Lawson should know whats wrong with us. And that he needs to address. Mental toughness!!
Re: 5th ODI: Pakistan v South Africa on 29 Oct 2007 @ Lahore
Lawson should know whats wrong with us. And that he needs to address. Mental toughness!!
and how could Lawson address or cure this problem?....dude it (lack of mental toughness) is in our genes and we depict it every where……from social life to politics (Musharaff succumbing under US pressure every time and politicians giving up against Musharaff and the list simply goes on) to sports….such problems can never be cured by anyone……they become part of national psyche….anyway, I am not trying to be philosophical here…just stating obvious facts…P for Pakistan and P for pathetic both as a nation and as a team…I saw the match and nitni and morkel were not bowling wasim/waqar type spell by any means. We simply threw our wickets away. And afridi wants to be captain. Idiot.
Re: 5th ODI: Pakistan v South Africa on 29 Oct 2007 @ Lahore
and how could Lawson address or cure this problem?....dude it (lack of mental toughness) is in our genes and we depict it every where……from social life to politics (Musharaff succumbing under US pressure every time and politicians giving up against Musharaff and the list simply goes on) to sports….such problems can never be cured by anyone……they become part of national psyche….anyway, I am not trying to be philosophical here…just stating obvious facts…P for Pakistan and P for pathetic both as a nation and as a team…I saw the match and nitni and morkel were not bowling wasim/waqar type spell by any means. We simply threw our wickets away. And afridi wants to be captain. Idiot.
This discussion deserves a seperate thread.
I am only gonna address the sports related pressure and psyche. For national comments we have a seperate forum.
So according to you, we are so f*ked up that our mental toughness cannot be improved? Steve Waugh has himself admitted that he used to succumb under pressure. and in crunch situations thousands things would go around in his head at once which would result in lapse of concentration and panic shots (which incidentally were addressed by none other than Lawson)
Brian Lara, Inzi all learnt to perform under pressure and were not born toughies. So to say we cannot address this issue is not right. Yes there are methods and aussie methods are the toughest ones. Its a difficult job but not an impossible one.
Re: Mental toughness
I think a good start would be to start winning some pressure games for a change. That's perhaps the best way of overcoming mental weakness. No amount of team talk, reading books or counselling can help this problem unless the players have themselves experienced winning tight games. Then self-belief would just naturally develop in our players and things will improve. Another way of doing it would be to watch videos of great matches from the past (e.g. Sharjah 86, WC SF 92, WC Final 92 etc.) where we did well under pressure. There is plenty to learn from how esp. Imran and Miandad handled themselves in tough match situations. Then you have videos of Australian players esp. Steve Waugh etc.
Re: 5th ODI: Pakistan v South Africa on 29 Oct 2007 @ Lahore
This discussion deserves a seperate thread.
I am only gonna address the sports related pressure and psyche. For national comments we have a seperate forum.
So according to you, we are so f*ked up that our mental toughness cannot be improved? Steve Waugh has himself admitted that he used to succumb under pressure. and in crunch situations thousands things would go around in his head at once which would result in lapse of concentration and panic shots (which incidentally were addressed by none other than Lawson)
Brian Lara, Inzi all learnt to perform under pressure and were not born toughies. So to say we cannot address this issue is not right. Yes there are methods and aussie methods are the toughest ones. Its a difficult job but not an impossible one.
Yarr saby, you are right..lets talk about the problem from the cricket standpoint. Sorry for bringing politics into the discussion…..our nation is going through a very tough time and it has affected every person one way or the other…anyway, back to cricket.
Here is the problem …..contrary to popular belief, Pakistani team is actually not bad when it comes to performing in what i call "legitimate" crunch situations. As a matter of fact, a lot of our great performances are scored when we were pushed to the wall…our performance in the recent 20/20 world cup final is an example ( I think we did pretty well in a tough situation)….1992 world cup is another example….a lot of deadly spells bowled by wasim and waqar were actually delivered when all of us had lost all hopes….so, although we are not as good as aussies are in handling tough situations, we are not terrible either and that is why we have never been labeled as chokers in the international cricket. I guess our bigger problem is our ability to create what I call "fake" crunch situations by become “soft & relaxed” as soon as things start looking positive.
Let me give some examples to clarify between legitimate and fake crunch situations. If the wicket is really bad and we are 22 for 4 chasing 210, then it is a legitimate crunch situation. In such cases, we will always fight back and usually win the match (an ideal example would be the karachi test match against india in which we were 0 for 3 and still won the test match). Another example is the Mohail test match - a legitimate crunch situation - but we survived showing great determination. But in a "fake" crunch situation, we will be 210 for 2 chasing 265 and then out of no where we will “enforce” or “invite” problems. And I challenge that most of our defeats that are labeled as choking defeats actually fall under "fake" crunch situations.
Just like a choking mentality, this problem of “getting relaxed” is also psychological. Instead of displaying clinical behavior and finish the match with utmost professionalism, we will somehow start doing experimentation with bat and ball and such experimentation always leads to disaster - at lest in our case. Today, almost everyone including younis, misbah, shoaib malik, afridi, shoaib akthar, rao, simply threw their wickets. There was no need to play those shots. So we really don’t choke, we simply stop breathing on our own. This is the problem and again it goes back to our habits as a nation. But no more social or political discussion. so I will shut my mouth here.
Re: Mental toughness
I think this series officially begins the search for next rescue man. After Miandad and Inzamam, who will be the next to play last and crucial overs?
Re: Mental toughness
but enough of heroics man, we need consistence from all players, cuz when u rely on heroics of one or two ppl and thats what the team is deoending on and that day they cant deliver, u are screwed.
Re: Mental toughness
Granted team needs to play well and in this game they did. The lower order collapsed because no player volunteered to play sensibly. With Inzamam and Miandad, we knew that they will take us to victory land.
You know who we really missed in this match? Razzaq.
Re: Mental toughness
I think a good start would be to start winning some pressure games for a change. That's perhaps the best way of overcoming mental weakness. No amount of team talk, reading books or counselling can help this problem unless the players have themselves experienced winning tight games. Then self-belief would just naturally develop in our players and things will improve. Another way of doing it would be to watch videos of great matches from the past (e.g. Sharjah 86, WC SF 92, WC Final 92 etc.) where we did well under pressure. There is plenty to learn from how esp. Imran and Miandad handled themselves in tough match situations. Then you have videos of Australian players esp. Steve Waugh etc.
good point
its a new team, new captain, just got to get some experience in tight situations under pressure, this is what international cricket is about
from the indian perspective, i remember india were trying to save a test and the series (against england) and this was when dhoni was relatively new to the test arena, and he played a shot in the air like an idiot and the game was done. Now if you look at him, he adapts well and plays to the situation, its all about experience...