Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

[psyah]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

@S02

It probably has more to do with the pain, medications, and longer recovery time after csections, than it has anything to do with actual human emotions.

If you actually read the article it talks about subconscious hormonal releases … something that is not in their sphere of intended reactions … But something that happens at a biological level.

[psyah]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

@khattichic

Psyah Bhai, I respect you, I really do, and I had no issues at comprehending this study, nor your response to it. But the fact of the matter is, there is no way to conclusively say that ALL csection mothers are apathetic towards their baby’s cry response times vs mothers who delivered vaginally. That just doesn’t make any sense. Doesn’t this study say that 12 women were selected for the study…12?! 12!!! That’s a pretty ridiculously low number wouldn’t you say? Out the millions of women in this world, 12 are going to are going to decisively prove this point? Sorry, I’m not buying it.

And as far as the “man card” goes, unfortunately their is NO way any man can EVER comprehend the experience of childbirth (and the feelings, pains, emotions etc that entail)…that’s not be being facetious, that’s Allah ki khudrat. The comment wasn’t a stab at you personally. And yes, you did sound condescending, but rest assured, had it been any other male poster, my response, and I’m fairly certain, that of the others would have been he exact same.

Like SO2 pointed out, there are away too many other varying factors like pain meds, postpartum blues, hormonal fluctuation etc that are more realistic contributing factors, not solely csection vs vaginal deliveries.

Yes, this is true … It is an incredibly small number … And this is the sort of criticism that studies like this deserve … But to accuse the study of saying something else is wrong too. If anything this study demands further study in this area …

[psyah]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

@Gemini_the_Great

woww.. speechless!

whats next research about.. a mother who gave birth at home is much better than the one who chose to go to the hospital?

Home births are on the increase … Btw

[psyah]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

@Paheli00

This is ridiculous. I’m not even sure what the point is other than making women who have a CS feel bad .

Science studies are not designed to make people feel bad.

[psyah]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

@queer

my issue is with religion being dragged in to explain something that needs no voodoo justifications. nice try but not thanks.

and so what if the post-partum mothering instinct may be a little suppressed for the first few days in those moms who didn’t give vaginal birth? it is not like a tiger will show up and eat their babies while she turns the other way. C-sections happen for medical reasons (well maybe not in india and pakistan), not every baby and mom will make it alive/healthy via the birthing canal route.

Well it seems that what is natural and intended by nature is better for us, but where there are situations when intervention is required then our religion requires us to employ those too. I feel C-section should remain a medical procedure when the need arises and not a choice … I don’t hold it against people if they make that a choice … Who am I to judge people? All I think is that we should study the effects of every intervention that we do especially those that become alternatives to natural ways rather than necessary interventions for medical emergencies. It will equip the mothers more about making informed decisions. It has nothing to do with religion, my stance stems from the strong belief that we are in a well calibrated system and that Allah (SWT) does not put burdens on people and things that may seem unfair or harsh are actually deeply rooted to a larger Wisdom that we cannot always see.

[kali_billi]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

Ladies, listen to Psyah he seems to be speaking from experience.

[queer]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

while on this topic, i’d come across some article not too recently but about the difference in beneficial bacteria in the GI tract and skin of babies who were delivered vaginally vs. C-sections, and the first bunch had “better” populations (with stronger immune system implications) coz they swallow a bunch of stuff from the mom on their way out.

and come on, just coz he or anyone else is male doesnt mean we can’t post about births. (we’ve taken part in at least one for sure).

[Demilitarize]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

@khattichic

There are some things men in general should just not even presume to comment on. And the physical act of childbirth is one of them. I don’t care how many “studies” are conducted by some Y chromosome lab rat, until you have a uterus of your own and grow and sprout a human life from it, it’s best to not go there.

bravo!!!

[psyah]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

@queer

while on this topic, i’d come across some article not too recently but about the difference in beneficial bacteria in the GI tract and skin of babies who were delivered vaginally vs. C-sections, and the first bunch had “better” populations (with stronger immune system implications) coz they swallow a bunch of stuff from the mom on their way out.

and come on, just coz he or anyone else is male doesnt mean we can’t post about births. (we’ve taken part in at least one for sure).

That is interesting too, first I heard of it. Also, prolactin hormone produced at labour stimulates milk production … So it seems labour itself is playing a huge role.

[raania]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

So women who can’t go on labor on their own or suffer from high bp/GD, placental abruption, fetal distress should just take a hike and let the baby die in utero and risk their lives and die themselves coz God forbid they won’t be able to feed their baby since labor hasn’t come about!
What an extremely retarded notion! There are women who go through hours of labor to end up in c-secs as well as c-sec moms who have fed just fine.
Corelation does not imply causation!

