^ in the 1990s, Pakistan army and ISI also supported taliban against indian-backed northern alliance. What does that make them?
They are not supporting them now, what does that make them now? Nawaz Sharif still has soft corner for them, what does that make him now?
They are not supporting them now, what does that make them now? Nawaz Sharif still has soft corner for them, what does that make him now?
How can you claim that? (Now don't give me links to obscure blogs )
There are others who also see the link between Nawaz and militant religious groups.
DAWN.COM | Pakistan | Pakistan buds of optimism amid towering risks
Some analysts also raise concerns about PML-N regaining power in Punjab because they believe he panders to hardliners and has taken a tolerant attitude about the presence of jihadi groups and their charity fronts in the province.
With that logic, the PPP actually gave us the Taliban, for it was Gen. Babur who at that time thought it was pertinent to bring them in the equation to bring peace to Afghanistan.
Good that "Gen." Babur is not leading PPP.
Bad that Nawaz is leading PML.
^ in the 1990s, Pakistan army and ISI also supported taliban against indian-backed northern alliance. What does that make them?
It made them Taliban supporters. Current army leadership is now trying hard to purge such elements from among them.
Pakistan's current internal crisis is the result of Talibanic policies of previous army and ISI personnel like Hamid Gul and Aslam Baig.
I am a ‘conservative religious nationalist’. Does that make me a hardliner? or militant? or taliban?
If it does, I can only attribute that to your allergic attitude towards anything related to religion.
The so called ‘analysts’ are not happy because Nawaz is stupid enough to take a stand against western interests.
By the way, the article you quoted also says,
'In an even bigger canvas, Pakistan’s educated middle class, in the shape of the lawyers’ movement, has for the first time prevailed over vested interests in the political arena.
That is positive. Any leader who stands in the way of building stronger institutions or better governance in Pakistan should now realise he can be called to account."
Please be positive atleast some times!
It made them Taliban supporters. Current army leadership is now trying hard to purge such elements from among them.
Pakistan's current internal crisis is the result of Talibanic policies of previous army and ISI personnel like Hamid Gul and Aslam Baig.
"Hamid Gul served as the director general of Pakistan's Inter Services Intelligence during 1987-89, mainly in the time when Benazir Bhutto was Prime Minister of Pakistan"
"Najam Sethi, the editor of Daily Times sharply rebukes General Beg for his past misadventures into the domain of politics in a recent editorial. He asks the former general to apologize for warning the then Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto off a large area of internal and external policy in 1988. He has also got to apologize to the then Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif for violating an agreed foreign policy decision to send Pakistani troops to Saudi Arabia when Saddam Hussein invaded Kuwait in 1990."
Both of the guys you mentioned were not under control nor appointed by Nawaz Sharif.
They were not in anyone's control. They had their own foreign policy.
That was the biggest problem. They were rogue people. And responsible for present threats.
Re: Nawaz's support of Taliban is security risk to Pak
^ So, now that the army has 'reformed' itself. Nawaz Sharif is not coming into power in foreseeable future and we have NATO fighting for us, you need not worry about militants taking over.
Chill :)
There still are Taliban sympathizers in army and ISI. They give them vital information which help Taliban survive government onslaught.
There is still a risk of militant take over due to these people. Based on Nawaz's past support to these elements, things may get worse if NS comes to power.
We need to realize that war against Taliban is Pakistan's own. I will chill when suicide bombings stop in Pakistan.
I think the thread has started to digress. It was only about Nawaz's sympathy to Taliban and similar conservative voices in Pakistan.
Re: Nawaz's support of Taliban is security risk to Pak
Again, as you said, it is 'Nawaz's PAST support to taliban'.. and as we had 'Army's past support to taliban'.
Anyways, nothing wrong in being conservative? is there? If I am conservative, that doesn't necessarily imply that I support Taliban.
Again, as you said, it is 'Nawaz's PAST support to taliban'.. and as we had 'Army's past support to taliban'.
Anyways, nothing wrong in being conservative? is there? If I am conservative, that doesn't necessarily imply that I support Taliban.
No one is questioning you, so don't pretend to be a victim.
Bottom line is, the Taliban/salafi/wahabi types are BAD PEOPLE for Pakistan. It is wrong to support them. Nawaz sahib has been great to them in the past, and that's the general fear right now.
Now that the PPP govt and Zardari have accomodated the Taliban of Swat to have Sharia Law…by your reasoning Zaradari and Gilani are also Taliban Supporters.…
How can you claim that? (Now don't give me links to obscure blogs )
How can you claim Nawaz is not supporting Taliban or that he doen't have soft corner for them? His past is known to be supportive of them, if anything has changed then you can share it with us here.
Now that the PPP govt and Zardari have accomodated the Taliban of Swat to have Sharia Law...........by your reasoning Zaradari and Gilani are also Taliban Supporters.......................:D
While they still are against fitnah-mongering by Taliban, they think that peace is possible with Taliban. I think they are wrong in this assumption.
Taliban also understand that PML is more to their side than PPP. This is why they targeted Benazir but have never threatened Nawaz or Shujaat.
