents against it is against India.

Here is a list that I compiled.This list shows how many times 320+ were scored in each cricketing season.



2003/04 7
2003    1
2002/03 8
2002    3
2001/02 6
2000    1
1999/00 6
1999    2
1998/99 3
1997/98 1
1997    2
1996/97 2
1995/96 7
1993/94 1
1992    1
1989/90 2
1987/88 1
1984/85 1
1983/84 1
1983    4
1980    1
1975    3


You can see the frequency in last 4 years has gone up a lot. This contrast will be even more glaring if we look at scores of 300+.By theway half of the 2003-04 season is still left.

I totally agree with Srinath here.

**
The game is too batsman friendly
**

The Indians held the nerves in the final hour to make it a great victory in the first one-dayer against Pakistan in Karachi.

While I agree that all of us witnessed a great game of cricket, a few concerns about the actual role of the bowlers in the game is becoming increasingly evident. An imbalance has surely set in between the bat and ball. The game, at least its one-day version, appears so one-sided at times that I often heard people asking questions like “why didn’t he hit this ball for a six or at least for a four”?

The game has gone to a level where every ball should be played for runs. When a batsman misses the ball, everyone around feels that the batsman was unlucky not to have hit the ball.

The flat wickets have badly infected the one-day format and the bowling fraternity in large. The rules of the game have only added to the woes of the bowlers. The red normal cricket balls played in the day games can still bring some respite to the bowlers. But, at present, the game has become more colourful with the white balls virtually replacing the bowler-friendly red balls.

Replacing the white ball in the midst of a game at the behest of batmen is a ridiculous rule. The bowlers’ art is to maintain a good shine on the ball to achieve the desired movement and deceive and challenge the skills of the batsmen. It’s a common sight to see the batsmen seeking change of balls when the ball starts doing reverse swing. The reason for the change of ball is supposedly the poor colour of the ball. The bowlers, having worked on the ball all the while, remain hapless spectators when the umpires change the ball. It makes the bowlers clueless, especially at the crucial juncture of the game.

It would have been a world record had the Pakistanis managed to chase 350 runs successfully. Now the Indian team must be wondering what should be a real good score to be on the safer side.

Batting dominated the game no doubt, but at the end it was our bowlers who won the match. The Pakistani bowlers were again up to intimidation and were guilty of giving away too many wides, no balls and short pitched deliveries. It is hardly possible for a team to win a game in which it has thrown away so many extras. Pakistan’s intimidation policy not only made them bowl all over the place but gave enough opportunity to our batsmen to pounce on it.

In contrast, our new ball bowlers were excellent as they stuck to the basic discipline of bowling in the right areas. Balaji has understood the line with the new ball very well and was rightly chosen by the skipper to open the attack. In such tall scoring games, it is important to have initial tight spells with the new ball as that sets the tone for the opponents. Balaji has good slower deliveries, which he has not used effectively. Once that is sorted out, he could be the best bowler in the side.

The last over bowled by Ashish Nehra must have done a world of good to his confidence. Zaheer Khan and Ashish didn’t appear to be at their best .I hope both get better as the tour progresses.

Inzamam-ul Haq was little too worried about the Indian batting. The reason for opting to bowl first baffled many of us. Although Pakistan came close enough to steal the game, it’s the pressure that undid their batsmen.

Miandad played his innings quite well from the dressing room, but it wasn’t good enough for Pakistan to win. Ganguly’s imaginative captaincy paid off in bringing Murali Kartik into the attack at a very crucial stage.

Inzy was too eager to capitulate the spinner, which only cost him his own wicket. So was Yousuf Youhana, who underestimated the change that was brought about when Sehwag was introduced.

Kaif was spectacular and so were others. Kaif has reminded all about his value to the team time and again and it was no different in Karachi on Saturday. His fielding ability instantly lifts the spirits of the bowlers. He did contribute to the team in saving at the least 30 runs.

I am sure that all of us will be watching many more such close encounters in the coming games.

No spinners and just speed

I totally agree with DMD. There is far too much emphasis on speed and none on spinners. Reading all the posts here and other sites, one would think Pakistan had just one bowler (i.e. Akhtar) Shoaib A. is a great bowler but the game needs spinners too.

