[quote]
Originally posted by yOuNgBrAt:
** Or maybe because they realized the flaws in their own religion/culture? If not, can you answer me why many Hindu/Indian prefer to be called or "converts" to Atheism after living in the west or getting a tid bit of education? I'm not lying, it’s a well known fact!
**
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There is nothing wrong with converts to Atheism..just as u believe there is God they can equally believe there is no God since nobody has seen God. Actually they can believe in Atheism because their culture and religion allows them to explore and think. Nobody will kill them if they don't follow Hinduism...i take this as a strength of a religion and culture. Btw, i have never seen Hindu in foreign land convert to any religion.
Being a good and moral person and having respect for fellow human beings is more important than trying to please God..God by defination is a creater and therefore he doesn't need to be praised, and if does then he is no better than ordinary human being, therefore he is not God.
[This message has been edited by Rani (edited August 24, 2001).]
They tried very hard but didn’t succeed and that gave rise to Khalsa and Marathas…Aurangzed use to weigh sewa mun janau (hindu thread) before he sat for dinner.
p.s. What has hate to do with history…u want to deny the true history that is why u are accusing me of hate..
[This message has been edited by Rani (edited August 24, 2001).]
[quote]
Originally posted by Rani:
** You make no sense...there are no millions of converts in US and Europe to reach the level of conversion in India they will have to keep going for at least million years . A few black convert going back to their roots or spouces of muslims force to convert for love will not do the job.**
[/quote]
The point here is not one converted or a million convered the point is ** WHY ** converted.
And European or US or any country for that matter gives very diffrenet picture compared to your history books.
P.S there are well above 1 million converts in US. And the numbers in Europe were quite high ratio wise given the population of Europe. Half of Africa converted. You can distort your own history but you cannot distort world history.
[This message has been edited by Abdali (edited August 24, 2001).]
[quote]
Originally posted by Rani:
** They tried very hard but didn't succeed and that gave rise to Khalsa and Marathas...Aurangzed use to weigh sewa mun janau (hindu thread) before he sat for dinner.
p.s. What has hate to do with history...u want to deny the true history that is why u are accusing me of hate..
[This message has been edited by Rani (edited August 24, 2001).]**
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Just to let you know Islamic rule has been in India for 1000 years Khalsa is only 500 years old. 500 years were enough for muslims to do the job. To remind you unlike hindus who wiped out bhuddism from India Islam did no such thing with hindus.
"...... Mahmud's invasions have shaped the popular image
of how penetrated south asia,but they are only part of the
story.
It is also true that the muslim sultans who succeeded him
included tolarant princes like Shamsuddin Iltmtmish and
the great moughal emperor AKBAR. And that the vast
majority of south asia , Muslims--who now compose
nearly one third of the population of India, Pakistan and
Bangladesh--- were converted to islam by the words
of missionries rather than the sword of the conquerors."
[quote]
Originally posted by Rani:
** They tried very hard but didn't succeed and that gave rise to Khalsa and Marathas...Aurangzed use to weigh sewa mun janau (hindu thread) before he sat for dinner.
p.s. What has hate to do with history...u want to deny the true history that is why u are accusing me of hate..
[This message has been edited by Rani (edited August 24, 2001).]**
[/quote]
its strange that 'they didn't succeed'... they may not have succeeded if they had ruled for 1 or 2 years... but they ruled for more than 900 years... you are making wrong assumptions.
[quote]
Originally posted by Rani:
** Well..because of that slavery lots of Hindus like yourself became muslims. People didn't become muslims because a group of Mullahs with lots of money travelled from middle east to convert and lured them. .
Millions of people don't convert unless they are faced with death or dire consequences.**
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Rani u tell me then how did this sikhism came into act? is it becasue of some sikh mullahs who made u hindu people convert?
if that is correct then how come ur elders r struggling for a different state(khalistan)?
im pretty much sure u dont know the answer!
let me tell u why... bcz ur elder know that future of ur so called religion is not safe in hindu india and ur religious belongings r not safe!!
these same hinduz robbed ur golden temple with the help of white rulers at that time.
RANI YOU MUST BE totally insane TO MAKE THIS STATEMENT.THEN YOU BECAME sIKH FROM REG.hINDU 500 YRS AGO B/C THERE WERE no sikh BEFORE 500 YRS AGO & THEREFORE all sikhs are unwilling ,forced coerced hindu converted by your guru under threat of kirpan !!!
VERY GOOD ,KEEP UP THE GURUS NAAM PUTREE.
AND IF YOU ARE IN DOUBT MUSLIM DIDNT START AS BILLION.SIKH CONVERSION WAS JUST AS SMALL OR BIG AS ISLAM IN EARLY PHASE .600 A.D. FOR MUSLIMS & 1400 FOR SIKHS .
