Re: Men for SALE!!
Ah, so I guess it's important to take a set of scales to the first meeting. Then you can tell him, 'pop yourself on there darling' and once his weight has been ascertained down to the last pound, then the haggling can begin.
Re: Men for SALE!!
Lol....u know I have never seen such a huge disconnect between whats said on here and what goes on in real life. I think jahez is one of those things that people agree is bad, just to save face......just like those who give jahez do it to save face. :p
PS, not that I agree with the concept of it :D
Re: Men for SALE!!
i guess the idea of jahez is that if you give a BIG jahez with 'pricey' items your daughter will be happier in her in laws house? so money = happiness? as always it boils down to money and nothing else. ridiculous!
Re: Men for SALE!!
Jahez is a beautiful concept. The man is letting a woman join his family, the least she can do is bring some gifts along with her as a gesture of gratitude. And nothing says 'thank you sartaj' like cash, TV'aan, fridge'aan, dressing table'aan etc.
But we first need to calculate how much jahez a man is worth.
I have been through such incidences where the family liked me a lot for rishta purpose... but then the mother of the Mr Potential mentioned how she furnished full apartment for her daughter when she got married last year and gave her blah blah.. expecting my mom to assure her that my family would be doing the same to me... which we could not coz I lost my father few years back, I am the eldest child and me and all siblings are working to earn our living... (the guys side do such things very commonly although the families and the guys were all very educated and broad minded)...
however, I am sooo happy that Allah SWT did not choose such people for me... my rishta is yet to finalise and I hope I get a guy and family that do not give importance to such things and accept me the way I am and of course I plan to be the daughter of their family for life Insha Allah :)
my mom plans to give me clothes, gold, clothes/ gifts to in-laws etc.. Other things (furniture, cash, etc) I am not planning to take along although my mom says she would love to give me as much as possible (I usually end up fighting with her on this issue but she says she want me to have izzat and security for future)... but I really believe that if the guy accepts me for who I am and not for what I bring... I will have more izzat :)
The idea is if they give enough...it will buy their daughter respect. You give a furniture set as a standard but more (in fact you keep giving) if you want lifelong respect and wish for your daughter to be treated with love.
Re: Men for SALE!!
Re: Men for SALE!!
A decent family will say:
"Aap humko apni beti day dain, hamari liyay bas yehi sab sai bari daulat hai." These families specifically tell the girl's family that they neither want nor expect something from them and will discourage the girl's family from spending an obscene amount on the wedding. They're not looking for the showbaazi of a gradiose wedding.
A not so decent family will say either outright we want X, Y and Z from the girl's family. Or the less obvious ones that I've met have said dabbay chuppay alfaaz mai, "aap ki marzi aap apni beti ko kya dayna chahain, lekin hum sai log poochain gay kai aap ki bahu ko kya milla."
In my opinion there's pressure in outright asking or implying that the DIL will be judged and found lacking based on what she does or does not bring with her.
Re: Men for SALE!!
the funny thing is.... if a girl's side put their step down against this jehaiz thing, they are most likely to lose the rishta because there are always other families who are willing to give a lot of jehaiz to get their daughters married and thus meet the demands of guys families and thus help in continuing this jehaiz tradition even in this modern day and age...
Re: Men for SALE!!
definately!
i stumbled upon this in youtube
http://www.youtube.com/user/sachkasafar#p/u/20/w0Jx7niHNL0
all the shows in this series are insightful.
Re: Men for SALE!!
btw the link is to do with jahez/dowery
Re: Men for SALE!!
As long as there are desperate people out there to get their daughters married off ASAP, the concept of Jahaiz will still be there. If all the parents of all the girls decide , no more jahaiz , this practice will end. But as per my vision this is next to impossible for next 500 years that all the parents of all the girls will come to consensus on this issue. So rant on as long as you want.
Re: Men for SALE!!
I was also sold but then I bought myself back by paying my wife's Mehar and all the money in gifts (jewelry etc, and lots and lots of love and support over the last 12+ years of marriage. And I had my wife acknowledge it.
I am not from India though.
Re: Men for SALE!!
it is simple economics - a society where a woman has less value than men will always demand compensation for including her in any venture. saying no to dowry but refusing to grant her full freedom and status equal to men is only marginally better than doing nothing. she'll be made to pay in other ways.
Re: Men for SALE!!
I was also sold but then I bought myself back by paying my wife's Mehar and all the money in gifts (jewelry etc, and lots and lots of love and support over the last 12+ years of marriage. And I had my wife acknowledge it.
I am not from India though.
you paid your wife back in gifts, for money your in-laws spent in your dowry. how is that repayment? her wealth is your wealth.