Yes, the game has become far too batsman friendly and that has to reflect in the quality of bowlers that are going to be produced. There is potential for total destruction of the game that we all love, when you have crappy bowlers and batsmen who therefore pass for good.

Just bringing this topic back because of these comments by Chappel.
http://htcricket.com/htcricket/14_746139.htm
**
Bowlers are ‘forgotten people’ in one-day cricket: Chappell**
Associated Press
Lahore, May 10

As batsmen pile on the runs in one-day international matches, bowlers are becoming the “forgotten people” of cricket, former Australian Test captain Greg Chappell said on Monday.

“If someone believes you have to have 300 runs in every game at the expense of bowlers, it is damaging for cricket,” Chappell told reporters on the sidelines of an international cricket seminar.

“Cricket is a contest. The closer the contest between the bat and the ball, the better the cricket. If somebody has decided it’s not good for television and spectators, it is going to have a negative impact,” said Chappell, who played 87 Tests and 74 one-day internationals for Australia.

Only in March this year, the five-match one-day series between arch-rivals Pakistan and India was dominated by batsmen with almost 700 runs scored in the first game at Karachi’s National Stadium.

“Wickets around the world are becoming more batting friendly and bowlers have become forgotten people in cricket. I think it’s a dangerous trend which needs to be reversed sooner rather than later,” Chappell said.

Chappell said he wants the game’s world governing body — the International Cricket Council — to create an enjoyable environment where players can learn.

“We learn under creative, enjoyable environments where we have fun. Taking cricket coaching into the class room is not a good thing to do,” he said.

Australia is currently on top of the world rankings — both in one-day and Test matches — because of the aggressive and positive attitude of its players, Chappell said.

“We breed aggressive, positive players with the desire to be successful which is a very important part for any development program. In many development programs (in other countries) it has not been addressed properly.”

Goopd post F&B i lost my interest in ODI cricket during 1996 WC and since then i have never watched ODi with same interest as i watch Test matches, ODI mathces have become so boring and batsm,an friendly that i'd not be surprise that if they have bowling machines instaed of bowlers in 20 years from now.

F&B you are right, the game has become batsmen friendly but isnt that what the public want or demand. The ODI's around the world are played to packed stadiums and I think that indicates the popularity of the game. Having said that, a better contest between the ball and the bat is still possible if some of the field restrictions are lifted.

One other point the WC final in 1999 when Australia bundled Pakistan out for 123 is remembered as a boring final rather than for the brilliance of the Aussie bowlers. While the last WC final is remembered for the 350 plus the Aussies made. Soemthing amongst the cricket fans which makes them appreciate the batting more than the bowling. At the end of the day the game will respond to what the people want.

I for one, dont mind the big hitting and I think the Karachi ODI was one of the best.

Re: ODI's losing their appeal?

Time or bring back this thread again.

Re: ODI's losing their appeal?

i hate these 300 plus exagerated odi scores, simply as a cricket fan i hate it! the game is far too batsman friendly, the cricket played in england is real cricket. Something in it for both the bowlers and batsmen! 99 wc was awesome! nAT West challenge every year is exciting!!

Re: ODI's losing their appeal?

ODI are certainly on the decline, ever since they gave this new sexy look to the test cricket.

Re: ODI's losing their appeal?

^ I don't know which world you people live in or which matches you watch. Every ODI around the world is virtually played to full stadiums. Even in Peshawar the tickets were sold out days ago. So much for decline and losing their appeal.

Re: ODI's losing their appeal?

sour grapes :D

Re: ODI's losing their appeal?

You are probably right. May be ODI is getting popular among young and new cricket fans. But I have talked to so many long time cricket fan and most of them seems to be pissed at uneven contest between bat and ball. It is becoming boring. I think even the new fans will start noticing soon.

Re: ODI's losing their appeal?

I agree with f&b that its quite an uneven contest these days b/w bat and ball. With bat dominating around 65% of time and Ball around 35% (these are my own numbers) and I'd love to bring bat domination down to around 55%!!!!

Re: ODI’s losing their appeal?

Pls stop hanging out with budha babas. Twenty20 is the wave of the future :yahoo: which means more *chakkay *and chokay, and bowlers with fittay mouN.

Re: ODI's losing their appeal?

in subcotinent is actually 80-20... :D
Though you estimate of 55% is correct.