NYahmadi i have many questions!

Society Religion & Philosophy
1

Dear Nyahmadi,
Your wrote "My question is, can we accurately apply the term “Prophet” to everyone who has been mentioned in Divine books? The answer is Only in an informal sense, because most Prophets did not “proclaim” that they were Prophets of God, but people insisted that they were. The first authentic Jewish prophet was Moses. The last was Malachi. Moses is often compared with Aaron, his older brother by three years. According to ancient accounts, when Moses died, only the men mourned for him. However, when Aaron died, both the men and the women grieved for him. The reason is that Moses was respected, but Aaron was loved. Both considered Prophets, Why?

Initially, they didn’t want to be prophets. Their role was involuntarily thrust upon them and they tried to dodge it. Even Moses, at first, gave a number of alibis. Among them, he said that he had a speech defect, that he was inarticulate. Later, Isaiah answered the call by declaring that he was unworthy. He called himself a man of unclean lips who was living among a people of unclean lips. Yet, people accepted none of their excuses and forced all of them to don the mantle of prophecy.

The most socially conscious prophets, after Moses, lived in the 7th and 8th centuries BC. Occupying this prophetic pantheon are names like Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, Amos, Micah, and Hosea. They were the solitary, lonely men, driven to speak out, (in God’s name, according to Divine Books), against the inequities, the injustices, and the idolatries of their day.

In conclusion, they were all good and humble people, and the term “Prophet” was pretty much forced on them by the people. One more thing, most of the biblical prophets spent a good deal of their time caring for animals and less with people.

One more thing, each Western Religion classifies “Prophet” differently. For example, Jesus is not considered a “Prophet in a Formal Sense by Jews” and only in an informal sense, because he came 400 years after the “Period of Prophecy”. Which Makes Mohammad also an informal prophet. But Muslims have different way of classifying a Prophet.

If you want to know more about my views, don’t be hesitant to ask. "

But before all this you also stated “(Please note that I have read about prophets more from History Books and less from Divine Books).”

So please answers some questions, i will ask them one by one.

QUESTION # 1
Do you believe in Devine books?(Quran-E-Majeed and etc)

2

This will be a long post, brace your selves its coming.

Jaawan

Till next time**Keep_It_Simple_Stupid**©

3

How one can evaluate if one is a divine book or not?

4

Dear Masooma, Not any more than I believe in Romeo and Juliet by Shakespeare. What is there to believe or not in Books? Books are meant for reading. It is not important if one believes in them or not.

Let me ask you a question in return. What if there are contradiction is Divine Books? Which one will you consider the most authentic? In my next reply, I shall post a few quotes from recently discovered material in Israel, the Dead Sea Scrolls. It makes one re-evaluate and re-examine Western Religions in a new light.

Masooma your question is very Masoom, if your belief dictates you that you must believe in Divine Books and Prophets, that is fine and there is nothing wrong with that. But questioning others who may not think like that is very wrong (in my opinion).

Next question.

Jawan, was that long enough for you?

5

NYAhmadi....>>Masooma your question is very Masoom, if your belief dictates you that you must believe in Divine Books and Prophets, that is fine and there is nothing wrong with that. But questioning others who may not think like that is very wrong (in my opinion).

Next question<<

First it is pathetic that you compare Qura~n with that of "Romeo and Juliet'. You dont find anything valueable in it either. You are challenging Allah who says:

[4:82] Why do they not study the Quran carefully? If it were from other than GOD, they would have found in it numerous contradictions.

Surely you are free to believe or disbelieve anything. There is no one here to slit your throat. You remind me of Iqbal's sheyr

do rangi chhor day yak rang ho ja
sarasar moum ya sarasar sang ho ja

If you leave messages on public forume, you must be prepared to undergo secrutiny. Just like the freedom, which grant you to utter nonsense, affords others to get to the truth.

6

Surely you are free to believe or disbelieve anything<<<

really? i didnt know that.

