No Mr Putin!

POETIC LICENCE: No, Mr Putin
http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=story_4-12-2002_pg3_7
Kaleem Omar

“Let’s fight it out face-to-face. We have fought thrice, let there be a fourth war,” said Advani, sounding like a South Asian version of George W. Bush. But then, this is the same Advani who instigated the Hindu mob that demolished the Babri Masjid in 1992

No, Mr Putin, contrary to the fears reportedly expressed by you in an interview to two Indian journalists at your Kremlin residence on Saturday on the eve of your visit to India, Pakistan is not in the business of supplying nukes to “bandits and terrorists,” or to anybody else for that matter.

Pakistan’s nuclear weapons are meant solely for its own defence, and then, too, more as the deterrence of last resort against Indian military adventurism than by way of being weapons whose use would ever actually be contemplated. The same goes for India’s nuclear weapons. The two countries are not mad. They know only too well what the consequences of a nuclear war would be.

It is another matter that some loose-cannon Indian leaders sound quite mad sometimes. We saw this back in April 1998 when Indian Defence Minister George Fernandes said, apropos of nothing, that China was India’s “Enemy No. 1” — a totally irresponsible statement to which Beijing rightly took strong exception. And we saw this again on Saturday (the same day as Mr Putin’s interview) when Indian Deputy Prime Minister L. K. Advani challenged Pakistan to another war over Kashmir.

“Let’s fight it out face-to-face. We have fought thrice, let there be a fourth war,” said Advani, sounding like a South Asian version of George W. Bush. But then, this is the same Advani who instigated the Hindu mob that demolished the Babri Masjid in 1992.

We have this on the authority of Advani’s own daughter-in-law, Gauri Advani, who alleged before India’s Liberhan Commission of Inquiry in January this year that her father-in-law had conspired with Bharitya Janata Party (BJP) leader Vinay Katiyar to demolish the Babri Masjid.

Her allegation came while Advani, a BJP hardliner, was in Washington for talks with Bush administration officials about the India-Pakistan military standoff, a crisis triggered by India last December when it moved several hundred thousand troops to frontline positions on its border with Pakistan.

In a 10-page application filed before the Liberhan Commission on January 12, 2002, Gauri claimed she was present at a meeting between Advani and Katiyar in Varanasi on December 1, 1992 when they discussed plans for the Babri demolition.

In her application, Gauri, a lawyer by profession and now a practicing solicitor in London, decried Advani’s statement before the commission that he was “anguished by the Babri demolition” and had “nothing to do with it.” She said his statement was nothing but a bundle of lies based upon concocted and false facts.

Gauri, who married Advani’s son, Jayant, in October 1991, was Advani’s special assistant from November 1989 till her marriage to Jayant.

Gauri said, in her application before the Liberhan Commission, that as Advani’s special assistant, she had looked after his New Delhi constituency from where he contested and won election to the Lok Sabha, the Indian Lower House of Parliament. Gauri said that at that time, she had “deep faith” in the ideology that Advani used to propagate, and believed whatever he told her as being “the gospel truth.”

Gauri pointed out that on or around November 28, 1991 (a year before the demolition of the Babri Masjid) an application was moved in the Indian Supreme Court seeking permission to carry out a symbolic “kar seva” in Ayodhya, the site of the Babri Masjid.

The application was still pending a year later when Advani, anticipating favourable orders from the Court, decided to start another “rath yatra” from Varanasi to mobilise “kar sevaks,” Gauri said. She said that she and Advani’s wife, Kamala, accompanied Advani to Lucknow on the morning of November 30, 1992, en route to Varanasi by the North East Express train from Delhi.

Gauri said: “Before the start of the rath yatra (on December 1, 1992), Shri Vinay Katiyar came to meet Shri L. K. Advani. The applicant (Gauri) was also present in this meeting. It was in this meeting that Shri L. K. Advani and Shri Vinay Katiyar, in the presence of the applicant, conspired to demolish the Babri Masjid. Shri L. K. Advani told Shri Vinay Katiyar that the ultimate aim of the rath yatra is not only to do kar seva and appease Hindu sentiment but also to garner votes and come to power at the Centre.”