FYI this is wot i am trying to tell this rani Who is trying to elucidate the hindu religion but not telling us the truth that she was a hindu too and she was forced to become a Sikh!!!!!!!!
wot do u have to say now rani?
was it mulims who forced u to become sikh lol.... i mean come onn who were they then?
[quote]
Originally posted by Changez_like:
** its strange that 'they didn't succeed'... they may not have succeeded if they had ruled for 1 or 2 years... but they ruled for more than 900 years... you are making wrong assumptions.
**
[/quote]
They didn't have too much power for many years they had to rely on Hindus to keep themselves in power. Akbar married Rajput Princess to forge alliances with the Rajput rulers. Conversion is the most at areas near Kyber pass and least in south. Most of the forcible conversion happened in era of Shahjanan and Aurgangzeb and that was the reason they were evicted. Had they tried ealiar they would have been packed of pretty fast.
English realized this and never tried to impose their religion on anybody.
no i think mulims forced her to become sikh!
am i right rani lol?
No idea what u all are babbling about...don't laugh sooo much because u have absolutely no idea what u are talking about. Conversion to Sikhism was/is purely voluntary. Do u realize that elder son in many Hindu Punjabi families was made Sikh by the parents. Many members of my extended family are Hindus..my grand mother was from a Hindu punjabi family. Most Hindus in punjab and many other places attend Gurudawara regularly and believe in Guru Granth Sahib. If u go to Golden Temple at least half of the congregaration is made up of Hindu or non-Sikh punjabis. We don't force or try to convert anybody because according to Sikhism their are many paths to reach God not just one path..
Sorry to disappoint u, i can change my religion to whatever i want to nobody in my community will care...i feel so lucky to have a freedom of choice..for which our Gurus and my ancestors gave up their lives.
[This message has been edited by Rani (edited August 25, 2001).]
[quote]
Originally posted by rvikz:
**Rewriting Indian History,the author prefaces, "might well be called an
antithesis" for it questions many of the assumptions in the "standard"
treatises by Euro-centered colonialist historians and their imitations by
Indian Marxist writers.
Gautier focuses mainly on the Muslim period of India's history. "Let it be
said right away: the massacres perpetrated by Muslims in India are
unparalleled in history, bigger than the holocaust of the Jews by the Nazis;
or the massacre of the Armenians by the Turks; more extensive even than the
slaughter of the South American native populations by the invading Spanish
and Portuguese."**
[/quote]
[quote]
Originally posted by Rani:
** Well..because of that slavery lots of Hindus like yourself became muslims. People didn't become muslims because a group of Mullahs with lots of money travelled from middle east to convert and lured them. .
Millions of people don't convert unless they are faced with death or dire consequences.**
[/quote]
Rani, that doesn't seems to work on you and you only. I wonder why?
Our friends are good entertaining. Did they rule over Delhi for around 800 years/not 100 years/ or Muslim invaders rule over all of us for these years.
We Indians lost power, though our these Indian & Pak Muslim friends’ forefathers were a little more coward that they give up to the religion of invaders, not only that they adopted them as their forefathers, without going thru a DNA test.
Now the question is if those invaders were kind people? Off course we cannot compete the Pak historians. They need some reasons for existence.
[quote]
Originally posted by Rani:
** There is nothing wrong with converts to Atheism..just as u believe there is God they can equally believe there is no God since nobody has seen God. Actually they can believe in Atheism because their culture and religion allows them to explore and think. Nobody will kill them if they don't follow Hinduism...i take this as a strength of a religion and culture. Btw, i have never seen Hindu in foreign land convert to any religion.
Being a good and moral person and having respect for fellow human beings is more important than trying to please God..God by defination is a creater and therefore he doesn't need to be praised, and if does then he is no better than ordinary human being, therefore he is not God.
[This message has been edited by Rani (edited August 24, 2001).]**
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You for the very first time right about hindus changing from hinduism to Atheism as they never believed in hand made gods at the first place.
It doesn't sound much a exploring for the truth as it is under your nose but can't see it.
Here is an example for you Rani:
Your are told that their is a bomb in your office. Would like to stay until they prove it that their is a bomb or you will run for your life?
Rani said: "Being a good and moral person and having respect for fellow human beings is more important".
Answer: Rani, this is what Islam teachs us.
Rani said: "God by defination is a creater and therefore he doesn't need to be praised, and if does then he is no better than ordinary human being, therefore he is not God."
Answer: Yes God is our creater and Angels worshiped him and then he made Adam and told him to worship the same God. Now all the religion respect that apart from hindus.
That is true about us ruling over Delhi for that long period of time. What I don't seem to understand is that why do you have to use our name (Pakistani) with your own (hindu) qualities...????
That is true about us ruling over Delhi for that long period of time. What I don't seem to understand is that why do you have to use our name (Pakistani) with your own (hindu) qualities...????**
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