Yo Shah Jahan, are you ** nervously ** trying to avoid Ibrahim’s post ??
Also, your other posts are enough proof for any wise person to learn how much hatred you’ve for Islam and mainstream Muslims.
[quote]
Originally posted by secret_obsession:
no, i was just saying that translations by sunni muslims ** can have** errors too.
[/quote]
Ibrahim says: Salaams To all
Dear sister secret_obsession,
what errors have you found in the English translations made by others ( there is no such thing as sunni in my perspective) and why did you not warn Muslims concerning it? I know you are now saying, it can have, but that is an error to say such things when you have not witnessed any. Can have and have are not the same!
Mind you I am talking about errors but ** omission,** (which is very serious, compared to choice of words that are inaccurate/misleading) ** did you find any other translation of the Qur’an with an omission like I have mentioned above?? **
** so basically you are saying its faith.
[/quote]
Ibrahim says: how would the Qur’an and the records left by those present with the Prophet (pbuh) as well as records of past scriptures and their prophetic teachings be just a matter of faith?
My faith is based on revealed matters which I have studied myself and contemplated over a period of time, not on blind faith or what others said.
[quote]
common sense always speaks too late <<
so not agreeing you mean one lacks it.
[/quote]
Ibrahim says : hmm, you snipped other questions which were directly addressed to you but chose to touch on this which was written after my reply to you. So I guess you cannot even understand what was being conveyed to those ( shia and ahmadias) who were trying to mock this thread.
Anyway it seems you still not understand what I am saying?
Here read and digest this hadith and compare my warning conveyed in this thread to all Muslims, concerning the defects of this translation with the hadith below , I repeat, would my actions benefit Muslims and Non Muslims or not?
Sahih Muslim Hadith Hadith 6343 Narrated by Abu Barzah
I said: Allah's Apostle (peace be upon him) teach me something so that I may derive benefit from it. ** He said: Remove the troublesome thing from the paths of the Muslims.**
Instead of understanding what I am trying to do, you accused me of causing divisions which are already inherent,. Hence maybe now I need to ask you, have you been using your common sense or did you out of haste react unjustly?
May Allah (swt) guide you to understand better.
Was salaam
Ibrahim
** Measure twice cut once **
Oh Yes khoon I just hate all muslims and their twisted kind! They are the scumm of the earth and may my hypocricy be shown someday!
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I hate set out to destroy the greatest faith ever and to top it off, I am an ignorant shia and damm proud!
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Seriously khoon, If people began to belive people like you,. I doubt there would be any shias left on the face of the earth. Your lies against muslims will lead you to hell khoon, just remember that. Your types have hurt our sincerity and unity alot and we take the beating without complain. I dont care what you think of me. I know I am with the truth and the faith of the almighty allah grows day by day in my chest. I care what allah thinks about me and nothing else!
As for Ibrahim’s guided’ sayings. I have somethings to say:
- Anyone can make a mistake. Why not a shia?
- How can you truly be sure that all this isnt some trick to blame shias?
- Never take what is given to you without checking if it safe…
- even if the man had the intent of doing all what Ibrahim said do you think all shias will follow him? We have over 20 differnt transalations of quran by Shias and one gone wrong doesnt mean a thing. As I said, numerous things could have happend during transalation and the arabic hasnt changed one bit!
Khoon, I love ya too man!
brother ibrahim don’t consider yourself as a pious angel.. nor act like as if you are a God, or as God has made you guardian for others.
vis-à-vis, as for the topic, bring some more references from other shia translations or at least double check the original book form of the Shakir's translation. Also verify if Shakir belong to Shi'ite sect. Than come and debate with the respective crowd.
PS: my sincere suggestion to you is, if you want to debate on some religious matter, for which you see the difference or contradiction or human manipulation or something that conflicts your beliefs, say it in a politer way without hurting anyone... keep your fingers down.
thats all from my side.
chao !
[This message has been edited by raaj-dulara (edited May 22, 2002).]
dear Ibrahim brother AOA,
I respect your knowledge and quest for knowledge to support your faith and theology.
I was wandering and perplexed that being you a righteous muslim who fears from Allah and writes as per Quran and sunnah, you did not answer my questions in the post I specifically adressed to you in the religious forum. Now do’nt give me a lame excuse that i did not look on it.If you think you r on right then why to be afraid to comment on what I asked.
Remember Fear is incomplete knowledge.
[quote]
Originally posted by raaj-dulara:
*brother ibrahim don’t consider yourself as a pious angel.. nor act like as if you are a God, or as God has made you guardian for others. *
[/quote]
He never did. Stop blaming him for imaginary things.
[quote]
**
vis-à-vis, as for the topic, bring some more references from other shia translations or at least double check the original book form of the Shakir's translation. Also verify if Shakir belong to Shi'ite sect. Than come and debate with the respective crowd. **
[/quote]
He has given references to a few websites, that carry his translation. Are you implying ** it's all a coincidence that he has manipulated the verses that suit the Shiite agenda ??? **
Let's assume Shakir is not Shiite. But the ** Shiites are very fond of using his translation. THAT'S WHAT WE ARE CONCERNED WITH. ** That the Shiites twist and manipulate the Qur'an according to their whims.
Besides, try to be a little more civilised ** raaj-dulaara ** . Or else, you are best ignored.