In her application, Gauri alleged that Advani told Katiyar that “the movement to build the Ram temple” at the site of the Babri Masjid had “to be taken to its logical end, that is, coming to power at the Centre,” and that this would “not be possible without demolishing the Babri Masjid” as only that would “unite the Hindu vote bank in favour of the BJP.”

Gauri added: “The applicant (Gauri) remembers that Shri L. K. Advani said, ‘Kya Babri Masjid ka kalank nahin mit sakta?’ Shri Vinay Katiyar looked at the applicant and then said to Shri L. K. Advani, ‘Hum to aapke aadesh ka itizar kar rahen hain aur agar aap bole to masjid ka namo-nishan mita de.’ Shri L. K. Advani at that time smiled and then said, ‘To intizaar kis bat ka? Kaam kar do’.”

Gauri said she was not surprised at Advani’s venomous outpourings as “even at home, Advani family members used to say that the kar seva in Ayodhya would not remain restricted to bhajan or kirtan.” She said: “It was the common refrain during discussions at home that the BJP could only come to power by playing the religion card.”

Gauri said that when Advani came home after the demolition of the Babri Masjid, she had asked him what had happened. She said he exulted and replied: “Jo karne gaye the, wok kar aye.” She said that Advani “expressed his happiness over the demolition.”

This is the man that Indian Prime Minister Atal Bihari Vajpayee has chosen to make his Deputy Prime Minister. There can be no more telling comment on the sorry state of the BJP’s Hindutva brand of politics.

In her application before the Liberhan Commission of Inquiry on January 12, 2002, Advani’s daughter-in-law, Gauri Advani, said: “L. K. Advani told Vinay Katiyar (at their meeting on December 1, 1992) that the right opportunity to demolish the the Babri Masjid had come, and that since a large number of kar sevaks would be congregating in Ayodhya for kar seva, the demolition could easily be done.”

This is a response to Russian President Vladimir (the butcher of Chechnya's recent comments)

Some logic. :rolleyes:

Connecting Putin and Babri Masjid. :hehe: :biggthumb

I think this is Mr Putin's political rhetoric to pitch the sale of 10 billion dollar arms including N-submarines to India.

If he was to sell something to Pakistan, he could have done the same thing like Indian nukes can fall into the hands of bandits and terrorists.

He is trying to make an Indo-Russo-Sino axis while trying to sell arms to both countries.

Notice, many countries including the US and Britian are selling arms to India and Pakistan while both countries forces are facing each other on the border. Same time, they are also preaching to make peace.

They all think we are fools. Are we fools...lol

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Zabardast: *
I think this is Mr Putin's political rhetoric to pitch the sale of 10 billion dollar arms including N-submarines to India.

If he was to sell something to Pakistan, he could have done the same thing like Indian nukes can fall into the hands of bandits and terrorists.

[/QUOTE]

India doesn;t have US special ops troops who know where each missile is in Pakistan. In case of any islamic takeover of gov't...say bye bye to the nukes.

CH so you are saying that the NSA and CIA dunn know anything about Indian arms? :)

Fraud: India doesn't have US special ops forces on ground. And FBI and CIA teams roaming the country.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Chaltahai: *

India doesn;t have US special ops troops who know where each missile is in Pakistan. In case of any islamic takeover of gov't...say bye bye to the nukes.
[/QUOTE]

Is the US afraid of Pakistan's few nuclear warheads while the US itself has some 6.000? Xenophobia? :)

PS: The US is extremely sure that one day it will be attacked by nukes because they already have used 2 times. You cannot get away from a crime without paying it back. Could you? :)

Most major terrorist events in the world are done by Islamic terrorists.

Most Islamic terrorists have connection in Pakistan thru the madrassa system.

So it is logical that Putin make that statement.

You don't see Hindu terorrists or Christians fly planes into buildings in the name of relegion do you?

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Talwar: *
Most major terrorist events in the world are done by Islamic terrorists.

You don't see Hindu terorrists or Christians fly planes into buildings in the name of relegion do you?
[/QUOTE]

nope we do see the hindu mobs killing thousands of ppl, death toll kinda equals what happned at WTC, but oops thats india's internal affair ..

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Talwar: *

So it is logical that Putin make that statement.