7

Dear Masooma, Nowhere in my reply did I suggest that I don’t believe in Quran. Baykhatr twisted my words to make it appear as such. Because he lacks the smarts to catalog arguments.

What I meant was that “what’s a rule to ensure that one believes in a book or not”. How can, by saying, that “I believe” will actually mean that “I believe”. Since there are so many contradictions among Divine Texts, that it becomes pretty confusing to sort out details. Quran is a set of guidelines (in my opinion) with references to biblical prophecies and stories, so to me it is a History Book combined with principals seemed to invigorate thinking. But that does not mean that it should be out of scope to challenge what is in it. But that is my opinion.

8

Typical BS response from you Ahmadi.
Good job on the ambigious language.
I am really bored right now care to fight on the net.
If not...here is my answer to your question question:
NYA Romeo and Julliet was a fairy tale.
The Quran as you said is a book based on Fact and history.
So it must be taken as the main source of information.
The must is if you are a muslim.
The same applies to the Bible and Torah.
Contradictions in divine books - please explain.
And if you want to fight i am spoiling for one.

9

CM, do you have any clue as to what you are talking about? Why do you want me to tell you the contradictions found in the “holy” books. Why can’t you look it up for yourself? Can’t read? Go fight with your buddies, I don't like fighting. Making fun of you is amusement enough for me.

10

The typical double-speak (or treble-speak?) of a heretic:-

" Dear Masooma, Nowhere in my reply did I suggest that I don’t believe in Quran…"

Well here’s the proof (HE SAID):-

  • " Dear Masooma, Not any more than I believe in Romeo and Juliet by Shakespeare What is there to believe or not in Books? Books are meant for reading. It is not important if one believes in them or not".

AND:-

  • “…if your belief dictates you that you must believe in Divine Books and Prophets, that is fine and there is nothing wrong with that. But questioning others who may not think like that is very wrong (in my opinion)”

AND:-

  • “Quran is a set of guidelines (in my opinion) with references to biblical prophecies and stories, so to me it is a History Book combined with principals seemed to invigorate thinking. But that does not mean that it should be out of scope to challenge what is in it. But that is my opinion.”

NOT MUCH BELIEF IN THE QURAN MAJEED THERE I’M AFRAID!

Masooma you must understand this about this person:-

  1. He calls himself Ahmadi.
  2. BUT he has said he is an atheist.
  3. AND DESPITE THIS DEFENDS THE RELIGOUS RIGHTS/“DESTINY”/HISTORY OF JEWS NOT MUSLIMS?

ROMEO AND JULIET! - LOL!

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/biggrin.gif

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/biggrin.gif

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/biggrin.gif

11

Malik, what in these quotes suggests that I believe (or don’t believe)? Do you have comprehension problems as well? Keep your racist and anti-Semitic stupidity to yourself; we can do without that.

On the other hand, it is good that you quoted from my post, because reading your writing gives me a terrible headache.

Read a book by Henson Clegerman (it is in French) and see the contradictions within “Holy” texts. Thou shall not kill, an eye for an eye?

What has my name (Ahmadi) got to do with any of this discussion? You are as dumb as they come.

12

Asalam-u-Alaikum
WOHO!! so many replies, i wasn't expecting this but thank you everyone who participated.

Dear NYahmadi,
On one hand you do say that you read historical books, and from what you write it is very well understood that you do believe that these personalities existed?am i right?Well if you do believe in their existense then whats wrong in believing in the messege they dilivered.OK fine, i know you have complete right to agree or disagree, but when you do believe in their existense, it is very obvious that their messege is TRUE as well, because if you go in depth, all prophets gave the same messege to the people. If it was only one prophet saying, there is only one God, but rest saying there are two god's, then they may have been wrong, but now as you know, they ALL gave the same messege! There was no difference in their teachings.
I'm a muslim, so i read Quran more than anyother historical book, you stated that these men were not prophets but only good men, but in Quran, Allah addressed all these messengers as prophets, i.e Allah says:
Surah Maryam 51-53
"And mention in this BOOK MOSES: he was a chosen person, and a Messenger Prophet........"
54-55
"And make a mention in this Book of Ishmael: he was true to promise and was a Messenger Prophet......."

