Muslim Ummah and Khilafat

Society Pakistan & World Affairs
1

asalamalaikum

the Muslim Ummah, all Muslim countries, all Muslims shud unite, with a centralised govt, a Khilafat, which would enforce true Shariah, Islamic law. one day inshallah..

doesnt mean we as Muslims want to take over the world or we want to persecute non Muslims…Islam is a just and peaceful religion that teaches tolerance and love for all of humanity

a Muslim country or force shud not be against another. this is the true spirit of Islam. we take pride in our ethnicities, we’re patriotic and love our country and our people. but we don’t believe in nationalism as a healthy ideology, as our Prophet (saw) taught us not to..all Muslims are equal and shud love each other for Allah swt

when Pak govt helped US against Afghanistan we were against it. when the Wana operations were happenning, we were of the view that Pak army shud not have been sent there against our Muslim brothers in Wana. we dont want Pak to send its army to Iraq.

basically, we cant stand Muslims fighting against Muslims no matter who they are. we call for unity among all Muslims

the nationalists put Pakistan first. so does Musharraf. we don’t. we say, we are ready to sacrifice ourselves and our country for the sake of Allah swt if its in the best interest of the Ummah and Islam.

as Muslims we look out for each other’s interests, not fight for our own interests…we dont believe in ethnic organisations like Arab League for example that r only based on the interests of one ethnicity.. coz whats the point? coz everything shud revolve around Islam and the whole Ummat’s good…

a lot of, the majority of, Muslims do have this feeling at the individual, personal level…

Bhutto believed in this idea. Qadafi supported this idea. Some other Muslim leaders supported it too. Iran has been sympathetic to this too.

at the international level tho, which political force can we align ourselves with, that follows this agenda? what is the political umbrella under which we unite? certainly, not the government of any Muslim country. and certainly not organisations like Al Qaeda either. OIC is dormant. the Muslim world today needs leadership for the Ummah but where is this leadership going to emerge from and how?

2

Walaikum Assalam

A very good idea indeed and this is how is should be..... but certainly there are many opinions regarding how this aim can be achieved.

And after workout of weeks my solution lies with the activation and more & more participation of Tableeghi Jammat.

Without any intentions of argument, I am quite convinced that they can be the best solution provider, keeping in mind the fact that the six points of TJ are those which are quite basic and non-controversial from many aspects thats why we can see people from all round the globe coming to Raiwand and TJ going all over the globe.

Keep other thing in mind too, if we are not into one branch of Deen like Tableegh, Jihad, Fiqah etc we by no means attack them or dis-respect them.

My vote goes for TJ at present and request guppies to spend some time in it praying to Allah that If Allah wants us to be in TJ we remain here and do as His wishes. U will certainly feel a change

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Re: Muslim Ummah and Khilafat

irem, last month we had a detailed discussion about the validity of the concept of having one islamic ummah. guppies discusssed the concept in detail. i thought u may find that discussion interesting and that it may answer some of your questions. here is the link to that thread.

http://www.gupistan.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=155950

4

Irem: I actually started a thread asking some questions regarding this but not that many people replied so here it is:

Can someone explain to me what role would UMMAH play in the 21st century. Does UMMAH include shiite's and other off shoots of Islam or is it exclusive to sunnis only? And why would /should muslim nations opt for UMMAh now? What benefit (economic,cultural, educational etc) would they get out of UMMAH? Is UMMAH concept like EU, or is it strictly for religion purposes?
What is the operating model of UMMAH?
What is the governance structure?
Do the rich (material wealth) countries have veto powers?
Does the UMMAH change the national flags and country names to UMMAH?
Who becomes the head of UMMAH? How is he chosen? What are the minimum requirements for a UMMAH King, prince, PM, president etc.. What are the minimum qualifications, age requirements for the UMMAH leader.

What if one state within UMMAH decides to invade another state within UMMAH (Afgan tribes for example or Iraq-IRan, Kuwait-Iraq conflicts as an example). How would that be resolved, Does UMMAH have a NATO like army or, all armies are merged in to one. How would UMMAH resolve a ethnic cleansing issue, for instance Sudan with Janjaweed (Arab background) killing Black Sudanese?
Would UMMAH have common currency and would it be floated or fixed (as in chinese, Yaun)?

Lastly is the UMMAH concept philosophical or has it been tested in modern times starting from 1970 onwards, excluding the Taliban experiment.