[/QUOTE]

The lost soviet nuclear material and suitcase nuclear devices are probably a bigger issue. Maybe Puto should find those first. That would be logical too.

chances of Old Soviet stuff falling into the hands of the wrong ppl is much higher. I mean nice track record they have of losing stuff. I posted some details in the other thread about Puto

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Zabardast: *
...I think this is Mr Putin's political rhetoric to pitch the sale of 10 billion dollar arms including N-submarines to India...
[/QUOTE]

Wow, the Muslim Burning Hindus are spending this much money just to keep the Bangaldeshis in check :)

Yea Muslim Burning Hindus ko sharam sai chuloo bhar pani mai doob kar mar jana chaihay :)

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Chaltahai: *
Fraud: India doesn't have US special ops forces on ground. And FBI and CIA teams roaming the country.
[/QUOTE]
Really?

Frankly I don't think so... and what about all the satellites up there, u think the US is stupid enough to let a conflict ridden country like India let go freely with nukes. They are monitoring India as much as Pakistan, because either side poses as much threat to regional and world peace.

Nice try Pak99, ‘they (ndian) too, they too’, so nothing wrong if US is monitoring pak day in day out. And one of the reasons Putin commented ( and in another similar thread on Putin’s remarks, I posted a link from White House where Bush agreed with Putin, that Pakistan army and its nuclear warheads are a problem to be taken care of), is that a lot of Pak army personnels are cooperating with the ‘terrorists’ and Al-Qaeda that west/Russia has reasons to be more careful : -

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/asia_china/story.jsp?story=358926
With runners and whispers, al-Qa’ida outfoxes US forces
By Robert Fisk
According to the same officer, American security agents in Karachi were looking for the murderers of US journalist Daniel Pearl but there, as in many other cases, they would find their arrest “targets” had fled because of secret support within middle ranks of the Pakistani army.

"We would go with the Pakistanis to a location but there would be no one there because once the middle level of the Pakistani military knew of our plans, they would leak the information. In the North-West Frontier province, the frontier corps is a second-rate army – they are a lot more anti-Western in sentiment than the main Pakistani army.

Watch your backyard, Mr. Putin!

Subscription Required: Report: Al-Qaida Eyes Russian Nukes

**Al-Qaida may be trying to acquire nuclear weapons and weapons-grade materials in Russia through local organized crime gangs, The Washington Times reported Tuesday, citing a U.S. defense source.

“I can’t tell you here that I have evidence that they made use of them. I know they are working on them: The documentation is there,” ** a senior U.S. defense official told the newspaper when asked about al-Qaida attempts to obtain nuclear, biological and chemical weapons.

The official, who was not identifed, said al-Qaida has made several inquiries about obtaining weapons of mass destruction on the Russian black market.

Several recent intelligence reports have also indicated that al-Qaida has considered buying nuclear weapons and materials from Russian gangsters, The Washington Times said. The newspaper said the Federal Security Service once suspected that Sergei Bakhvalov, a leading specialist in extracting plutonium, might have been killed by terrorists who tried to obtain nuclear technologies or equipment from him.

Argumenty i Fakty reported in September that the FSB and Interior Ministry studied such a scenario after Bakhvalov’s death in August but did not attribute the information to either agency. Prosecutors told Interfax at the time that they suspected the killing was linked to Bakhvalov’s business activities. Bakhvalov ran the Kristall scientific research center, which handled a $400,000 contract to supply the Chelyabinsk region with nonferrous metals, Interfax said.

The FSB could not immediately comment about The Washington Times’ report Tuesday.

The Defense Ministry responded by saying security has been tripled at the country’s nuclear arsenals. “Embezzlement or the leak of nuclear weapons from our facilities is impossible,” the ministry’s nuclear security chief, Igor Volynkin, was quoted by Interfax as saying. The ministry has said that suspected terrorists examined the security perimeters at its nuclear facilities twice last year to no avail.

However, while taking pains to secure the country’s nuclear arms, the authorities have done less to ensure security at civil nuclear facilities. As a result, at least a dozen cases of theft of HEU and weapons-grade plutonium have been reported in Russia since 1992.

Ivan Safranchuk, an analyst at the Center for Defense Information, said it was very unlikely that any terrorist organization has gotten hold of a Russian nuclear warhead. A more likely scenario is that terrorists could have obtained enough highly enriched uranium for a bomb by buying small amounts on the black market, he said. But al-Qaida and other terrorist groups probably lack the expertise to build a bomb, he said.