[prototype]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

^women who die during child-labour are Shaheed and should think again before heading to C sec to save their life .. once in a lifetime chance

[Demilitarize]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

^ I was convinced I was going to die on the c sec table when they took me in after hours of labor pain

[mirage]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

@khattichic

There are some things men in general should just not even presume to comment on. And the physical act of childbirth is one of them. I don’t care how many “studies” are conducted by some Y chromosome lab rat, until you have a uterus of your own and grow and sprout a human life from it, it’s best to not go there.

:k:

psyah bhai, you might just want to encourage the vb mothers more, i m just looking at the positive side of it, but it hurts.

[mirage]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

@Demesne

^ I was convinced I was going to die on the c sec table when they took me in after hours of labor pain

[S_Punk]

The article only took into account elective c-section decisions. Not emergency c-sections. I think.

[psyah]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

@raania

So women who can’t go on labor on their own or suffer from high bp/GD, placental abruption, fetal distress should just take a hike and let the baby die in utero and risk their lives and die themselves coz God forbid they won’t be able to feed their baby since labor hasn’t come about!
What an extremely retarded notion! There are women who go through hours of labor to end up in c-secs as well as c-sec moms who have fed just fine.
Corelation does not imply causation!

Peace raania

You yourself raise the notion, but then call it retarded …

[psyah]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

@prototype

^women who die during child-labour are Shaheed and should think again before heading to C sec to save their life .. once in a lifetime chance

Childish behaviour prototype

[psyah]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

@mirage

:k:

psyah bhai, you might just want to encourage the vb mothers more, i m just looking at the positive side of it, but it hurts.

I think both VD and CSD come with their own issues and where VD may be more painful CSD may be longer to recover from … I’m just amazed that there seem to be things that we try to make easier for ourselves but do not realise that we might be making another set of problems … Only when CSD is taken to be a choice, otherwise when it is necessary to do CSD then it has to be done.

[psyah]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

@S_Punk

The article only took into account elective c-section decisions. Not emergency c-sections. I think.

Agreed … The concern should be around elective CSD, rather than necessary CSDs.

[Paheli00]

Re: Mothers are more apathetic towards their children if they were CSDs

@psyah

I’m just amazed that there seem to be things that we try to make easier for ourselves but do not realise that we might be making another set of problems … Only when CSD is taken to be a choice, otherwise when it is necessary to do CSD then it has to be done.

1. What are those “set of problems”? As I already stated, what exactly is this “study” proving? Nothing as far as I’m concerned given all the flaws in it.

2. I am a woman who has never been pregnant/given birth. You are a man thus you will never experience pregnancy/labor. Its ridiculous for people like us to pass any type of judgments on women who make choices to make the process of labor/birth easier on themselves. We have no idea what its like to be in that situation physically/psychologically, and neither one of us can really imagine the pain of giving birth.

3. It is up to the pregnant woman and her doctor to decide when a CS is “necessary”. None of us have any right to to ask another woman to justify why she had a CS. For example…one of my close friends had a CS. When probed by nosy people…she simply told most people that she chose it b/c she was too scared of labor. I have no doubt people like you passed judgments on her for her choice. Her real reason? She was raped as a teenager. Thus, the idea of giving birth vaginally and having nurses/docs etc. touching her so intimately and not being in control of her body was traumatic to her. She was seeing a therapist throughout her entire pregnancy to try to get over this and finally, around her due date…after discussing her history/current mental state with her therapist AND OB…everyone agreed that a CS was best in her situation even though there was no physical medical justification for it. My point being that even in cases where we’re being told the CS was “elective”…we may not know the true reason behind it. So by reminding CS moms that they didn’t have a “normal delivery”…we may be doing more harm than good by making them feel that they’re somehow inferior to VD moms.

4. Yes, this specific study was about elective CS. So what? What were the authors criteria for calling a CS “elective”? If I’m not mistaken…they’re not OBs. So is the “elective” designation given by the OBs of those 6 women OR did the authors of the study come up with a certain set of guidelines to decide which CS was elective?

In addition, they did their test 2-4 weeks after delivery. As I said already…whether its elective or not…it’s ridiculous to compare a woman who had major abdominal surgery to a VD mom who may not have had any complications. Without knowing the details of how easy or difficult those VD births were…and whether or not the CS moms had any issues recovering from the CS (ie. infection incision) and were taking strong pain meds…none of us know if the authors of the study were comparing apples to apples.