If they were just good men, Allah wouldn't have used such vocabulary to address them.
Dear NYAHMADI, i hope you do know that by refusing to accept Quran as the revealed word of God, you are doubting the existense of Allah?(Na-azubillah)

So i'll be waiting for a reply

Masooma

13

Malik you are Hilarious…. I am still laUghinGz,
(btw 73 is your date of year of birth, right?)

NYA yaar aap bhi kya cheez ho. I wish I could write like you. amazing personality.

14

Instead of answering Masooma’s questions this guy continues his long-held policy of insults. e.g:-

  • To Bakhtyar he said “… he lacks the smarts to catalog arguments.”

  • To CM he said " Making fun of you is amusement enough for me."

WELL AHMADI TOUCHE MON AMIE!! - DROP THE INSULTS AND ANSWER MASOOMA’S QUESTIONS?

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/biggrin.gif

P.S. Zalim - yes my DOB is 1973 - I’m not as secretive and scheming as some people we know?

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smile.gif

[This message has been edited by Malik73 (edited July 03, 2000).]

15

Malik, they started writing their nonsense without even trying to understand what is being discussed. You want me to praise them? Have you ever suggested to them (or to yourself) to respect alternative thinking? You are quick to jump on the band wagon yourself.

There is no need to keep cutting and repeating my words. Everyone here is sensible enough to figure out for him/herself, give them some credit. They don’t need your interpretation of my words. Grow up a little.

The book I suggested, get a copy of it.

16

Dear nyAhmai, i asked you something.
where is the answer, please reply but first read my post above!

Masooma

17

Dear Masooma, I thought I answered it. Well, here it is again.

I believe in Quran as much as I will believe in any other book. I believe tht Quran is a Holy Book for muslims. I also believe that Torah and the New Testiments are Holy Books for Jews and Christians.

When you say, “believe” what exactly is that you are asking?

18

Say hello to the Mr. Clinton of the board.
NYA is the new pres.
Define believe!!!
HAHAHAHAHHA
Next you will be asking for the definition of Stupid!!!
Look at self in the mirror for the answer.
Hey its not original but i does do the job.
As for manking fun of me - again one of your delusions!!!
Want to replay your pathetic attempt to compare Jews in the US and Alawites in Syria??

19

When a muslim says that he "believes" in the Qur'an, part of that belief dictates that you believe the Qur'an is a revelation from Allah, it has no contradictions in it whatsoever. As for the people who don't want to believe in this, then that's your choice but don't call yourselves muslims.

The previous holy texts that were revealed, have been changed by their followers i.e. jews and christians. This is why they have contradictions. They have also been abrogated and their replacement is the Qur'an.

As for the French book that was mentioned, regarding the contradictions in the Qur'an then they may seem contradictions to people who have very little knowledge and understanding of the religion. But all these and other so-called contradictions have been refuted and made clear by the scholars and callers of Islaam.

You see the reason why these stories of Prophets have been mentioned is to warn the people, about what actually happened to the disobedient people in the past, i.e. those who disobeyed their Prophets, those who had doubts in their Lord, those who disbelieved in Him, so that we don't fall into the same error.

20

CM, man you make my work very easy. I don’t have to make fun of you, you do enough of that to yourself, and you leave very little room for my patterned imagination, unlike your buddy Malik. He does challenge my fancy, more than I care for. His problem is that he cuts and paste everything that I say, 3 or 4 times, you on the other hand get yourself into lion’s fundamental. You didn't even know who Alawites were only a week ago, and now you think of yourself as an expert. You are an internet idiot. Your buddy is just plain.