Again, as you said, it is 'Nawaz's PAST support to taliban'.. and as we had 'Army's past support to taliban'.
Army changed (is changing) people who supported Taliban's jingoism. But Nawaz is still the same person.
[quote]
Anyways, nothing wrong in being conservative? is there? If I am conservative, that doesn't necessarily imply that I support Taliban.
[/quote]
Being conservative or liberal is relative to society. So it was my mistake to use terms from Western lexicon and apply them on Pakistani politics.
It is ok for anyone to follow whatever they like. I just don't approve of people who FORCE their opinions on others, and don't hesitate to use violence against civilians to achieve their objectives.
I am against people who create their own armies. Because it causes chaos in society.
I read a piece from Nadeem Paracha in Dawn about how Nawaz and his party are endorsing Taliban and condemning operation against Taliban kharijis.
It reinforces the claim that PMLN is a security risk to Pakistan due to their support to Taliban.
DAWN.COM | Columnists | PML-N?s losing grace
While the PML-N party leader has been demonstrating an impressive degree of maturity by willing to have regular meetings with Prime Minster Gilani and the many western diplomats who now come knocking on his door in Raiwind, I simply can’t figure out the antics of some so-called leading lights of the PML-N whose cheap populist posturing sometimes borders on the verge of utter reactionary hogwash.
For example, sometimes when I hear otherwise respected PML-N men like Chaudary Nisar, Saad Rafiq and a few others speak on the Taliban issue, I have to remind myself that the two men are part of PML-N and not, say, US-flag-burning protesters of the Islami Jamiat-i-Tuleba! The PML-N poses the only real democratic challenge to the federal-level electoral enormity of the PPP, and it won’t be an overstatement to suggest that Mian Nawaz Sharif can well be elected the next Prime Minister of Pakistan.
Thus, how is a pro-democracy, mainstream Pakistani to react when he sees a potential PM surrounded by politicians who sound like those irritating, hysterical cranks that we come across on TV screens, spouting out gibberish inspired by intellectual swindlers such as Turkish author and (pseudo)-scientist, Harun Yahya, and similar demagogic conspiracy mongers? These masters of doom negate all hope, and Pakistanis are known only to vote for hope, not doom.
Theirs is scary stuff, indeed. And even scarier are suggestions coming from some quarters in the congested corridors of Pakistani politics who claim that this is a well thought-out ‘balance’ conceived by the PML-N leadership. Meaning, the Sharif brothers will continue playing the moderate role and receiving western guests and the PM, whereas the second-tier leadership of the party will be allowed to continue playing the role of bludgeoning right-wing radicals. If this is the strategy, the PML-N will again end up alienating the smaller provinces, particularly Sindh and Balochistan, which are clearly not charmed by rightwing rhetoric.
I would not like to believe that the party’s strategy could be this myopic because it plans to reach out to all Pakistanis everywhere and not just the conservative trading classes of central Punjab. But the fire that is exhaled by certain PML-N leaders implies that maybe the party is still not sure about going along with the otherwise obvious consensus among the people of Pakistan who seem to agree on the eradication of the threat posed by the Taliban.
Re: Nawaz's support of Taliban is security risk to Pak
Nice attempt by Anti PML-N factions, but they just have to try harder and pick right issues to do so.. so far this allegation that NS supports Taliban ( i..e Fazalullah and Baitulah) is just wild imagination of Jyalaas and/or MQMers.... anyway if PPP voter is that much worried about the supporters of these Talibans then they should look into their own backyard... molana diesel urf illama hub-e-iqatadaaar janab fazull rehman is openly issuing statments against the army operation and he and his men are continously asking for a peace agreement.. giving these thugs a way out.. on the other hand NS has giving his support to the Army and stood behind the govt.. so who is supporting who.
If PPP feels like to support the military action against these thugs, they need to tackle these diesels and other first.. but i guess to divert the attention from them.. they started with this funny allegations.. is that you can come up with...
Like i said, if Khoji and others want to defame him, so that they can digest their food, they need to come up with better issues and allegations. making funny statement just doesn't make any sense
hanibal:
It is more than just MQM or PPP. Problem is with PMLN’s ideological foundations.
Nawaz’s history and recent statements from senior PMLN leaders prove that PMLN and Nawaz have soft corner for elements who are currently threatening Pakistan.
In their support to Taliban, these PMLN leaders are in no way different from Playboy Mullah Imran or Jamat e Islami.
Here is a sample. Even after Taliban’s flouting peace deal with government in Swat, PMLN’s Asif STILL thinks that it is America’s war, that government is doing it for money, and that government should do more “talks” with Taliban kharijis.
http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2009\05\14\story_14-5-2009_pg7_7
In a hard-hitting speech, PML-N’s Khawaja Asif accused the government of launching the military operation on the US dictate “in order to earn dollars” and insisted the government should try a negotiated settlement of the dispute.
Sherry Rahman just turned Taliban a few days ago!
In the end, everyone will be a Taliban except the Pir of Karachi (sitting in London)
Looks like same charachter from "Star Trek'. If you are Data/Spock, then I am Dr. MecCoy and Scotty:)