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hey, salams, thank you for the replies guys,

Sheikh ji,

I believe in the Ummah because after whatever little knowledge I have of Islam, that is the only thing that makes sense to me as the RIGHT thing. UNITY. ALL MUSLIMS R BROTHERS. thats it. and all the answers to ur questions lie in this thought. yes everyone who is Muslim is part of it and we must all be unified. the central khilafat shud resolve all conflicts. the answers to all the logistical questions u have posed can be forumulated thru the consensus of all muslim countries.

the basic pt is just that no Muslim should fight against another Muslim. we should all help each other and work towards the betterment of each other.

as for it being an unrealistic concept; who could have that thought the pre-jahaliya arabia could be turned into civilised arabia? ISLAM made it happen. we can still achieve this. but Muslims need to agree on this.

we can follow the model of the Islamic Caliphate during the llife of our Prophet (saw) and the 4 caliphs after him (saw).

phoenixdesi, thanks for the link :k: btw u can merge these threads if u want :slight_smile:

ophiolites good points abt TJ - but hasnt TJ totally separated itself from all forms of politics?

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How come no one can answer my questions. I take it that maybe Ummah is just another word that has lost its meaning.

7

Here is a concept. All humanity is brothers. Regardless of religion. Chew on that for the bit.

8

oh the concept is not dead or anything, but its not even been a week since it got discussed to a great extent. thats all.

your questions are quite comprehenisve waisay and nearly take on all the aspects that only arose whilst people started arguing over that topic.

a lot of the issues are still unanswered, and you could open a new thread to get them answered esp. the technical ones like common currency, governance structure and army.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Matsui: *
Here is a concept. All humanity is brothers. Regardless of religion. Chew on that for the bit.
[/QUOTE]

Here is another concept. All humanity is same, regardless of caste. Chew on that for a bit.

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^ exactly, castism is a scourge on humanity like bygone notions like Ummah and like. Let’s chew together!!! :k:

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Matsui: *
Here is a concept. All humanity is brothers. Regardless of religion. Chew on that for the bit.
[/QUOTE]

Matsui,
First of all welcome back from St thomas ( I miss that island). I totally agree with you regarding humanity is brothers (we have more in common with the earth worms according to DNA structure), all living beings are basically the same in my opinion.

The reason I posted this is because I keep hearing UMMAH, UMMAH in the relig and in general when surfing, so out of curiousity wanted to know if someone has actually given this a serious thought or it just another fancy term to rile up muslims.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by SheikhSahab: *
Irem: I actually started a thread asking some questions regarding this but not that many people replied so here it is:

Can someone explain to me what role would UMMAH play in the 21st century. Does UMMAH include shiite's and other off shoots of Islam or is it exclusive to sunnis only?
[/QUOTE]

ISlam is applicable today as it was 1400 years ago. How does time make any difference on how people live together 1400 years ago people interacted and socialised and today they do the same. Only difference today is the development of technology and islam more than encourages technology. ISlamic state is for all muslims and non muslims.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by SheikhSahab: *
And why would /should muslim nations opt for UMMAh now? What benefit (economic,cultural, educational etc) would they get out of UMMAH? Is UMMAH concept like EU, or is it strictly for religion purposes?
What is the operating model of UMMAH?
What is the governance structure?
[/QUOTE]

Muslim countries since the destruction of islamic state in 1924 have never had such a turbulent situiation where they have no voice or any effect on the world stage. The situation today is probably the worst in history. How can anyone say the muslims do not need an islamic state today. Islam is not about benefit its about what is right and also as muslims establishing the islamic state is a duty on us. We not doing it for economic benefit, even though this will be a natural outcome of having a combind army an administration structure which will be the same over the state saving billions again. Also with the resources and manpower available to the state it will be self sufficent it has all the minerals and resources available to it. The detail of the structure of the state has been discussed before on gupshup you can search for it.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by SheikhSahab: *
Do the rich (material wealth) countries have veto powers?
Does the UMMAH change the national flags and country names to UMMAH?
[/QUOTE]

There no rich country poor country mentality, there are wilayahs (provencies) The khalifh when he makes decision it is after he has consulted his council who are made up of experts from the state. There is no national flags because nationalism is haram concept similar to racism.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by SheikhSahab: *
Who becomes the head of UMMAH? How is he chosen? What are the minimum requirements for a UMMAH King, prince, PM, president etc.. What are the minimum qualifications, age requirements for the UMMAH leader.
[/quote]

This topic has also been discussed many time if you do a search on guppshup you should find the information. Just briefly some of the criteria to become a khalifh are that person should be muslim,male, sane, mature,just, freeman.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by SheikhSahab: *
What if one state within UMMAH decides to invade another state within UMMAH (Afgan tribes for example or Iraq-IRan, Kuwait-Iraq conflicts as an example). How would that be resolved, Does UMMAH have a NATO like army or, all armies are merged in to one.
[/quote]