[This message has been edited by Khoon-e-Shaheed (edited May 22, 2002).]
[quote]
Originally posted by mm10:
I was wandering and perplexed that being you a righteous muslim who fears from Allah and writes as per Quran and sunnah, you did not answer my questions in the post I specifically adressed to you in the religious forum.
[/quote]
Ibrahim says: Wa Alaikum sa laam wa Rahmathulla
Dear Brother mm10,
As far as I can see your thread was addressed to all Muslims with two names in particular that being myself and Brother Fact Finder for which Brother Fact Finder responded before I even read that thread and you replied after that, that thread went dead. I did not see any reason for me to respond since what Brother Fact Finder who is more eloquent then me, wrote was perfect and I can add nothing more.
So kindly do not accuse me of neglecting you, and your reply to him, had nothing in it that opposed his views or anything that that would keep that thread alive.
Was salaam
Ibrahim
** your reputation s not raised by lowering others **
**
Ya Allah, please forgive my sins and please save me from the fire and hell and please let me in your Paradise and please be very lenient with me while taking my account because of what this person has said about me. Aameen. Thumma Aameen Ya Arham-ar-Raahimeen. **
Using taqiyah to overturn the tables ???
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Ulta hi chor kotwaal ko daantay ???
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I don’t attack the Shias just because they are Shias (I actually preferred the Yemeni Zaidi Shias over the Rafidi Shias) but I attack them because of their corrupted beliefs and ** because of their HATRED for Islam and Mainstream Muslims. **
Again playing the ** “VICTIMHOOD GAME” ** like the ** JEWS ** ???
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The Jews kill the Muslims in Palestine, and then they claim they are the victims !!!
I wonder why the ** Shias resemble the Jews so much !!! **
** Is it because, the * FOUNDER * of SHIISM, Abdullah bin Saba, was an ex-JEW ??? **
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**
But, are you implying that it is all a ** coincidence ** that the verses that he chose to ** twist or delete or manipulate ** were those verses that ** went against the Shiite agenda ?? **
Are you saying that it was ** * JUST * a mistake ?? ** There was no ** conscious effort ** to twist the Qur’an to conform to the Shiite agenda ???
**
Sickening level of taqiyah !!! If it’s a trick to blame the Shias, ** then WHY ARE THE SHIAS SOOOOO FOND OF USING SHAKIR’S TRANSLATION ??? WHY DO THE SHIA SCHOLARS LOVE HIS TRANSLATION SO MUCH ??? **
**
He has given a few links to websites that carry his translation. If it’s all a coincidence that they have the ** same mistake **, I do not know what to say !!!
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When My servants ask thee concerning Me, ** I am indeed close (to them): I listen to the prayer of every suppliant when he calleth on Me: ** Let them also, with a will, Listen to My call, and believe in Me: That they may walk in the right way. (Holy Qur’an 2:186)
[This message has been edited by Khoon-e-Shaheed (edited May 22, 2002).]
I have been to several of our own ahl-sunnat sites and they also carry the same SHAKIR translation.
Why are you blaming the shias, when it was I who posted the ayat from Shakir. I am not shia so desist from attacking them and focus your rhetoric on myself.
Has Islam not taught you to leave the innocent alone ?
[quote]
Originally posted by Gandalf:
** I have been to several of our own ahl-sunnat sites and they also carry the same SHAKIR translation.**
[/quote]
Yes, some Mainstream Muslim sites do carry his translation, but that is presumably because they have been deceived by the Shias and their taqiyah and so they included it.
** Muslims by nature are naiive and unsuspecting. Since they are very tolerant and accomodating, they think the Kafirs are also tolerant, accomodating and broadminded. **
Look at the posts of people like ** secret_obsession ** and others. She does not realize the threat faced by Islam from the Shias.
The Kafirs have traditionally taken advantage of this unsuspecting attitude of the Muslims to ** stab them from the back. **
There are enough examples of the Jews, Christians, Hindus, Shias etc. in history to prove it.
When My servants ask thee concerning Me, ** I am indeed close (to them): I listen to the prayer of every suppliant when he calleth on Me: ** Let them also, with a will, Listen to My call, and believe in Me: That they may walk in the right way. (Holy Qur'an 2:186)
[quote]
Originally posted by Gandalf:
** Why are you blaming the shias, **
[/quote]
Because the Shias are very fond of using his translation, and the Shia scholars seem to love his translation.
When My servants ask thee concerning Me, ** I am indeed close (to them): I listen to the prayer of every suppliant when he calleth on Me: ** Let them also, with a will, Listen to My call, and believe in Me: That they may walk in the right way. (Holy Qur'an 2:186)
[quote]
Originally posted by Gandalf:
** Has Islam not taught you to leave the innocent alone ?**
[/quote]
Now, this is how the Kafirs speak to ** taunt ** the Muslims and make fun of Islam.
Why are you taunting Islam now? Is it because as a Shia, you hate Islam and Mainstream Muslims ?
Oh PULLLLLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEZZZZ ** Gandalf **
Do you think we are thAAAAAAt stupid ???
Taqiyah (“Holy Hypocrisy” , which is ** mandated ** by the Imami Ithna 'Ashari Ja’fari Shi’a religion) is not always invisible !