Re: Men for SALE!!
This is pathetic… uneducated people face more jehaiz problems.. however this is also very common in gud and educated families, although their way of demanding jehaiz is very ‘sophisticated’..
Re: Men for SALE!!
you paid your wife back in gifts, for money your in-laws spent in your dowry. how is that repayment? her wealth is your wealth.
queer - No1, it was a bit of a joke...sorry no smiley left as a hint.
But really, who told you that everything I own is also hers? Islamically, ethically, or any other way you look at it, as a dependant spouse she is entitled for provisions that satisfy all her needs. However, anything beyond that is not hers till I die. During my life its definitely mine and at my discretion to spend. That is why I owe Zakat on it if it meets the requirement. Not her. And that is why the whole subject of inheritance is there.
So if I give her expensive gifts of jewelry or other from that money then it will become hers and not mine.
Do you see my point now?
Re: Men for SALE!!
okay if you want to analyze it, your in laws spent their savings as dowry.
you spent money on your wife's jewellery.
you claim that should be considered repayment.
better run and make some smilies before your wife sees this.
Re: Men for SALE!!
queer - No1, it was a bit of a joke...sorry no smiley left as a hint.
But really, who told you that everything I own is also hers? Islamically, ethically, or any other way you look at it, as a dependant spouse she is entitled for provisions that satisfy all her needs. However, anything beyond that is not hers till I die. During my life its definitely mine and at my discretion to spend. That is why I owe Zakat on it if it meets the requirement. Not her. And that is why the whole subject of inheritance is there.
Your profile lists “USA” on your location. Legally, your wife does have a claim on everything you have acquired since the day you married her. You may want to google “community property”. And if you do a little extra reading, you’ll discover that even common law states generally have a policy of equal distribution of assets….especially if the wife was a housewife. Don’t know about dying but if for some reason there was a divorce, then yes…you wife will get a share of your things.
Although on a total side note, personally I view marriage as a team effort. In my humble opinion, there is no “mine” and “yours” in a committed relationship. Everything is “ours”. So by reading what you wrote….I found it quite sad.
Re: Men for SALE!!
^ Oh yeah...
Re: Men for SALE!!
okay if you want to analyze it, your in laws spent their savings as dowry.
you spent money on your wife's jewellery.
you claim that should be considered repayment.
better run and make some smilies before your wife sees this.
Agree if they spend their life savings, then in my humble opinion they must have been very desperate to do that and in reallity were encouraging such an evil practice where a male and his family hold the girl and her family hostage to pay up or else.
As stated in my case I merely made a sarcastic comment. Here you go :) ...I don't need to make the smilies...they are available free..
Your profile lists “USA” on your location. Legally, your wife does have a claim on everything you have acquired since the day you married her. You may want to google “community property”. And if you do a little extra reading, you’ll discover that even common law states generally have a policy of equal distribution of assets….especially if the wife was a housewife. Don’t know about dying but if for some reason there was a divorce, then yes…you wife will get a share of your things. Although on a total side note, personally I view marriage as a team effort. In my humble opinion, there is no “mine” and “yours” in a committed relationship. Everything is “ours”. So by reading what you wrote….I found it quite sad.
In my humble opinion, a man or a woman (as in arab cultures where the Girls father demands money....many here may not know this) cannot be bought or sold. However, who owns what after marriage based on earnings is a different issue.
IF common law is applied then how and when is the question. I know about common law since I own realestate. So, when does common law come into play?
1. Common law is different in every state. (except 1 where it does not apply at all)
2. Common law comes into play when there are gaps in the matters of dispute as covered by state law.
I can give you a much more detailed response based on actual divorce cases of muslim couples in the US and what law the judge decided to follow but I don't want this thread started to feel their thread got hijacked...
I am sorry that you felt sad. But if a husband really loves his spouse and vice versa, then they can give each other gifts. Maybe just maybe, either one of them can think that YES they have met the others rights and service and are quite satisfied...think about it. It CAN happen. Even in todays materialistic world. Maybe people grow to become less wanting of THINGS...
Peace.
Re: Men for SALE!!
I have heard stories about women being sold as brides by their parents particularly in Peshawar and other parts of NWPF/PKhwa, and just a few days ago, this buddha neighbor from one of our older houses bought a bride from Peshawar! He is about 55, his wife passed away and bought a girl from Peshawar for 6Lakh from her parents. She can’t even speak Urdu, only Pashtu. From what I was told, it was carried out with her consent.
Our Govt hasnt done anything up to date to prevent such things, in fact this has only soared over the last few years with the natural disasters and calamities that have hit the country.