The armed forces have a stucture which is applied across the state. So for example pakistan has an armed forces with battalions based across the country. They follow the structure in place. Similarly in islamic state the armed forces follow structure with the amir of jihad as the leader of armed forces if one wiliyah decided to invade or attack another in your scenario this would be a rebellion which had no authority and would need to be stopped.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by SheikhSahab: *
How would UMMAH resolve a ethnic cleansing issue, for instance Sudan with Janjaweed (Arab background) killing Black Sudanese?
[/quote]

Ethnicity or nationalism would be refuted and removed from the beliefs of some muslims this concept is totally forbidden and is and never was a part of islam it is a foriegn concept which needs to be rooted out immediatly. Secondly the situation in Sudan is not simply ethnic based as media would like to portray, the US has been suporting the SPLA to fight the sudan government for years and also the EU has withheld 400 million from sudan. You cannot tell sudan to stop this problem but at same time you support rebel terrorist SPLA by giving them millions and weapons and also withold 400 million because sudan is not rich country.
Question should be why all of a sudden the media attention is on Sudan what are the western countries really after in Sudan is it really humanitarian as they say if so where was they in rwanda, or is there something else in Sudan which intrests them?

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by SheikhSahab: *
Would UMMAH have common currency and would it be floated or fixed (as in chinese, Yaun)?

[/quote]
Yes the islamic state would have a common currency, its value is fixed because it is based on gold. Not on the paper money which today is worth something and tommorow worth nothing.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by SheikhSahab: *
Lastly is the UMMAH concept philosophical or has it been tested in modern times starting from 1970 onwards, excluding the Taliban experiment.
[/QUOTE]

The khilafah is very real it has lasted 1400 years and it will return to a state near you. This concept of has it worked in modern times has been answered by previous answer.

13

Another aspect to the problem is that for over 1000 years, even whilst Khilafah existed the Muslims still managed to fragment into many nations.

Take the Muslim world in 1800. The Uthmani Khalifat existed, with its borders stretching from the Balkans to Algeria. And yet Egypt and Algeria, despite lying within the borders of the Khilafat, maintained their own armies and ran their own state, their own foreign affairs.... When Algeria was invaded and taken over by France in 1830, the Khalifat took no action at all once the local Dey's forces were defeated.

Then you had Tunisia and Morocco, which were Muslim nations that whilst nominally accepting the Sultan in Istantanbul as being the Khalif, in practice basically ignored the Khalifat. Again, when they fell to France, the Khalifat took no action.

The Mughal Empire in India too reflected this status. The Mughals acknowledged the Sultan in Istanbul as Khalif, but otherwise effectively ignored him. In fact, Emperor Ackbar of the Moghals briefly attempted to ally with the Shah of Persia in an attempt to attack the Khalifah, overthrow him, and declare a new Khalifat in Delhi. (the Shah backed out, so this scheme fell apart).

This isn't even a recent phenomenon. The Muslim world's fragmentation stretches back over 1000 years - Muslim states in central asia, in India, in Indonesia and Malaysia, were only nominally subjects of the Khalifah and in practise were fully autonomous nations. In fact, 900 years ago ... there were 3 Khalifahs! Sunni Khalifahs were seated in Baghdad and in Cordoba, and there was a Shia Khalif seated in Cairo....

The Muslim world has been digging itself into the pit of nationalism for centuries upon centuries - this isn't a recent sickness, it's been going on since well before 9/11, since before colonialism...

Our history is in fact full of Khalifs who, too, have fallen victim to nationalism, as they took no action to help Muslim lands outside their own borders. It's a long, long sickness from which Muslims have been dying for over 1000 years.

A sickness that would only end when all Muslim lands subject themselves fully to a single central authority for foreign policy, domestic policy, defence and economy.

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thanks for the replies guys

interesting thoughts

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:yawn:

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I had a chance to stay with them for few days with them and according to my analysis TJ are keeping themselves away from politics on the fact that Ummat has never been brougth on one platform on political grounds due conflicts of interests.

What TJ try to do is to provide ummah a platform without any conflicts of interests from where they can rule the world as Sahaba did.

Irem u know more than 70% of ummah don’t offer namaz. If any doubts go any village of Punjab or interior Sindh and u will realize whats goin on. Namaz is Allah’s one of most important hukum, Our Prophet
:saw: 's last words are regarding namaz. Do u think ummah will be protected and supported just as Sahaba were, when they r not even on ready to offer 5 times namaz.

Jab Allah kay ahkam zinda hon gay to Allah ki madad aay gee

17

ophiolites u r right there, but a lot of times its not these ppl’s fault, nobody has taught them how to pray many times…
maybe Tj activists shud go to these villages and teach ppl..it will be such a great thing to do
btw i have had the good fortune to know some ppl from Tableeghi Jamaat too and i really like these people :mash: :slight_smile:

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Yes they r being sent to distant places like we were sent to Pakistan’s border with Afghanistan six hours away from chitral
Indeed they r doing good work n i wish i can be more with them